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BIBLE, SOCIETY, TECH, PERSONAL SURVEYS | FAVORITES CREATE NEW

All Categories |  Bible & Theology Issues
Cast your vote to see the results of this survey | 787 user comments  ( edit survey )

Do you believe the Bible teaches predestination?
Created: 4/18/2003 | Last Vote: 8 years ago | Comment: 11 years ago
Disclaimer: These surveys are created by PLUS or FULL Members of the site and, unless specified, are not created by the SermonAudio staff nor do they necessarily reflect the site's position on any topic.

  Yes, for both the elect and the reprobates (Revelation 17:8).

  Yes, but only for the elect who are chosen of God before the foundation of the world (Ephesians 1:4).

  Maybe, but I am not sure.

  No.

  I don't know.

  No answer. Skip this survey, I do not care to vote on this topic.

   

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Survey11/11/08 6:32 PM
St Jeremiah | Salt Lake City, UT  Contact via emailGo to homepageFind all comments by St Jeremiah
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I do agree with the question.

Do you believe the Bible teaches predestination?

I disagree with the choices offered.

What does the Bible give as its own answer?

Romans 8:29For those God foreknew he also predestined to be conformed to the likeness of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brothers. 30And those he predestined, he also called; those he called, he also justified; those he justified, he also glorified.

This is the entire scope of the Christian life....after we are saved....we are to be conformed to the image of Christ. Or as Paul said it another way;

He who began a good work in you will carry it on to completion until the day of Christ Jesus. Php 1:6

Predestination is concerned with sanctification....not with soeteriology.


Survey9/28/08 1:44 PM
Pikestaff  Find all comments by Pikestaff
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Does God destine some to heaven and some to hell?
Yes.
Where does HE reveal these two groups?
The Bible.
Now the "Pre" part.

Clearly God has superior knowledge and omniscience, compared to the clay vessels HE made.

"[21] Hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to MAKE ONE vessel unto honour, and ANOTHER unto dishonour?
[22] What if God, willing to shew his wrath, and to make his power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath *FITTED* to destruction:
[23] And that he might make known the riches of his glory on the vessels of mercy, which HE had *AFORE* prepared unto glory"

Oh look God's Holy Word teaches that HE is omnipotent.


Survey7/3/08 3:21 PM
Eddy Fying  Find all comments by Eddy Fying
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"Though there are many places where predestination is explicitly or implicitly taught, it is most clearly and definitively taught in chapter nine of Paul's Epistle to the Romans. There are other places we could examine in the New Testament where human actions related to redemptive events were predestined by God in such a marvelous way that human responsible liberty was preserved (Acts 2:23, 4:28; and 1 Cor. 2:7). We should note, however, that these are events, not people. Paul repeatedly says that believers themselves are such only because they were predestined to this grace as God's gift (Rom. 8:29-30; Eph. 1:5, 11). This only follows since we are expressly taught that both faith and repentance originate from God, not from ourselves (Eph. 2:8-9; Phil. 1:29; 2 Thess. 2:11; 2 Tim. 2:25; cf. Heb. 12:17)."(S M Baugh)

Survey5/1/08 10:11 PM
Preacher  Find all comments by Preacher
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No comment on my post must mean we are all in agreement

Good!


Survey5/1/08 3:38 AM
Preacher  Find all comments by Preacher
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Romans 8:29 - For whom He foreknew He also PREDESTINED to be conformed to the image of His Son.

Romans 9:30 - Moreover whom He PREDESTINED, these He also called.

Ephesians 1:5 - Having PREDESTINED us to adoption as sons by Jesus Christ to Himself.

Ephesians 1:11 - Being PREDESTINED according to the purpose of Him who works all things according to the counsel of His will.

From the Greek - to predetermine or ordain beforehand someone's destiny.

Couple this with "ELECT", mentioned some 2 dozen times in the Bible and CHOSEN mentioned numerous more times one wonders why anyone would ask the question, "Does the Bible teach predestination?" One might just as well ask, "Does the Bible teach CREATION?"

