smaller group this evening, but that's alright because we just want to have opportunities to gather with people from the church family and continue to communicate. We want to hear what's going on in your minds, what's on your hearts and minds. We mentioned a couple weeks ago our desire to communicate and connect more and so just anytime we have avenues to opportunities to interact about the things that are going on in our lives and the things of God's Word, we want to do more and more of that and there will be more and more we'll share in the future, but I ask if Tim would be willing to just open our time this evening in prayer. God in heaven, we give you thanks for just so many blessings for just allowing us to meet once again. And even though it's a little bit different, Lord, we just love the fellowship and love the fact that we're gathered here in your name, Lord, that worship and praise you. So Father, we just ask your leadership in this meeting tonight. The questions that need to be asked will be asked, and the answers that need to be given will be given. And Lord, we just commit this evening to you. In Jesus' name, amen. Amen. All right. Well, so for this evening, just so you know, we are recording this to make it available to those who can't be here. And we originally actually still are planning to have a bigger meeting where we'll share more updates about fall ministries. And there's actually some meetings that we need to have between now and then to have more of an update on on when ministries will be starting up in the fall and what those will look like. And so we know Adventure Club is coming, other children's ministries, Sunday schools, small groups. We've been getting questions about those. So we'll have more, I think, in a bigger venue. We'll share more about that soon. But be praying for all those plans, as you can imagine, as plans come together, restarting. There's a lot of new things to consider and think about. But be encouraged, because I think We're looking forward to these weeks and months ahead. One of the big questions that a lot of people have asked is, in our county, what's the road ahead look like? None of us fully know other than the Lord, but the current plan that's mapped out in terms of the color-coded four-tier system is that if our numbers stay under a certain threshold, which they have been recently for another couple weeks, our county is going to be moving into the next tier. And what that would mean for churches is actually double the capacity of what we've been doing here. So that's something really to pray for. Holiday weekends tend to actually have cases have a temporary spike. And so all of that could change depending on how this week goes. But the two thresholds are number of cases per day and the number of positive percentages that are testing positive out of the test that they're doing. So for some reason, they took out hospitalizations and deaths completely out of the equation, which our county is doing really well on both of those. Zero in the hospital right now. But that's something to be praying for, is we would, not just for the church's sake, but for small business sake. You take restaurants, for example, to be able to go up to 50% capacity instead of 25% now, is really a make or break issue for a lot of them in the weeks and months ahead to make it through this year. So we want to be, we're thankful we can do a lot here, but we need to be thinking about our community, praying for them. So there is some hope. September 21st would be the earliest that we hear from our health officer. We might move to that next year. But all that will depend on how the data goes this week with tests. So that's probably the number one question people have asked is, when are we going to be able to get more people in this building? And that would be a milestone along those lines. Another big question, and I also have some scriptural questions people have thrown out there, but a big question is just, you know, when are things going to be back to normal? And I don't know that, I think what we're all realizing is that this is a much bigger thing than we heard in March, you know, of a few weeks to try to turn the curve. This is really a different America than we knew earlier this year. What we want to do is keep our focus on the Lord, but continue to be prayerful and continue to trust Him, but also be wise and keep moving forward. And so pray specifically for wisdom in those ministries that they'll be making plans over this coming week and the week. This month really is an important month for us as a church. So I'm just going to ask Mark, is there anything you wanted to throw out just in light of what I've been sharing, questions people have been asking you or anything else? No, other than just, I think we can all agree, you talked about March being, I forget the phrase you just used, about it being a lot, not as big as what they were saying. A lot different, yeah. Bigger, yeah. And yet, we can go back to February, and it was gonna be millions and millions of deaths all over the United States. And that had me concerned, I'm sure all of us concerned, because it was just something I've never read in this part of my life. You know, you kind of felt like it was almost floating in the air someplace. I mean, initially, the freeways were dead. I mean, they were during the weekday. There was nobody on the freeways going to work. So, but I appreciate your focus. I know that's what we focus on as elders, is this is the Lord's church. And there has been a lot of governments over the last 2,000 years that have worked hard to destroy God's church. And yet here we are. So we have a mighty, we have a mightier God than any government, than any More so than anybody could ever persecute this church, our God is mightier. And so I'm thankful for that. That gives me great boldness and confidence. Yeah, absolutely. And we have it way better than most of the world right now, as far as the church and just in general. Something to always keep in mind, things aren't what we would like to see in our state in a lot of ways, but we have a lot to be thankful for, compared to what a lot of people are going through, even in the Western world and other parts of the world. Can I just address that? Yeah. I didn't send out an email to all the volunteers the other day. Don't ask me what day. I don't remember what day, but it was a day. When we're done here, just a quick meeting in the corner over there. I want to hear some thoughts from those volunteers about what they think might be a good start-up date. Not that we're going to do that, but just kind of hear their thoughts on that. And then also what type of preventative PPE equipment, personal protective equipment that they think, that you guys think we might need. Just kind of something to think about. So some things along those lines. Good. All right. So any questions? Yeah. Hopefully I didn't cover this a little more often, but a couple weeks ago, Cliff asked me about children's ministries and was talking about that and when