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RELIGION, CURRENT EVENTS, TECHNOLOGY Subscribe to the breaking newsWhat is RSS?
FRONT PAGE  |  10/23/2014
WEDNESDAY, MAY 21, 2014  |  35 comments  |  1 commentary
Popular Megachurch ‘Deleted’ Six Minutes of Its Pastor’s Controversial Sermon on Jesus?

The focus of the missing content is the difference Driscoll drew between “sin and mistakes” as they pertain to Jesus. The pastor essentially argued that Christ might not have done everything correctly on the first try (i.e. Jesus potentially made mistakes, though he never sinned).

This contention reportedly led to worries among church leaders and the subsequent removal of that segment of the sermon. Here’s a portion of the transcript of the missing footage that apparently created so much concern:

“What I’m going to tell you now might be a heresy. I’m not sure. We’ll see. Ok, um, I’ll just say that, so that if it is, I have an out, ok? So, what I’m going to say now is uh, ok I’ll just say it. Jesus never sinned, will you give me that, He never sinned, true? Good, you’ve been well taught, I think. Ok, so never sinned, never violated any command of the Bible, but question, question, here goes, ...


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Mark Driscoll Does it Again • 450+
Dr. Paul J. Dean Jr. | Providence Baptist Church
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· Page 1 ·  Found: 35 user comment(s)
News Item5/25/14 7:35 AM
Christopher000 | Rhode Island  Find all comments by Christopher000
Hey, well thank you, Abi. : )
35

News Item5/24/14 8:30 AM
Abi | Nashua  Find all comments by Abi
Christopher000 wrote:
Speaking of no fear of God, or the dark forces, I have watched some of Bob Larsons "exorcisms", and.boy, oh boy. Even the angels do not utter so much as a railing remark, and this guy laughs, teases, mocks, and challenges the spirits supposedly within the people he councilling/exorcising. This guy has become fabulously wealthy and is nothing but another used car salesman who found that he could use God to make a buck.
U seriously rock!!!! I find you very smart in all you say... keep up th good work man!!!
34

News Item5/23/14 9:38 AM
Christopher000 | Rhode Island  Find all comments by Christopher000
Speaking of no fear of God, or the dark forces, I have watched some of Bob Larsons "exorcisms", and.boy, oh boy. Even the angels do not utter so much as a railing remark, and this guy laughs, teases, mocks, and challenges the spirits supposedly within the people he councilling/exorcising. This guy has become fabulously wealthy and is nothing but another used car salesman who found that he could use God to make a buck.
33

News Item5/22/14 4:33 PM
William S. Sutherland | Houston, Texas  Find all comments by William S. Sutherland
Thanks, Dorcas! Here is the website which JSC referred to:

http://www.driscollcontroversy.com/

Here is another with some outrageously blamsphemous quotes from one of his books. It's sickening!!!

http://thechristianworldview.com/tcwblog/archives/..

32

News Item5/22/14 4:04 PM
Dorcas | USA  Find all comments by Dorcas
William S. Sutherland wrote:
Mark Driscoll is a blasphemous false teacher who should be avoided. He thinks he's cute and funny, but he's nothing but a punk who shouldn't be in the pulpit. He has no fear of God. The fact that Piper, Keller, and others continue to support him in spite of his godless, outrageous comments brings them into question as well. There are plenty of good preachers out there, many right here on SermonAudio. No reason why anyone should waste their time listening to this creep and those who endorse him.
31

News Item5/22/14 3:44 PM
William S. Sutherland | Houston, Texas  Find all comments by William S. Sutherland
Mark Driscoll is a blasphemous false teacher who should be avoided. He thinks he's cute and funny, but he's nothing but a punk who shouldn't be in the pulpit. He has no fear of God. The fact that Piper, Keller, and others continue to support him in spite of his godless, outrageous comments brings them into question as well. There are plenty of good preachers out there, many right here on SermonAudio. No reason why anyone should waste their time listening to this creep and those who endorse him.
30

News Item5/21/14 4:57 PM
John UK | Wales  Find all comments by John UK
Carl in Greensboro wrote:
John
I hope this is the point that you want me to make. Jesus is not the Second God but the Second Adam; or as He calls Himself, the Son of Man (Adam). Sin and death entered into the world through the father of man's (Adam's) disobedience but righteousness and eternal life is restored through the Son. Romans 6:19 "For as through one man's disobedience the many were made sinners, even so through the obedience of the One the many will be made righteous." The father failed to learn disobedience by eating from a tree and the Son learned obedience all the way to hanging on the tree. HalleluJAH! Praise the LORD! Let us no longer be sons of disobedience but sons of obedience to the King and rightful Heir to all things. To Him be glory and honor forever. Amen
Yes indeed. The obedience to the law by God is taken for granted. But obedience by the one born of the woman under the law had to be exercised and produced by a Man, as you say, the second Adam.