Now I know that the words ELECT and PREDESTINED and CHOSEN are words that many hate, you must either accept them or try to explain them away.

But by the same token there are many who hate the words CREATE and CREATION just as much; along with MIRACLES and DEITY. They don't explain them away, they just refuse to acknowledge them as the Word of God.

We call these people "LIBERALS". Now that is a word that makes me upset.

But what would you call someone who asks the abovementioned question as if it is up for debate?

A Liberal?


Survey4/10/08 9:40 AM
Minnow  Find all comments by Minnow
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Mike wrote:
How then do you perceive that which you state?
Hi Mike;

#'s 1 & 2 - Are self explanatory. I hope?

# 3 from Phos's " Thus the future has not been written in detail."

A] In God's mind infinite and beyond our capacity to comprehend all, "detail" can just as easily embrace Christ's incarnate journey and crucifiction and reason for, - as to any future event. With an attribute whereby a day is like a thousand years then I believe that "detail" is but a minor perception.

B] If God does not perceive detail in creation, (eg: consider the detail in the living body), then this proclaims a deficit in omnipotence/omniscience/sovereign/almighty/foreknowledge attributes.

C] In sending the Holy Spirit into the life of the sinner, God guarantees that all "detail" is perceived and provided for.(Providence)

Col 1:16 "For by him were *ALL* things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him: 17 And he is before all things, and by him all things consist"


Survey4/9/08 5:08 PM
Mike | New York  Find all comments by Mike
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Minnow wrote:
[1] As stated = Eph 1:4 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:
5 Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will,
[2] But God only needs to do this once, which as above verses state HE has decreed once for all time.
[3] In the infinite mind of God, - It has!! Our finite and sin polluted minds cannot, nor will not, perceive thus until resurrection.
Hi, Minnow. How then do you perceive that which you state?

Survey4/9/08 4:47 PM
Minnow  Find all comments by Minnow
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Phos wrote:
[1] The Christian is foreknown and predestined

[2] God decrees the future, and then brings to pass that which he has decreed.

[3]Thus, the future has not been written in detail;

[1] As stated = Eph 1:4 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:
5 Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will,

[2] But God only needs to do this once, which as above verses state HE has decreed once for all time.

[3] In the infinite mind of God, - It has!! Our finite and sin polluted minds cannot, nor will not, perceive thus until resurrection.


Survey4/8/08 1:58 PM
Thinking Christian | Ireland  Find all comments by Thinking Christian
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Phos wrote:
The Christian is foreknown and predestined only in the sense that he shares the destiny of Christ Jesus, it being Christ who is foreknown and predestined in the absolute sense. This is much like being destined to travel to New York, by virtue of having boarded an airplane or train which is bound for New York.
God does not look into the future to see that which the future holds; rather, God decrees the future, and then brings to pass that which he has decreed.
Thus, the future has not been written in detail; man is not acting out a script.
Very interesting. The airplane/train thing is a good way of describing predestination if we are on the same wavelength. Would you be saying that we are not predestined to get on the train, but when we are on it we have a destiny that has been pre- ordained. Maybe I've picked you up wrong, if I have please let me know. Look forward to your reply.

Survey3/26/08 1:25 AM
Faithful Remnant  Find all comments by Faithful Remnant
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Do you believe the Bible teaches predestination?

Absolutely! For both the elect and the reprobates.


Survey3/25/08 10:40 PM
Elkin M. Kaufman | Walker, La.  Contact via emailGo to homepageFind all comments by Elkin M. Kaufman
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PROVERBS 21;1 AND 2
The king's heart is in the hand of the Lord; as the rivers of water; he turneth it whithersoever he will.
Every way of a man is right in his own eyes ; but the Lord pondereth the hearts.