it was going to start. And then my sister-in-law mentioned a conflict that there might be because of the school and how their regulations are. So I don't know if you want to talk about that. Yeah, you're thinking in terms of Sunday school versus Adventure Club? Right. So our, I don't know how I feel. Can I say? So yeah, just curious about what your thoughts are on when Sunday School might start or can it start at any time? Yeah, so we don't have a date right now. I think probably within the next week or two we'll be able to give a better answer. I mean, we're not looking to start up those things in the next week or two, but we are planning as soon as we can safely working through some of those logistics. But yeah, I don't have a date. So I think there's Sunday school. There's also nursery, children's, toddler church. And so we've kind of begun those discussions, but I think probably in the next week or two we could probably have a good start date, Lord willing. So when you ask the question, and a great question, PCS is up and going and they have their PPE protocols in place, why aren't we? I can't answer that question for you because I'm not part of that school board anymore to know how they justified and did what they're doing. I don't know the answer to that. But, and also I do not know exactly how to answer that question because I was not in on their decision. So I don't have, I mean, I can only, I only know what I know based on what Gail and what Bruce have shared with me and how they put it in place, the things they put into place. But I can't, I can't answer as to how they got there. But Kelly probably. I shouldn't answer anything, but I can ask a question. I'm taking on this with ECS. Are you going to live with if and how many positive cases? Are you talking, is that question for me? If PCS has any positive cases, would you know about it right away? And would we be informed of it? Yes. The answer to that is yes, I would know about it right away. And the answer to that second question is yes, we as a congregation, absolutely, in my mind, should be informed about that to what they're doing and what that looks like because they're in our building. There's no way we're going to go, shh, don't tell the congregation. That's just not going to happen. So anyway, I don't know if that is helpful. And it may be easier to answer the question of why on August 13th we didn't start, which really would have been choosing to be the first children's thing of anything we know of starting at that time, that we didn't feel ready on August 13th. But now that we're in September and schools are underway, now we are looking at moving forward. Is that fair to say? Yeah, well yeah, that's exactly what happened. Are you asking the question? Like on August 13th, we decided to move out. That was our tentative start date for Adventure Club. Others hadn't started up yet and with some of those things going on, we weren't comfortable with that start date. But now that we're into September, we are looking at starting up. Right, right. And honestly, I think this has a bigger picture because we could see our government moving the goalposts, right, if you kind of follow that. So in my mind, prior to August 13th, which was our tentative start date for Adventure Club, prior to that date, a month prior, it seemed like, okay, we know where the goalpost is, and it seems like El Dorado County is making that. So I think we're in good shape. Well, lo and behold, that goalpost started getting moved. A little more, a little more, a little more. And it's like, oh. So that's why ultimately as I talked with some of you, I just went, I hear you and I agree with that. Let's postpone it. In fact, one of the things I told the elders was in terms of Venture Club, even if we delayed it a month, and now we have at least, two months or three months, The way that program is designed, I'm not going to get into a plug right here for you, but the way the program is designed, that program could run all the way in through spring and even into the summer if we needed to, to make it work. It is not designed like a WANA. much different. And so even if it was me, and I think I told the elders, if I had five other leaders, we could run that program. Even if we just had five other leaders, we could do it. If we have 60 kids or 50 kids or 40 kids, we can consolidate and make that happen. So the start date in and of itself is really not a huge concern for me. What is the concern for me is keeping our name out of the media because of all sudden we got a little anxious or however we want to describe that and lo and behold Channel 3 is running up here and throwing microphones in front of some of us trying to get statements as to what we're doing. And just to add to that there's a church I mentioned this morning in the message on Thursday we were at a gathering of pastors in Sacramento. One of those churches that's similar in size to us and that we're close in fellowship with had their name in the paper over some things and have taken a lot of A lot of heat and even from neighbors and different things. And they're really, one of the things that came out of that meeting is there's a lot of things happening with churches right now, especially in different counties than ours. There are churches, for example, that are meeting indoors. There's a church in Santa Clara County that's being fined over $50,000 just for doing what we did this morning. There's a church in Southern California that's been evicted from their parking lot because they haven't, because of how the court case has gone and the county has not been happy, so they're evicting them from their parking lot. There's churches that have been threatened to actually literally be padlocked and taken over and people be arrested just for doing what we did here this morning. In our county, we're in a different place. We are able to meet indoors, but most of California, and when Mark mentions moving the goalposts, I'm very sympathetic with our Sacramento County pastor friends because they thought a week ago, Friday, they were going to come off the watch list. That's what the signs were. And then all of a sudden the goalposts changed and really the goalposts got moved out of the stadium and really into the indefinite. Could they ever kick a field goal into what the new standards are? And so it's very, and a lot of these churches don't have the options on their campus to meet outside, to meet in their parking lot like we do. So I think as we think about some of the challenges we have here, I think we need to really be in prayer for churches that are just 15 minutes down Highway 50 that are in a real tough spot trying to figure out how can they continue to do church this year and so um yeah be in prayer for them even with the smoke you can just imagine i mean we had ash coming down today outside and so if your only option is outside and it's 109 degrees um it's it's it's a tough it's a tough place to be and so uh yeah we need to be praying for for our brethren in other churches. And I really