Sign in or signup
Radio Streams
SA Radio
24/7 Radio Stream
VCY America
24/7 Radio Stream

My Favorite Things
Home
NewsSITE
Events | Local | Blogs
New Audio | Video | Clips
Broadcasters
Church Finder
Live Webcasts
Sermons by Bible
Sermons by Category
Sermons by Topic
Sermons by Speaker
Sermons by Date
Staff Picks
CommentsALL -47 sec
Top Sermons
Daily Log
Photos
Stores
Online Bible
Hymnal
Daily Reading
Our Services
Sermon DashboardNEW
Members Only

Breaking News Home | All | Religion | Society | Tech | Choice | SA Newsroom
FRONT PAGE  |  6/26/2019
FRIDAY, DEC 9, 2016  |  267 comments  |  1 commentary
Chapel speaker terms Calvinism ‘Trojan Horse’

A Southern Baptist seminary president said Nov. 29 that Baptists who adopt Calvinistic theology and practice ought to consider joining another denomination.

“I know there are a fair number of you who think you are a Calvinist, but understand there is a denomination which represents that view,” Paige Patterson, president of Southwestern Baptist Theological Seminary, said at the close of Tuesday’s chapel service. “It’s called Presbyterian.”

“I have great respect for them,” Patterson said. “Many of them, the vast majority of them, are brothers in Christ, and I honor their position, but if I held that position I would become a Presbyterian. I would not remain a Baptist, because the Baptist position from the time of the Anabaptists, really from the time of the New Testament, is very different.” ...


CLICK HERE to Read Entire Article
baptistnews.com

|  FOCUS  |  Audio commentaries on this news item | more..
Calvinism, Trojan Horse in SBC • 1,020+
Sean E. Harris | Berean Baptist Church
Play! | RSS

   06/26/19  |  SWBTS responds to sexual abuse lawsuit
   06/26/19  |  Donations to 'religion' declined $2 billion in 2018 after years... • 1 comments
   06/25/19  |  US Continues to Condemn China’s ‘War on Faith’ • 5 comments
   06/25/19  |  National Guard Unit Tries to Ban Christian Scouting Group • 3 comments
   06/25/19  |  Internet preachers rise as more worshipers migrate online • 5 comments
MORE RELATED ( RELIGION ) NEWS | MORE..
   06/23/19  |  SermonAudio Tip: My Favorite Things and the Notification Manager
   05/29/19  |  SermonAudio Tip: Revamped SOLO Sites Make Church Websites Easy • 3 comments
   05/12/19  |  SermonAudio Tip: Unlimited Video Streaming & Embedding • 14 comments
   03/26/19  |  SermonAudio Tip: New SA Partnership With Blue Letter Bible • 9 comments
   03/20/19  |  What is The Foundations Conference? • 11 comments
MORE SPECIAL | MORE..
   06/26/19  |  In Secret, Seniors Discuss ‘Rational Suicide’
   06/26/19  |  Colorado's snowpack is 40 times normal after rare summer... • 2 comments
   06/26/19  |  SWBTS responds to sexual abuse lawsuit
   06/26/19  |  Donations to 'religion' declined $2 billion in 2018 after years... • 1 comments
   06/26/19  |  Mexico first to ratify new North American trade agreement • 1 comments
OTHER RECENT NEWS | MORE..
COMMENTS | show all | add new  
    Sorting Order:  
· Page 1 ·  Found: 267 user comment(s)
News Item12/20/16 7:43 PM
ladybug  Find all comments by ladybug
Narroway,

Keep in mind Acts 2:41, "Then they that gladly received his word were baptized: and the same day there were added unto them about three thousand souls."
Of key importance is 'gladly received' - meaning 'welcome, entertain, embrace'. Also, 'baptized' - meaning ' dip, submerge'. So, all those babies you insist can undergo baptism better understand the gospel and they better be immersed fully in the water. This is the silliness of following your infant baptism, the bible never suggests baptizing infants or anyone else for that matter, for salvation.
Setting that aside, I do apologize to others for the repetition in asking the question concerning the doctrines of grace and their Author. Please take notice of how 'narroway/bwarely' refuses to give a direct answer to this question. This is why I keep asking, to force him/her to deal with the hypocrisy of stating Christ taught 'Calvinism' and all the other silly claims made.