How else would God have been able to impute to us a perfect righteousness if the Son of God had not gained such a righteousness.

I thank God eternal life is a gift, coz I could never afford it.

29

News Item5/21/14 4:48 PM
Carl in Greensboro | NC  Find all comments by Carl in Greensboro
John UK wrote:
Sure he did. And maybe you could explain, Carl, why he had to learn obedience? Why it was necessary?
John
I hope this is the point that you want me to make. Jesus is not the Second God but the Second Adam; or as He calls Himself, the Son of Man (Adam). Sin and death entered into the world through the father of man's (Adam's) disobedience but righteousness and eternal life is restored through the Son. Romans 6:19 "For as through one man's disobedience the many were made sinners, even so through the obedience of the One the many will be made righteous." The father failed to learn disobedience by eating from a tree and the Son learned obedience all the way to hanging on the tree. HalleluJAH! Praise the LORD! Let us no longer be sons of disobedience but sons of obedience to the King and rightful Heir to all things. To Him be glory and honor forever. Amen
28

News Item5/21/14 4:15 PM
John UK | Wales  Find all comments by John UK
Carl in Greensboro wrote:
Jesus learned obedience. Maybe not specifically at this incident but somewhere along the way to Calvary He learned obedience.
Sure he did. And maybe you could explain, Carl, why he had to learn obedience? Why it was necessary?
27

News Item5/21/14 3:44 PM
Neil | Tucson  Find all comments by Neil
To historical speculators like Driscoll:

"...in things doubtful, useless, or unnecessary; assertions, contentions, and strivings, would be not only absurd, but impious: & Paul condemns such in more places than one."

— Martin Luther, to Erasmus in "De Servo Arbitrio" (instead of English, the Latin title doesn't run afoul of Moral Guardian blockers).

26

News Item5/21/14 3:30 PM
Carl in Greensboro | NC  Find all comments by Carl in Greensboro
I'm about to give it a rest. People set up straw man arguments and knock'em down to protect their pet doctrines. Read this: JESUS NEVER SINNED. Mary says, "Son, why have You treated us this way? Behold, Your father and I have been anxiously looking (Greek - searching repeatedly) for You." What parent wouldn't be anxious? Religious people fault the parents and nonbelievers fault Jesus. I am sure someone said at least 3 days earlier, "Wrap it up, Son. The Feast is over. Time to go home." No, Jesus, Your parents did not know nor understand that You had to be about Your Heavenly Father's affairs; they thought You should have been with them on the way home. No other 12 year old could get away that. But I wouldn't categorize that as a mistake; maybe a teachable moment for both parties. The parents learned that sooner or later they will have to let their Son be their Redeemer, Savior, and Lord; but His hour was not yet; 18 more years to start His ministry. What might have Jesus learned? If the Scriptures make you uncomfortable then squirm; Jesus learned obedience. Maybe not specifically at this incident but somewhere along the way to Calvary He learned obedience. Now don't put up another straw man saying that Jesus was disobedient; HE NEVER SINNED. He learned obedience; let us obey Him.
25

News Item5/21/14 3:23 PM
JSC | Illinois  Find all comments by JSC
Have you been to the driscoll controversy site? i access it through apprising ministries if you need. I encourage you to examine him yourself. this is not the first ATTACK on Christ he has made by any stretch.

Please if you have fell into the trap of looking past leaders transgressions because they are associated with other individuals (in this case Piper, Keller, Carson) you need to search the epistles thoroughly (Jude 2 Peter 2 John 2 Timothy Titus) and examine the actions of these men and consider your position thoroughly. i

24

News Item5/21/14 3:02 PM
Unprofitable Servant | Georgia  Find all comments by Unprofitable Servant
Hebrews 5:5-9 So also Christ glorified not himself to be made an high priest; but he that said unto him, Thou art my Son, to day have I begotten thee. As he saith also in another place, Thou art a priest for ever after the order of Melchisedec. Who in the days of his flesh, when he had offered up prayers and supplications with strong crying and tears unto him that was able to save him from death, and was heard in that he feared; THOUGH HE WERE A SON, YET LEARNED HE OBEDIENCE by the things which he suffered; And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him.