pray that the Lord would give favor and could turn some of these things either on the court level or even just through cases continuing to go down. And what's discouraging to some of those counties is they've got, you know, their hospitalizations or death tolls going way down, but they're doing a lot of testing. And so there's still tests here and there. And now if they don't meet a much lower threshold, like the threshold was here, I think it was 100 a day per 100,000 for three days in a row if you're under 100. And then now it's got to be three weeks in a row under seven on average. And so you could just see how frustrating that must be for them to feel like we're almost there and then it get completely changed. And so, yeah, we need to be in prayer for them because just the politicalness, is that a word? Yeah, just the politics, the power, and obviously there's an election coming up and there's, you know, at least in some people want to use these events to make things harder for the church. And another thing the attorney brought out is that this is just our current struggle here. There's going to be, if a new administration comes in, just the There's already people who want to go after churches for other issues and maybe see the avenue to do that and LGBT issues would be one. And just even the way churches are. don't have to pay property taxes because they're non-profits. There's a lot of things that we can see that there's some people that are going to want to come after soon when this whole coronavirus thing passes. Yeah, that's something that's going to be a total politics affair in the same sentence. And that's been on my mind quite a bit lately because we do have a very important lesson coming up. I remember last year, I'm not sure, but when President Trump was running before, I remember during announcements and different opportunities he had to encourage people to pray. And I'd like to see that helped. That's a little bit, as much as you can from the pulpit, because if the election goes other than Trump, I think our church is going to have a lot harder time. it's going to be a lot harder down the road. Or just like the thing you were just talking about, taxes and, you know, exemptions and they're just really hard on churches, the other side. So I'm, you know, I'm concerned. The last time there was statistics that were put out that were really encouraging, And I was shocked when President Trump won the election that the Christian community really came out and supported President Trump. And so I'm thinking, myself, it's just as or more important this time than it was last time. And so we need that support. And what I'm doing is what I'm asking, you know, for, I don't know if everybody's here, but for everybody to really start praying faithfully about the outcome of this election. We know the Lord's in control, and whoever wins, then that's what the Lord wanted to happen. And if it could be his will, and to be the guy that still seems like he's willing to fight for the people, that would be good to get him in there. And if that could be encouraged from the pulpit somehow, to remind people of that. Because I'm not hearing too much about that, as much as I did last night. So I just spit on it myself. You want to pray just right now while we're talking about that? That would be good to pray. Our precious Lord and Savior, here we are another time. And again, Lord, many times during our prayers, I just think that I'm so thankful because we're not worthy of any blessings from you. We've done nothing to deserve your grace, your love, your care, all your provision in our lives. And it's something I think about often, and I'm very thankful for your call, that I heard your call. And I'm thankful that you called those of us, especially here tonight. And so, Lord, we just want to break before your throne. We have a very important election coming up, and one side seems to be very conservative and really for the people. And he's not a perfect man. A lot of things he says and does have grazed my eyebrows often. But I think he's trying hard to make this a better country for all people. For all people. I believe that. I believe he's trying to do that. And on the other side is one that wants to tear down traditions and things of faith, churches, and make churches, make it harder to operate in churches. It's just a bunch of negative things. Their principles are not based on biblical principles. The things they stand for are not based on scripture at all. And many of the things on the other side are spiritual principles. They're not necessarily word for word what comes out of your word. But the principles are conservative and biblical. And so, Lord, I just ask for your blessings on this election that's coming up. We pray for, of course, Lord, we know your will is perfect. We can't ask for something that's better than what you can do. But our heart's desire, Lord, would be that we get it. I saw the man in the audience wanting to make the country better again. And also, Lord, if you could lay it on the hearts of all the believers throughout the United States to support him and to remember to pray for the election, to pray for the outcome of the election. And then whatever the outcome is, Lord, that we stand by that president, because that's what he put. We can't complain. We need to remember not to complain. There's the guy we don't like. We need to respect the office, and we need to respect your decisions, and give honor to you, and trust in you, because you are in control. So we thank you, Father. We ask all this in your holy and precious name. Amen. Amen. All right. I find it interesting that we really pray harder, really, really harder before years. It's kind of comfortable. I was afraid of the Clintons, and now here we got a different batch of people that we're going to get to choose from. It just, it bends your knee. And we should have been there anyway, you know, on a daily basis, that fervently and that concerned about our country, because we have some, there's some hard times coming, and we'll get through it, but because the Lord's got us in His hand, and that's the best part. Yeah, that's right. And this whole year I think has been good for us perspective wise just to kind of shake us from our complacency and comfortability because that's where we grow. But yeah, I mean even just recently seeing churches being not only told to shut down, but being threatened or actually fined to the point where they actually want to shut down churches and make them go out of business financially if they can. This is a very different climate for the church than even two months ago. And even just a lot that's swirling in the political revolution winds that are happening this summer that have really hijacked some news headlines to really want to bring about a more radical revolution, I think, most of the people who are involved in those protests even realize. So... Same with the destroyer. Yep. It pushes a little bit. Yeah. Other questions? Could be anything from this morning, could be