Survey3/11/08 2:50 AM
Mr. J | Australia  Find all comments by Mr. J
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I still think the Westminster Confession expresses the mystery of God's eternal decrees best of all:
"God from all eternity did, by the most wise and holy counsel of His own will, freely and unchangeably ordain whatsoever comes to pass (1): yet so as thereby neither is God the author of sin (2), nor is violence offered to the will of the creatures, nor is the liberty or contingency of second causes taken away, but rather established (3).
1 - Eph1:11; Rom11:33;Heb6:17; Rom9:15,18
2 - Jms1:13,17; IJohn1:5
3 - Acts2:23; Mt 17:12; Acts4:27,28; Jhn19:11; Prov16:33
No one can deny that there are Divine decrees, that God is an intelligent Being who knows and judges, who purposes ends and devises means, who acts from design, conceives a plan and then proceeds to execute it. Quite frankly, I can't understand how those who profess to believe the Bible and who profess to worship the Almighty God revealed in that Bible have a problem with this doctrine. If you have a problem with this doctrine, you may perhaps need to consider the possibility that you have a problem with the God of the Bible. If you cannot reconcile your human feelings with revealed Scripture,don't try to change Scripture, try to change your feelings.

Survey3/11/08 12:58 AM
Phos  Find all comments by Phos
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The Christian is foreknown and predestined only in the sense that he shares the destiny of Christ Jesus, it being Christ who is foreknown and predestined in the absolute sense. This is much like being destined to travel to New York, by virtue of having boarded an airplane or train which is bound for New York.

God does not look into the future to see that which the future holds; rather, God decrees the future, and then brings to pass that which he has decreed.

Thus, the future has not been written in detail; man is not acting out a script.


Survey3/10/08 11:07 PM
JD  Find all comments by JD
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Yes, thge bible teaches that the believers in Christ are predestined to be conformed to his image. When one studies out what is meant by "image", one finds that the trinitarian image is the focus of predestination. We have a redeemed soul and the Holy Spirit, but we do not have a glorified body. When we receive it at the rapture, we will be glorified and will be in his image.
Eph 1:5 Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will,
This is another focus of predestination. We will receive the inheritance once we are adopted and that wil take place when we receive the glorified body. The inheritance for the church is in heaven from whence we look for our hope.

Survey3/10/08 6:47 PM
quote  Find all comments by quote
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Mike wrote:
As far as the potter/clay relationship goes, comparing Scripture with Scripture, consider Jeremiah 18:1-10 for insight into this metaphor later used by Paul in Romans. Notice the clay is not passive. The clay (Israel) is/will be formed(yes, by the Potter) according to Israel's response to God.

Deu 30:6 And the LORD thy God will circumcise thine heart (regeneration), and the heart of thy seed, to love the LORD thy God with all thine heart, and with all thy soul, that thou mayest live.

Act 15:8-9 And God, which knoweth the hearts, bare them witness, giving them the Holy Ghost, even as [he did] unto us; And put no difference between us and them, purifying their hearts by faith.

For the house of Israel their salvation began with Paul's calling on Damascus Road and salvation upon receiving the Holy Spirit.

1Ti 1:16-17 Howbeit for this cause I obtained mercy, that in me first Jesus Christ might shew forth all longsuffering, for a pattern to them which should hereafter believe on him to life everlasting. Now unto the King eternal, immortal, invisible, the only wise God, [be] honour and glory for ever and ever. Amen.

Paul gave all glory to God for His mercy. He turned because God turned him granting repentance.


Survey3/10/08 6:44 PM
Mr. J | Australia  Find all comments by Mr. J
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So you would have sheep become goats and vice versa; wheat and tares being interchangeable? Try and understand people, for once and for all - the reason why God allows us to get a glimpse of reality from His perspective is so we might be comforted and assured. Spurgeon understood that. We know that God has His elect, we just don't know who they are. So we preach the gospel to all without discrimination. Knowing that God has His elect assures us of conversions. Knowing that God has decreed all things assures us that He works all things for good for those who love Him. Asking if the Bible teaches predestination is like arguing if the Bible teaches creation. ANY answer apart from YES must be wrong; "Being predestined according to the purpose of Him who works ALL THINGS to the counsel of His will." You either take that as it is, and be comforted and assured byt it, or you argue against it and end up looking foolish on discussion forums.
"I am God and there is none like Me, declaring the end from the beginning, and from ancient times tthings that are not yet done, saying; "My counsel shall stand, and I will do all My pleasure. Indeed, I have spoken it, I will also bring it to pass. I have purposed it, I will also do it.
LISTEN TO ME YOU STUBBORN HEARTED!! (Is 46:10-12).