Our Lord lay aside independent free exercise of His Divine attributes and subjected them to His Father's will. (John 5:30; 6:38)

23

News Item5/21/14 2:18 PM
P Chordale | UK  Find all comments by P Chordale
It is said of Jesus at 12 years old...
Luke 2:46 And it came to pass, that after three days they found him in the temple, sitting in the midst of the doctors, both hearing them, and asking them questions. 47 And all that heard him were astonished at his understanding and answers."

Look at the statement in verse 47. "ALL THAT HEARD HIM"

Here is the conclusion of some of the most brilliant minds of the day in Jerusalem - Of a 12 year old boy!!!

They certainly knew Jesus better than we do in his incarnate state.

No Jesus did not need to make mistakes and as God incarnate a worker of miracles HE did not. And that's a fact.

As for sinners "They learn from their mistakes"? - Baloney. That would teach them to do it wrong.
They learn how to do something properly by experience and experience includes ignorance. That's not a mistake it is a fact of the learning process.

22

News Item5/21/14 2:15 PM
Mike | New York  Find all comments by Mike
Carl in Greensboro wrote:
Speeding is not a mistake; it is sin (lawlessness).
---
So if I gather correctly what you're saying, if someone drives 45 in a 35 zone, it is sin. But if the powers raise the speed limit to 50 and you go 45, it is no longer sin. Seems like man must be deciding what sin is, and unlike with God, it varies.
21

News Item5/21/14 1:45 PM
SteveR | Mt Zion  Find all comments by SteveR
Important story, as I have noticed that several hymns have entered worship in mainline denominations that bring the immutability of GOD into question
20

News Item5/21/14 1:45 PM
Chad727 | Korea  Contact via emailFind all comments by Chad727
My, a nobody's, 2 cents:
What we would label a "mistake", couldnt be a mistake if Jesus (I AM, God the Son, God incarnate, Creator of everything created, The uncaused Cause, everlasting/eternal) has done it. Right? The mere fact that He has done something would rule out the ability for that something to be a mistake.

Isaiah 55:8-9 ~ For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways, saith the LORD. For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways, and my thoughts than your thoughts.

19

News Item5/21/14 12:49 PM
Asa | Arizona  Find all comments by Asa
2 Peter 2:1-10
18

News Item5/21/14 11:37 AM
Carl in Greensboro | NC  Find all comments by Carl in Greensboro
Michael Hranek wrote:
Carl
Thanks for your reply.
I am willing to learn in this matter.
Having seen false teachers close up I hope you can appreciate my caution of who is defining what mistakes are and what might be the ones Jesus made, if at all
Michael,
Thank you for your graciousness. You're correct to question everything and every one. I'll be the first to admit that when it comes to "The mystery of godliness: God was revealed in the flesh..." (1 Tim 3:16) I think we all have a lot to learn. Even though Paul calls it a mystery some seem to have it thoroughly figured out. For example, Jesus (the creator of all things) allows Himself to be surprised at the positive belief of His creation (Luke 7:9) and the unbelief of His creation (Mark 6:6). Can God who knows all things be surprised by anything? Apparently Jesus the God/man laid aside some of His divine attributes and allowed Himself to marvel at some of the things we do and say. Praise God that He allowed His Son to genuinely laugh, cry, have fun, maybe play hide and go seek, get ticked off at hypocrisy, be sorrowful even unto death, and dare ask the Father if it was possible to have a last minute change of plans. Easy to see Son of God but harder the Son of Man. Great is the mystery!!!
17

News Item5/21/14 11:28 AM
Unprofitable Servant | Georgia  Find all comments by Unprofitable Servant
Addressing the issue of our Lord and his grieving parents seeking Him out. I believe in Jewish culture at the time a person was considered a man at 12 years old. Also, our Lord laid the onus on the parents when they asked Him about why He did not tell them He had stayed behind. He said they should have realized He had to be about His Father's business. He then made a conscience choice of further subjugation to their authority.
16
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