about... movements, Marxism. I'd also be happy to just take a question about a scriptural question too. Yeah, so that's Grace Community Church in Los Angeles. They've been in and out of court. The county tried four times to shut them down. The judge so far has actually been kind of rebuffing and almost rebuking the county. And so they decided to go another route and with no cause evict them from a 45-year lease that they've had. I mean, that's just harassment. There's no other way to describe that. So what's going to happen is that they've got 30 days from right now. I don't know if what will play out in the courts, if that's even... an issue for the court case. What they were doing, because I was down there in July, they had spent many tens of thousands of dollars to actually have a tent on their parking lot to give options for people to spread out there, inside and outside. A lot of people being outside, underneath a tent, being spread out, they wanted to give them that option. Just to put it into perspective, even with that huge tent in the parking lot, following all the strict protocols, they could fit like 500 to 700 people there. So that would be, it would take 10 services for them to actually fit all their people there. And then it's incredibly hot in this time of year. It's really not an option, but they wanted to have that option there. And then once that's on their parking lot that they own, when the church evicted their parking lot, which goes along the wash on Roscoe Boulevard, they said, all right, well, we're just going to have to take the tent down and take away that option that we were giving our people to try to work within the guidance and give options. And so that's just an example of it's not really rational that they would do that to make them take the tent away to park there. rather than park on the parking lot that they're paying, I think, a quarter of a million a year for. It's just, yeah, this is, it's sad. I don't know what the outcome will be. The judge heard multiple hours of arguments on Friday, and then he's gonna make a ruling this next week. Same judge, yeah. And what will likely happen, according to this attorney from Pacific Justice Institute Tuesday, is if there's a favorable ruling to the church, it's gonna go to probably the appellate court, which has overturned religious liberty things even this year, and that eventually it could end up in the Supreme Court. So if we hear news of a good ruling, that doesn't really mean that the battle is over. And that wouldn't change things for other churches in the state even. So anyways, that's something to be praying for. Those are good I mean, that's where Pastor Corey and I and the Howlers and others have been, the Trepepes, a lot of us were a part of that church in the past, and so our hearts are there with them. And yeah, so let's be praying for that this next week, that that would be a potential turning point. And yeah, there's several churches, Chula Vista, Ventura County. There's a bunch of different churches like that that aren't as high profile who are also going through cases right now and major hefty fines. The church in Contra Costa County, they're being fined $15,000 every week. So yeah, this is a new day for churches and we need to be praying. So while they're waiting for the court to decide that they get to continue with their property? They were actually meeting before they were on the news. So when I was down there, they were already meeting inside. They just weren't making a... They basically weren't turning people away. That was their initial thing. They just weren't turning people away. Then I think they came to the point where they wanted to go public and give their biblical reasons why. Yeah, so I do know the LA, there's a lot of LAPD who are part of that church, and I think the district, I forget what the term is, but the guy over the LAPD down there, he says, there's no way that we're going to come onto your campus during church, and this isn't a law enforcement issue. This is really a city, and this is an issue between the city, the public health, and There's the whole thing of guidance versus laws and orders. This whole thing is so complicated. What they're going after is July 13th, I think it was an executive order by the governor to close indoor operations for certain counties, for certain non-essential sectors. They're arguing that the church is essential. So that's where just not following something in a guidance document isn't what churches are facing problems from. It's actually that July 13th indoor order for certain counties. So our county is not on the county watch list. That's why there's not that controversy here, but that could... you know, that could change in the future. But right now, we've been able to, this is a question that people have asked, we've been able to meet inside, actually, since the end of May. We initially began meeting outside. Well, one reason is we could all gather in one place. Initially, they said they only wanted 100 people together outside, and then that became clear, it was just the 100 limit was for inside, and so we started gathering outside, and then, Over time, I actually still kind of, it was kind of a fun thing to be outside, all be together. It's kind of a family camp sort of feel. When the honest truth is when it started getting really hot, when it started getting really smoky, we began revisiting that. Our preference would actually be to be able to all be where we can see each other. And so I think If we moved into the next tier on July 21st where we could actually do that in here, that would be great. But we really moved inside because of the weather and then in the two different locations. It's actually been, the last three weekend has been very similar weather forecast and really unhealthy air. Yeah, so that's why, but we're not violating any laws or orders in our county meeting, but just literally 15 minutes down the hill for them to do what we're doing is very complicated legally. So, yeah. It seems like what we're going through is the restrainer of evil, if you will, is being diminished. You fund the police, close down the churches, et cetera. The movements that you see going on, which really tend to appear to be something, but really their theme in the background is something else. Would you not agree that that's kind of just taking one big leap at this point? So when you say restraining, are you thinking of like Romans 13, the government's there to help restrain evil, and then there's people wanting to like defund police in that sense? Well, you have a family that basically... The family structure? Yeah. Police. Yeah. Yeah, sure. There's probably two or three others. Yeah. That scripturally, if you will, were set and put in place to Restraining people. Yeah. And it seems like that whole structure is what's being attacked. Yeah. Yeah. And it's striking when you have actually in print that we want to disrupt the traditional nuclear family, the mom and dad family, to actually explicitly say that. And then yeah, defunding the