Survey3/10/08 6:07 PM
Mike | New York  Find all comments by Mike
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Discerning Believer wrote:

"Mike wrote:
Vessels of wrath are those fitted to destruction by their own unbelief and rebellion. By sin, not decree.

"Mike, since when you became the potter? Since when you became the creator? Are you sovereign over the God of Heaven? Are you sovereign over the Creator of the Universe?
Interestingly awaiting your answer. Think over your response above in light of Romans 9:21-22."

First, in what way does my comment make me the Potter? The Creator? Sovereign?

You have many questions. But I have no free will, so I cannot choose to answer. Just kidding, poking at another calv balloon. No need to change threads.

As far as the potter/clay relationship goes, comparing Scripture with Scripture, consider Jeremiah 18:1-10 for insight into this metaphor later used by Paul in Romans. Notice the clay is not passive. The clay (Israel) is/will be formed(yes, by the Potter) according to Israel's response to God. Notice in v4 the vessel of dishonor(marred) is remade into a vessel of honor(as seemed good to the potter..) Nothing here about predestined dishonor, or once marred, always marred. Reread v8 and v10. There is a distinct if, then, relationship. Paul was quite familiar with the metaphor when he used it.


Survey3/10/08 11:42 AM
Minnow  Find all comments by Minnow
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"The second impediment to assurance is, men's entering into the lists of dispute with Satan about those things that are above their reach, as about the decrees and counsel of God.
Oh by this Satan keeps many precious souls off from assurance.

Since God has cast him out of paradise, and bound him in chains of darkness, he will make use of all his skill, power and experience, to draw men into the same misery with himself; and if he cannot prevent their entering at last into paradise above, he will labor might and main to make their life a wilderness here below; and to this purpose he will busy their thoughts and hearts about the decrees of God, and about their particular elections; as, whether God has decreed them to eternal happiness, or chosen them to everlasting blessedness, etc., that so by this means he may keep them from that desirable assurance that may yield believers two heavens, a heaven of joy and comfort here, and a heaven of felicity and glory hereafter."
(Thomas Brooks)

Did Brooks write this in 1654, about SermonAudio and these debates?


Survey7/16/04 9:29 AM
C. K. Peterson | Smyrna, Tennessee  
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Maybe I have missed the whole point of these threads? are these discussion and comment threads or debate threads?

debate threads get ugly as we have seen here and in other threads on this site.

discussion threads are a sharing of views and opinions not a strong arm event such as this.

When I first came on sermon audio I was attacked on all sides.....So I took the opinion that was just how it was and is on this site. So I dug in and threw a few punches myself in self defense and then went on the attack. I found myself mad and consumed with the threads and mad at people I have never even met.

Formed opinions and judgement with what I believed to be just cause.

Then sermon audio put a halt on all the debate and pointed out this shouldn't get so pointed and argumentative due to the witness of this site. It mellowed out quite a bit and I re-examined my former opinion that maybe this site isn't for bashing people over the head with doctrine.

So I backed off and tried to take a roll of genuine concern and sharing of truth. But I have found, now I am being chastised and taunted by a contentious individual who sees no problem with brow-beating others into submission. All while sermon audio sits idly by allowing this person to do it over and over. I am amazed.


Survey7/16/04 8:50 AM
Pilgrim | Mauldin, SC  Contact via email
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Cheryl postde: "Knowing what will happen in the future is not the same as making it happen.

If the psychic could predict all the football games including the score, why not just not play the games and save the time and trouble?"

You seem to forget that God IS the future! He knows and sees today, tomorrow, and yesterday as if it were one. The things that happen, happen, because He has deemed it to happen. There is not a sparrow that falls from a nest that He does not know of. If He were not holding the stars, moon and sun in the sky, we would all disintegrate.

Are you comparing The Almighty Jehovah to a Psychic? Remember there would be no psychic if God did not allow the 'false' to dwell with the true.

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