267

News Item12/20/16 5:19 PM
ladybug  Find all comments by ladybug
Narroway, Did the doctrines of grace originate with God the Spirit? Pick YES or NO

We shall be clear, I say, of those who teach salvation by baptism, instead of salvation by the blood of our blessed Master, Jesus Christ. O may the Lord gird up your loins. Believe me, it is no trifle. It may be that on this ground Armageddon shall be fought. Here shall come the great battle between Christ and his saints on the one hand, and the world, the forms, and ceremonies, on the other. If we are overcome here, there may be years of blood and persecution and tossing to and fro between darkness and light; but if we are brave and bold, and flinch not here, but stand to God's truth, the future of England may be bright and glorious. O for a truly reformed Church in England, and a godly race to maintain it! The world's future depends on it under God, for in proportion as truth is marred at home, truth is maimed abroad. . Out of any system which teaches salvation by baptism must spring infidelility, an infidelity which the false Church already seems willing to nourish and foster beneath her wing. God save this favoured land from the brood of her own established religion. Brethren, stand fast in the liberty wherewith Christ has made you free- Spurgeon

266

News Item12/20/16 11:25 AM
narroway  Find all comments by narroway
ladybug wrote:
1. You claim Christ taught Calvinism, how can that be since Calvin wasn't alive in Jesus' day?

2. On a side note,there were things taught by Calvin that were not biblical, such as infant baptism.

1. As I have already pointed out 'Truth does not change.'

2. PaedoBaptism is an entirely Biblical doctrine.

WCF 28 Not only those that do actually profess faith in and obedience unto Christ,[a] but also the infants of one or both believing parents are to be baptized.[b]

[a]. Mark 16:15-16; Acts 8:37-38. • [b]. Gen 17:7, 9 with Gal 3:9, 14 and Col 2:11-12 and Acts 2:38-39 and Rom 4:11-12; Mat 28:19; Mark 10:13-16; Luke 18:15; 1 Cor 7:14.

# Sermon:~
"A Case for Infant Baptism - Confessions of a Former Baptist"
http://www.sermonaudio.com/sermoninfo.asp?SID=831051405

265

News Item12/20/16 9:25 AM
ladybug  Find all comments by ladybug
narroway,

You still have not answered the question directly, did the doctrines of grace originate with God or Calvin? You claim Christ taught Calvinism, how can that be since Calvin wasn't alive in Jesus' day?

Please, no quotes from or about Calvin. It's a simple question really. Is it 'Calvinism' or is it the doctrines of grace?

On a side note,there were things taught by Calvin that were not biblical, such as infant baptism. So, to continue to accredit him with correct teachings and state Christ taught 'Calvinism' really is a huge stretch.

I'll make it easy for you to answer, did the doctrines of grace originate with God the Spirit? Pick YES or NO

Carl

Crediting man with what God himself has done is a no no....

264

News Item12/20/16 9:07 AM
Carl in Greensboro | North Carolina  Contact via emailFind all comments by Carl in Greensboro
Job 11:7-9 KJV  Canst thou by searching find out God? canst thou find out the Almighty unto perfection?  (8)  It is as high as heaven; what canst thou do? deeper than hell; what canst thou know?  (9)  The measure thereof is longer than the earth, and broader than the sea.

Romans 11:33-34 KJV  O the depth of the riches both of the wisdom and knowledge of God! how unsearchable are his judgments, and his ways past finding out!  (34)  For who hath known the mind of the Lord? or who hath been his counsellor?