police. So I think that's just a microcosm of a bigger cultural I guess you would call it cultural Marxism, is a growing movement that really that's, yeah, all the structures that have been set up in God's word. There are a percentage of people in our nation that would like to go after and overthrow all of those soon. I think ultimately behind that, it's not just flesh and blood. That's what our enemy of our souls has been going after the family since, I think, Adam and Eve. He turned them against each other, and Cain and Abel against each other. just even the division the polarizing of all these whether it's the political or the racial or the Whatever the issues are just how divided when you see division like that taking place I think we we know our enemy is wanting to have a field day with that and that's where Taking it to the church. We can't completely, you know, we've got to start with our families You know, we've got to start with us as a church and and be doing what we can to be united, standing strong, building healthy families, healthy churches, but we also want to be going out with the gospel because there's a lot of darkness out there that we see growing. How all that fits in with prophecy, I don't know if that was your question, but I think a lot of us are thinking, Like, we've seen kind of a little preview. I mean, this is, you know, I think what scripture describes is going to get worse than what we're seeing this year. But we see a preview of how quickly and how globally things can change and how... And so, I mean, some of the things we read about in prophecy, we can see those more realistically, experientially now, how things might play out. Whether that'll be in a short amount of time or decades more, I can't say, but it sure seems like the Lord could be coming back sooner than any day, of course. It's happening very subtly in America is what I'm noticing. I often tell Liz, All this stuff is declining, all this stuff is happening in the background and America is watching HDTV, not realizing what's going on. Your sermon this morning was right on point. I've been here a year and that was one of your best sermons. It was on point. I think it's the church can still realize that. Well, would you be willing to share just a little bit from your own experience growing up in a country under some of those ideologies? I know we don't have an hour here, but maybe a short version of what are some concerns that you see based on what it was like in the country you grew up in? Well, you know, what's happening here is exactly what happened, and I was born in Cuba, for those of you who don't know. I came here when I was 10 years old, so I experienced quite a bit of it. What happens is that the communist Marxist movement hijacks a cause, whatever that may be. In Cuba, it was more the farmers and the... Farmers aren't treated properly. You're not getting what you should be getting for your crops, and so on and so forth. And that was the theme in Cuba at the time. And they took advantage of a corrupt democratic government, if you will, and they created a movement amongst the the people that were not as economically fortunate as others, and they created that movement to the point where they had a bunch of followers, similar to what you see here with BLM and all the other groups. What's happening in the background has nothing to do with racial justice. It has nothing to do with equality. It all has to do with getting a platform that takes off and creates enough behind it, and that's what they're creating. to the point where you see churches, quote-unquote churches, promoting it. And we should join them, we should do this, we should do that. And it's creeping upon America very, very fast that I came here in 1970, and then really my first years here as a teenager and young adult were in the Reagan years, where America was American. I have a t-shirt that says, man, I miss Reagan. That's what's happening here, and it's happening so subtly, and the population here is just going about it. It's just like they're blinded. They don't see it. I don't know where it's gonna go, but the church especially. So, when I was growing up, I was, we would have to sneak, if you will, to go to church, because remember that this is the early and mid-60s when Castro really took a grip on Cuba and really clamped down. He had the Catholic churches, quote-unquote, the official church, but that was just in figure. The Christian churches he persecuted. And seminaries were closing down. Everybody that could, that was a Christian, was leaving Cuba with my family. And it was just, you know, like I said, we would have to sneak to go to church. On occasions when we were seen going to church, my parents were questioned as to, where were you last night? What did you do? So it is, um, it's coming. And if it continues the way it's going, you know, I appreciate what you said about our president and so on, and I hope that's what it is. But, you know, Daniel 2 21 says that God chooses and, um, You know, for whatever reason, He allows the leaders to be at a certain point, and for His purpose. You know, we may not see the specific prophetic things happening, but it's part of the big picture. And He's just allowing it to happen for whatever reason. I'll give you this example, and I often... I worked in the emergency management business during 9-11, and I saw everything that went on and so on and so forth, and you know, it was tragic. Then we get a certain administration thereafter that was very favorable towards those people and did something to America. Who would have thought that something that happened in 2001, that in 2008 we'd get a president that's very favorable towards those people? It's unimaginable. And so now we see this, we've had all this freedom, and it's just being torn apart on a daily basis. I mean, it's just, it's going away. And I'm telling you that the restrictions or the attacks on the church are just beginning. My dad, for the longest time, supported it. helped sustain the church that we belong to, it was a Baptist church back in Cuba, that had lost all support from different places and our family just kind of helped keep it going and they're still going. But it was very treacherous. We had to sneak supplies, Bibles, money to them because they had nothing. They absolutely had nothing. And it was misery for them. And they have struggled and continue to struggle. It's sad to see it happen here. for myself and I've lived it. And seeing it come here, I'm glad I am where I am age-wise. Because, you know, but I feel sorry for my kids and grandkids if the Lord doesn't come first. It's just, it's hard to see. It is hard to see, but I think this is also, there's gonna be, Those that are Christian and those that say they're Christian are going to be separated at this point. There's a lot of weeding out, if you will, that will take place. It happened in Cuba, we saw it, and I think you'll see the same thing happen here. There's a lot of people being intimidated, and it will manifest itself. This is going to be a true telling time for the Christians. I appreciate that perspective. Josh, I would just affirm that that happened in Acts chapter 3, 4, and 5, and ultimately chapter 6 in the book of Acts, where you see people, the persecution hit, and people were being weeded out. Ananias and Sapphira went this way. I mean, you're talking about the wheat and the tares inside the church. They actually went this way, Ananias and Sapphira. So I honestly think, you know, This is very helpful for us. This is helpful for us as a local church, as our individual walk with the Lord. Everything we've been talking about here for the last 50 minutes is really helpful for us. I'm excited about it. I have the same caution that you have, brother. The exact same thing. Absolutely, we need to be praying. But we need to also remember, and this is the same side of the same same point, same point, is that God is allowing us to go through this. We have the privilege to go through this because He loves us. And that is, that just brings me great joy. Yeah, and I appreciate your perspective also, because we need to not be fearful if things take a hard turn left after November. Christ is going to be building His church. He already has, He's already at work doing that, but these, And it also is just good to be aware of and not naive to what's going on. So just when you talk about Marxism, I mean, two of the founders of the BLM movement call themselves trained Marxists. And there's a lot in our education system and our political system who I don't know what the percentage is, but it doesn't have to be a high percentage for those sort of things to take hold through a cause. Latching onto a cause and rallying people around that when their real agenda goes way beyond that and even doesn't have to do with that. We see that, I think, in the early 1900s. They were uniting against war. Before World War I, one of those movements, they had this slogan against war, and who could disagree with that? Who could disagree with Black Lives Matter? They had this war against war, and there was something else in there. But their real agenda, from a small percentage of that, was radical social transformation away from capitalism. You know, the one thing that will happen, that is kind of a natural in their process, is to indoctrinate the kids in school without the parents being too involved. I remember as a kid from first grade, I went through almost fifth grade there, and I remember that indoctrination was 100% Marxist-Leninist doctrine. God was not in the picture. You know, the one good thing that's going on about this whole process, especially with the Grace community, is look how many appearances MacArthur has gotten out of this whole thing. And his message is right on point every time. Whether he's got a minute or five minutes with any of these interviewers. He's doing a great job. I mean, it couldn't have been, obviously, a better guy for you. It's just awesome to see that. In this whole thing, there's a good message here. I appreciate it. In one of those interviews, they were talking about the public health crisis, and he wanted to go to the spiritual health crisis and danger of when we don't know, when our soul isn't ready to meet our maker, and he just launched right into the gospel. It was great to hear. So good these I think it's important to just keep that in mind Is that we don't want to be fearful or this isn't a doom and gloom sort of thing This is this is an opportunity for the church to be the church. And if we were just in our comfortable Going the way we always went through we wouldn't be aware and awake to what God is doing And so yeah, let's let's be encouraged but be prayerful and let's not you know, be be wise as Serpents gentle as doves and there's there's gonna be great opportunities for the gospel If we're looking for them Yeah, so I do have some Some questions as well I can pull them up here I Yeah, so one question that someone had texted me was, it doesn't relate to what we're talking about here, but in 1 Corinthians 13, 7, it says in the NIV, love always protects, always trusts, always hopes, always perseveres. And so the question was, does that mean we should always trust all people? Does that mean we always trust people, individuals? What does that talk about? And actually, the different, different translations have, maybe you've memorized it in a little different wording. A little more literal wording is it believes all things hopes all things endures all things and so it's not so much Believing all people trusting all people because we have examples that same word Jesus says there were these Jews and he wasn't Entrusting himself to them same word because he knew what's in all people and so he wasn't trusting them I think we're called to trust God But another example would be when Paul came in Acts chapter 9 to the Jerusalem church, they didn't trust him initially. They didn't believe he was a disciple. Same word, believes all things, from 1 Corinthians 13. They needed to take some time. It took some time for their trust to be built for Paul. Barnabas had to testify. He spent time with the leaders and all that. The concept of, I think what 1 Corinthians 13 is talking about, because we love individuals, we're able to bear all things, endure all things, be hopeful through all things, but that doesn't mean we trust. Love and trust and even forgiveness, I think, are different things. Does that make sense for that? Another question, Hebrews 2 verse 9. It says, by the grace of God, Jesus tasted death for everyone. And so the question is, I've been taught that Jesus died for those who will believe, but if he tasted death for everyone, does that contradict this verse? So that's Hebrews 2 verse 9. And just as I kind of looked at that this afternoon, I think the word everyone is used in a number of ways in scripture. So Colossians 1 is using it for Christians, everyone that were in the context of the church making complete in Christ. So that's one example of how the word everyone is used based on the context of every Christian there. In Acts 22, Paul is witnessing to everyone He didn't witness to everyone on the planet, but he was witnessing to those that he was in contact with. And also in Acts and Romans, the word everyone is often used for everyone who believes. It's almost always used that way in Acts and Romans in particular. So I think in the Hebrews 2 context, if you have your Bibles open, you can just kind of look at some of the verses that come after Hebrews 2 verse 9. I think in this context, everyone may mean every one of God's children or God's people, because the next verse talks about He's, through this, and I think it's a continual sentence, bringing many sons to glory. So He's facing death for everyone and bringing them, these many sons, to glory through suffering. He calls them brothers in the next verse, verse 11. So these are his brothers. It talks about him sanctifying them. That's what a priest did through the sacrifice. And so I think it's his brothers that are being sanctified