These two passages (and many more) tell us what God thinks of our "doctrines" about Him. Don't misunderstand: doctrines are important to help us make sense of how God reveals Himself in His Word. But sometimes we place more faith in OUR doctrines rather than God's Word alone (sola scriptura). We often dismiss certain Scriptures because they don't fit our doctrines. Psa 145:3 says "His greatness is unsearchable" but we still try to force "His greatness" into our pea sized minds. Brother Luther wanted to rip James' letter out of his bible because he knew the doctrine of grace better than the Lord's brother! What arrogance! And his rants against Jews have led to deadly consequences. As helpful as doctrines may be they are still mere doctrines of men; but God's Word stands forev

263

News Item12/20/16 7:34 AM
narroway  Find all comments by narroway
ladybug wrote:
doctrines of grace originate with God
God works in His servants.
Do not doubt God's capacity to create among His creatures.

Quote;
"John Calvin, often regarded as "the systematizer of the Reformation," was a second generation Protestant Reformer of the sixteenth century who brought together biblical doctrine systematically, in a way that no other Reformer before him had done. At the same time, he was not an ivory tower scholar but a pastor who thought and wrote his theological works always with an eye to the edification of the Christian church. Although his views have not always been popular and have at times been grossly misrepresented, his system of theology has had a very wide influence down to the present time, as indicated by the fact that all Reformed and Presbyterian churches look back to him as the founder of their biblical - theological doctrinal position.
Scripture
The formal principle and source of Calvin's theological system is embodied in the Latin phrase sola Scriptura (Scripture only). In a strict sense Calvin was primarily a biblical theologian" (W.S.Reid) (Elwell Theol Dic))

Eph 1:11 the purpose of him who worketh all things after the counsel of his own will:"

262

News Item12/19/16 11:18 PM
ladybug  Find all comments by ladybug
Narroway,
"Thus by teaching the doctrines of Scripture as 'Calvinism' - Then Christ taught the truth = taught Calvinism."......

Once again, let me ask you - did the doctrines of grace originate with God the Spirit or John Calvin? Where might I find a reference in the Bible to 'Calvinism'? Why do you accredit the doctrines of grace to John Calvin?

261

News Item12/19/16 8:52 PM
Kev | San Diego  Contact via emailFind all comments by Kev
narroway wrote:
""Baptists who adopt Calvinistic theology and practice ought to consider joining another denomination.""
Statement:-
Truth NEVER changes!
What was truth 2000 years ago
Was truth in the 16th century
Is truth today.
Christ spoke the truth.
Paul spoke the truth.
Apostles spoke the truth.
Tell me Do you believe that
Calvin,
Puritans
John Owen
Thomas Watson
Sibbes
Gurnall
Whitefield
Edwards
Spurgeon
Pink
Spoke the truth?
You started off making the point that Baptist should be Presbyterians then you named a whole bunch of theologians that believed in believers baptism maybe other than Calvin
260

News Item12/19/16 8:38 PM
narroway  Find all comments by narroway
""Baptists who adopt Calvinistic theology and practice ought to consider joining another denomination.""

Statement:-
Truth NEVER changes!

What was truth 2000 years ago
Was truth in the 16th century
Is truth today.

Christ spoke the truth.
Paul spoke the truth.
Apostles spoke the truth.

Tell me Do you believe that
Calvin,
Puritans
John Owen
Thomas Watson
Sibbes
Gurnall
Whitefield
Edwards
Spurgeon
Pink

Spoke the truth?

If these honourable servants of God spoke the truth and wrote the truth by the grace of God ......

Then the Calvinism they spoke was truth.

Thus by teaching the doctrines of Scripture as 'Calvinism' - Then Christ taught the truth = taught Calvinism.

Truth never changes!!

259

News Item12/17/16 7:47 PM
B. McCausland  Find all comments by B. McCausland
s c wrote:
1. I think we could agree that being immersed and washed by the word which is in the Bible is preferable over water baptism which existed long before John came on the scene.

2. .. it is terribly sad that many depend upon the actual water to cleanse or renew them ..

SC
1. Perhaps it is advisable not to think in optional terms about biblical truth, or as picking and choosing. So it is not expedient to speak of an issue or practice as a *preferable* option, but as a necessity if it has been commanded or indicated as such in the Holy Writ. The reality is that one baptism stands in Scripture as a graphical 'lingo' representing the other.

2. We were not admitting to infant baptism or baptismal regeneration in the discussion which things are totally different.