there. And verse 12 of Hebrews 2 talks about his brothers and the congregation that would be God's people. And then the end of verse 13, Hebrews 2, he talks about the children that God has given me. So I think these are every one of his children. And in verse 17, he calls them his brothers, and he's the priest who's making the sacrifice for the sins of the people, just like the Old Testament priests made a sacrifice for the sins of the people in the family of Israel, not the whole world, but for those people. And so I think that's the analogy he's building on. So what I'm saying is every one, verse 9, I think, is every one of God's children or God's people in the verses in the whole rest of that paragraph. Maybe just an example, we think about the classrooms down here, talking about PCS, maybe on Tuesday morning, because Monday was a holiday, but on Tuesday, the teacher might say, is everyone here? And she doesn't mean everyone on the planet. She means everyone of the children. And if you're a mom getting in her minivan coming home from Costco, is everyone here? We've actually had a few times where not everyone has been, especially when it's me driving. But anyways, the idea there is every one of my children in the van, we've had some stories where we're driving off and we get a call and, did we forget something? You mean someone? Yeah. I've been more guilty of that. Yeah, so that would be how I take the everyone there. And we have these statements throughout scripture of world, all people, you know, God's reconciling the world to himself, saving the world, but the whole world isn't reconciled to God. They're actually enemies of God. The whole world isn't Saved and so you've got to look in the context there and some of those statements It's a it's a general statement or it's actually talking about all classes of people from all around the world Otherwise it would contradict scriptures about salvation being you know limited to believers Another one John 12 32 if you want to look over there I'm John 12 32 says and I if I be lifted up from the earth I will draw all men to myself." So what do you think he's talking about there? If I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men to myself. Probably two options. One would be after he's lifted up to heaven, but I think actually this is talking about being lifted up on the cross. It's because he's getting ready to come to the cross. And also, John 3, 14, so the question here would be, we'll draw all men to myself, but it doesn't seem like all men are drawn to Jesus, you know, are believers in that sense. And so that can be kind of confusing. So that's where I would go back to the other time he said, I will be lifted up, was right before John 3, 16. He says, just like Moses lifted up the servant in the wilderness, so must the Son of Man be lifted up that whosoever believes shall have eternal life and then Let's say the next verse together for God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten son that whosoever believes in him Shall not perish but shall have everlasting life. And so I would just take that as the same the all men whosoever believes but we know not all men on the planet were drawn to Jesus while he was on the cross and But it is kind of interesting, I was thinking about, there were, you might argue, all types of men, all types of people, even while Jesus was physically on the cross. There's the thief on the cross next to him, who he says, today you'll be with me in paradise. I think the Roman Gentile centurion, when he says, truly this is the Son of God, that he's actually making a confession that this is the Son of God. And I believe that because Mark's gospel introduces Jesus as the Son of God. But then no one else of the Jews is calling him the Son of God until we come to the end of it, and we hear this Gentile Roman soldier saying, this truly is the Son of God. I think he's completing the purpose of Mark presenting Jesus as the Son of God. Joseph of Arimathea, and Nicodemus as well, the women who were drawn to him, some of them were already believers, but some in the crowd there would later believe on the day of Pentecost and so I think it could be even looking to the day of Pentecost where it mentions all men and all these nations all around the world and they're gathered and Peter says to them, these are Jews from different places, you know, you crucified, you know, the one that you crucified is Lord in Christ. So they were there at the cross, at least many of these, and they were pierced to the heart and they were drawn to salvation from all those dozens of language and people groups. And so I think some of the all men being drawn actually happens on the cross, but maybe in a bigger way on the day of Pentecost. So those were some of the questions I had texted to me from different scriptures. Sometimes the scriptural questions are easier to answer than some of the what is the future weeks are going to look like. But any other one or two final questions could be from scripture or if I don't know the answer I'll just punt it over to Mark or Jamie. But good things to talk about, be praying about, and I appreciate the focus of Christ is sovereign over all these things. He is at work. And we have a responsibility, so we don't want to downplay that. We have a responsibility to be involved, to vote, to share the gospel. But we also know that our sovereign Lord is at work, even in things that we might not have chosen, He's at work. So be encouraged. Any questions? Things we haven't talked about? Yeah, in essence, In essence, one of the things we did this morning, even though we're allowed to meet indoors, is we're not allowed to sing indoors. And so for us, that was one of the things we talked about is that we're going to obey God rather than men when the government says you can't sing. when you gather as worship. And so that, when I said earlier, you know, we are, we're not going against, that is something that's against the guidance. There have been some churches that have come under fire for that. In fact, the church that I'm mentioning down the hill, a brother's church of ours, they were in the Sacramento Bee and that was one of the things they were, criticizing that very statement that I just made, that they were not going to abide by the singing ban. I think that's been an almost universal response of faithful churches. Every church that I know of, they're singing. And so I think when you unite around that and you've got churches all across America and all across our state that are all on the, I wouldn't say all, but most on the same page, is that we're going to sing. That there's strength in numbers there, but that's a non-negotiable for us because there's dozens of commands in scripture. Sing in the congregation, praise the Lord with his people, sing in the assembly. But as you can see, we're aware that there are concerns that people would bring up in terms of singing, breathing, speaking, and so we're spreading out the seating. We're not just ignoring everything, all the guidance, but when they say don't sing, that's That's a line in the sand for us. You know, I would say the whole concept of not meeting together, not gathering here. I mean, early on, I think Mark mentioned, you know, the forecast of millions of people dying, half of California. I mean, we're hearing that it's like, you know, if half of our church gets sick over this, if a whole bunch of our people die, I mean, there was reason to be cautious and to take some time and to and see how this all plays out. So I think that's another place where churches were all on the same page. I don't know if there might have been a couple churches that never closed, but not that I know of. So we all, you know, initially did that, you know, to try and flatten the curve. Two or three weeks, we were told. And then when it becomes two or three months, and it's not what had been forecasted, and that's when, and then, We see a lot of things happening outside, so that's where I felt we should have been able to meet outside a lot sooner, at least outside to start. And I could give you a much longer answer to that, but I think the short answer is that we are committed to keep singing, to keep meeting. And we believe that as the leaders of the church here, and we, you know, want to communicate well with you, but we feel that that's on us to decide how are we going to worship as a church. We want to be respectful to our government, but our ultimate allegiance is to Christ. So, yeah, so I think we can, You know, down the road, if things ratchet up and now we've got to think about if we do this or that, we're actually in a good place in our county for things to not be too restrictive. If things get turned for the worse, I mean, I think those commitments I just mentioned, we're committed to keep meeting and keep singing. That is where we're at as elders. Is that accurate to say? Yeah. You summarized it well. Yeah. We're just really thankful as elders, especially, and I know the congregation as well. We're just really thankful as elders, I know the congregation as well, that we live not only in this county, but with our county officials that really do have a concern for this that are very like-minded in many ways. We should, you know, as you pray for our county officials specifically, man, we just thank you, Lord, for caring, for the Board of Supervisors, We're just blessed living in this county. That's really all I can say. And just to give you an example, last Tuesday I emailed Lori Parlin, who's the supervisor over our district here in Shingle Springs, and just brought up, you know, I know things change with the governor over the weekend. It looks like our data actually is this over the last couple weeks. When can we get some clarity on when we can actually move to that next tier? And so I sent that email and then I saw it was like at the top of the agenda and it had It had my actual email and email address all there and everything. But they've been very, I think our county health officers, especially our county supervisors have been, and even our county law enforcement have been very supportive of churches from day one. And so I think we're thankful for that, but we also know that that could change. And there could be people coming even from outside our academy that are causing trouble for different churches, even small churches like ours. But we're committed to follow the Lord and continue meeting, continue singing. But we're willing to do that. right now meeting in two different buildings, you know, we were willing to do that outside. As we're thinking about a baptism this month, you know, baptism is not really something that we just want to do on a screen. So we're thinking about, you know, whether doing that outside for the baptism. So anyways, those are how we do that. You know, I think there's There's different decisions to be made, but yeah, we're going to keep meeting, keep singing. Pray for us, because it's easy to say that, and it could be more difficult to live that out in the future. So. We're good. Well, there may be questions you didn't want to ask in front of everyone, and myself or Mark can hang around afterwards, but this has been just, I think, good to talk through these things. We don't have all the answers, but we know the Lord does. He has the future mapped out. He is working all things together for good, and so that's encouraging. Yeah, share your input. Also your ideas, because we also we welcome that and. Pray for your leaders, because even just the. Yes, we've got a meeting coming up Tuesday. Leaders Tuesday night. I know that you know the children's ministry is having ministry. So yeah, be praying that this would be a real good good week and the Lord would keep us keep us on the right path. Keep us humble, sensitive to his spirit. So you wanna pray for us, Mark? Yeah. Thank you that you promised you would build your church, and that is indeed what you have been doing for 2,000 years. Nothing has slowed you down. There is no government that will stand in the church's way. There is no political movement that will bring it to a stop. There is no government that will So thank you for that. Thank you that you are continuing and are faithful in building your church. And we really get to enjoy watching that go on, even though there is pain and there is difficulty, we thank you for the persecution that churches have the privilege of receiving. We read about that in the book of Acts, that persecution occurred and we look to, and see the results of that persecution. The word went out throughout all the region, all the area because of the persecution. It divided the weak from the terrors. We see that in scripture and father, here we are. We have just a small taste of that, of that persecution. And we don't know if it's going to get worse. We don't know. But the one thing we do know is we're gonna trust you. So thank you for that. Thank you as we get to, we have the privilege of working through these difficulties. We know that you love us and you want the best for us. And this is what you have for us. So thank you. We're called to give thanks in all things, all things. And this is an all thing. So thank you, thank you for that. Thank you for the split congregation we see right now. Thank you that we were able to meet as one congregation outdoors. Thank you that we were able to meet as one congregation for years and years indoors in the same building. We're thanking you for every one of those things, so thank you. Father, help us now just to continue to pray for our governor, for our local governments, We're called to do that. 1 Timothy 2 tells us to pray for kings and all who are in authority that we may lead a bright and tranquil life in all kindness and dignity. And that is indeed what we want to do and we will do. So Father, help us to be gracious, recognizing that the governor, the government of California, the federal government are governments that you set up, you put into place for our good. And so Father, we're going to trust you and thank you for that. These things I prayed are sent to me. Amen.