Perhaps this may help you perceive more accurately the matter about water baptism
Take care

258

News Item12/16/16 6:52 PM
Pastor Andy Proctor | Rural Hall, North Carolina  Protected NameFind all comments by Pastor Andy Proctor
Amen, we've all said a thing or two, at least that wasn't the best. May God give this man the grace to embrace the truth of sovereign grace.
257

News Item12/14/16 3:55 AM
connor | ca  Find all comments by connor
Guys I know this Southern Baptist seminary president said a lot of dumb things, but just remember that love covers a multitude of sins.
256

News Item12/13/16 8:15 PM
NeedHim  Find all comments by NeedHim
A good read, on a lot of misinformed myths about Calvinism.

http://effectualgrace.com/2016/10/02/five-big-myths-about-calvinism-3/

255

News Item12/13/16 7:58 PM
Kev | San Diego  Contact via emailFind all comments by Kev
SC this is a Jewish term meaning to be refined by fire and tried and tested true like precious gold:

Zechariah 13:9

9 And I will bring the third part through the fire, and will refine them as silver is refined, and will try them as gold is tried: they shall call on my name, and I will hear them: I will say, It is my people: and they shall say, The Lord is my God.

John Gill had this to say about the use of the word fire in Jewish literature:

You will say in water, as it is written, "who hath measured the waters in the hollow of his hand?" Another replies, בנורא טביל, "he dips in fire"; as it is written, "for behold the Lord will come with fire". What is the meaning of טבילותא בנורא, "baptism in fire?" He answers, according to the mind of Rabbah, the root of "dipping in the fire", is what is written; "all that abideth not the fire, ye shall make go" through the water. Dipping in the fire of the law, is a phrase used by the Jews l. The phrases of "dipping, and washing in fire", are also used by Greek m authors.

When the verse says 'He will baptize YOU with the Holy Spirit AND fire' notice the AND, same group of people two separate works of the Holy Spirit. It doesn't say you with the Holy Spirit and others with fire. Careful exigesis should clear this up.

254

News Item12/13/16 7:20 PM
s c | Oh  Find all comments by s c
Kev,the fire which I speak of in said passage is judgment. Saying that He will baptize with the Holy Spirit and with fire is redundant and doesn't make sense.
I think we could agree that being immersed and washed by the word which is in the Bible is preferable over water baptism which existed long before John came on the scene.
While it may be joyful in most situations,it is terribly sad that many depend upon the actual water to cleanse or renew them. I know of many people who rededicate themselves after they have fallen away over and over in hopes of being regenerated by water.
We should be baptized in the One baptism.
253

News Item12/13/16 11:13 AM
ladybug  Find all comments by ladybug
Here is an excellent teaching on 2 Peter 3:9 -

[URL=https://youtu.be/O6cHxpsbl78]]]https://youtu.be/O6cHxpsbl78[/URL]

252

News Item12/13/16 11:02 AM
Well  Find all comments by Well
Mike wrote:
Truth is always true of its own accord, doctrines are what people believe to be true, but may not be.
Thanks for clarifying.
251

News Item12/13/16 10:56 AM
ladybug  Find all comments by ladybug
j4

From 1 Thess. 4:17, 'caught up' is from the Greek word 'harpazo' meaning 'properly, seize by force; snatch up, suddenly and decisively – like someone seizing bounty (spoil, a prize); to take by an open display of force (i.e. not covertly or secretly).'
From John 6:44, 'draw' is from the Greek helkuō    helkō meaning 'to drag, properly, induce (draw in), focusing on the attraction-power involved with the drawing.'
In John 6:44, God does not draw us to heaven or remove us from this earth, He draws us to Himself- out of darkness and into the light. This drawing doesn't take us anywhere physically, it is a spiritual and supernatural work.
The two words, 'draw' and 'catching away' are not interchangeable and do not have the same meaning. You impose upon them something the bible does not.

250

News Item12/13/16 10:36 AM
Mike | New York  Find all comments by Mike
Well wrote:
You mean if it were doctrine it wouldn't be fact/truth?
Truth is always true of its own accord, doctrines are what people believe to be true, but may not be.
249

News Item12/13/16 9:43 AM
ladybug  Find all comments by ladybug
J4,

Once again, you are evading the question. You claim this coming to Christ is physical, so answer this- how does one move physically towards Christ? What direction does one go and what is the method of travel?

Someone inviting you to their house is the same as Christ calling?!?!

2) again, where does the Bible state you believe first then God draws? Why would God have to draw you IF you already believe?
4) Christ is physically present? Tell us, what does He look like J4?
5) Now, you stated Christ is in every direction, and you claim He is physically present. Rather than give us another canned opinion, I am challenging you to show from God's word where this is so. If you cannot, then you need to stop speaking your opinion as though it were biblical truth. Does Christ physically reside with His elect and do sinners come physically to Christ? No opinions please - support your view with scripture.

You go down a rabbit trail about being with Christ at death, that isn't the topic at hand. Also,being drawn up is not the same as God drawing sinners to Himself. John 6:44 does not fit with 1 Thess. 4:17. The context isn't even remotely similar.

248
There are a total of 267 user comments displayed | add new comment |Subscribe to these comments
Jump to Page : [1] 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 more | last
Last PostTotal
Crips and Bloods begin the most extensive peace talks since...
darren thomas: " dr. tim people go to hell 100% contrary to the will of god. ..."
-2 min 
SermonAudio Tip: BibleWorks Software Integrates with...
farhan from freight forwarding: "is it okay to post part of this on my website..."
-27 min 32 
Beth Moore’s Beliefs on Homosexuality Are Called into Question
john uk: "oh, a little postscript to my earlier post. folks here know of the..."
-29 min 41 


A. Boyd Miller IV
Rejection of Biblical Marriage

2 Peter 2:6-10
Sunday - AM
Covenant Presbyterian Church
Play! | MP3 | RSS

#129 End Times Studies
Dr. James M. Phillips

Pastor James Mansfield
The Uniqueness Of Humanity

Bethel Baptist Chapel
Sunday - AM
Play! | MP3

Chris Hamilton
Leading by Example

Truth Community Church
Special Meeting
Transcript!Play! | MP3

Pastor James Mansfield
The Beauty Of The Lord

Bethel Baptist Chapel
Sunday - PM
Play! | MP3

Sermon:
The Believer's Hope
Shawn Reynolds

SPONSOR | 8,800+

SPONSOR




                   
Faith justifies our souls, good works justify our faith. ... Thomas Adam


Gospel of John
Cities | Local | Personal

MOBILE
iPhone + iPad
Church App
Watch
Android
Church App
Fire Tablet
Wear
Chromecast TV
Apple TV
Android TV
ROKU TV
Amazon Fire TV
Amazon Echo
Kindle Reader


HELP
Knowledgebase
Broadcasters
Listeners
Q&A
Uploading Sermons
Uploading Videos
Webcasting
Tips & Tricks
YouTube Screencasts
2-MINUTE TIPS

FOLLOW
Weekly Newsletter
Staff Picks Feed
SA Newsroom New!
RSS | Twitter | Facebook
SERVICES
Sermon Dashboard | Info
Audio | Video | Podcast
Sermon Player | Video
Church Finder | Info
Mobile & Apps
Live Webcasting
Listen Line
Events Support
Transcription | PowerClips
Billboards
Business Cards
SOLO Sites New!
Favorites New! | QR Codes
Online Donations
24x7 Radio Stream
INTEGRATION
Embed Codes
Goodies
WordPress
Twitter
Facebook
Logos | e-Sword | BLB
JSON API

BATCH
Transfer Agent
Protected Podcasts
Auto-Upload Sermons
Upload via FTP
Upload via Dropbox
Picasa
ABOUT US
The largest and most trusted library of audio sermons from conservative churches and ministries worldwide.

Our Services | Articles of Faith
Broadcast With Us
Earn SA COINS! New!
Advertising | Local Ads
CONTACT
info@sermonaudio.com
Privacy Policy | Support Us | Stories