The following program is recorded content created by the Truth Network. It's Matt Slick Live. Matt is the founder and president of the Christian Apologetics Research Ministry, found online at calm.org. When you have questions about Bible doctrines, turn to Matt Slick Live. For answers, taking your calls and responding to your questions at 877-207-2276. Here's Matt Slick. Hey everybody, welcome to the show. May the Lord bless you. I hope you have a good day listening on this wonderful June 18th, 2024. And if you want to give me a call, as usual, all you need to do is dial 877-207-2276. You can also send me an email. Easy to do. Just direct it to info at karm.org. Info at karm.org. And put a subject line, radio comment, or radio question, and that'll be good. Muy goodo. And there you go. All right. Why don't we just jump on the calls? Let's get to Dorothy from Virginia. Hey, Dorothy, welcome. You're on the air. Thank you, Matt. Hi. I have a question. I lost my daughter last June. Today would be. And I have a question about soul sleep and what I read, I don't believe it's biblical. I believe that, you know, you're conscious. And I just think that your spirit goes back to the Lord. So I just wanted to hear from you. Thank you. Well, first of all, my sympathy for losing your child. I can certainly understand that and relate to it. And it's just hard. So I do know that you're in the calm chat and stuff like that, and a lot of good ladies there supporting you. And I praise God for that. Thank you. Now, about soul sleep, coincidentally, I spent about a half hour to an hour last night discussing it online. And soul sleep is not biblical. It is a false teaching. I know there's a lot of people who assert that it is okay, but I'm going to show you why it's a big problem. First of all, there's different kinds of soul sleep, but it's all around the same basic idea. That when a person dies, that his soul, consciousness, goes into a non-operating state. So he's not thinking, not doing anything. Now when I ask questions about this to the soul sleep advocates, they're not used to the questions that I ask. You know, I'll say things like... It should be okay. The sound is not good. It should be okay. What I'll do is I'll say... I'll say... you know, I'll say, uh, when, when, if there's any activity in the afterlife, when, between, when they die, you know, when they're in, they're just in a state of soul sleep, if there is no activity, no thoughts, no nothing, which is what I was told last night, that's a huge, huge, huge problem. So I was talking to these two guys, strong advocates of this position, and they were talking and saying, it is what the Bible teaches, soul sleep. And they'd read these verses, you know, the soul dies, the soul goes to sleep. or the people who were asleep. And, you know, they just assumed they understood exactly what it meant in each context. They're very, very adamant, and also insulting and condescending. And so I said, okay, I didn't tell him I'm gonna set him up, but I certainly was, and I said, let me ask you. I said, are you sure that when the human soul, human body dies, the human person dies, that his soul, consciousness, ceases to have activity and there's nothing going on? He said, that's right. I said, okay, then that's heresy, and here's why. Jesus himself has two natures, a divine nature and a human nature. So now what he would be saying is that the human nature of Jesus then ceased to have function. if that's the case then it denies the hypostatic union as well as the communicatio idiomata the first doctrine is a teaching that in the one person of christ are two distinct natures the necessary doctrine along with it is the communication of the properties which says that the properties of each nature are ascribed to the single person so that Jesus, the one person, said, I am thirsty, claiming human attributes, and I am with you always, to the end of the earth, that's claiming divine attributes. So that's the one person who has the active attributes of both natures. So if Jesus, when he died, his human nature went to sleep, then the properties of that nature are no longer ascribed to the person of Christ, and he cannot have that human attribution because there's no properties active. And when there's no properties active in something, that something is dead and non-existent. So this is a huge problem. And I don't know if you understand what I just said, but it is absolutely heretical what your position was because of this. And the response was that I was just using philosophy. And I said, you claim that because you can't answer the challenge. And you wanted to dismiss it instead of answering it. Biblically, you just say, you dismiss, oh, it's philosophy, and you just ignore it because you see the problem. But nevertheless, that's what happened last night. So, soul sleep is not true. Furthermore, in 1 Samuel 28, the witch of Endor was asked by Saul to contact Samuel, and Samuel really did appear. Now, if it's soul sleep, how come he was there? We can go to Matthew 17, where Elijah and Moses both appeared to Jesus. Now, how could that be if soul sleep is true? Furthermore, in 2 Corinthians 12, 2-4, Paul says, I know a man whether in the body or out of the body, I do not know, but such a man was caught up into the third heaven. So, how is that possible if the soul is separate from the body? Because they say when the physical body dies, the soul goes into unconsciousness. That means the soul is part of the body. And so there's some other issues I can get into, but those are some of the reasons why it just doesn't work. It's not true. OK? That helps me so much. Thank you, Matt. Thank you so much. You're welcome. And just put that to bed, to rest. Let it die. Soul sleep is a false teaching. Oh, amen. Thank you, Jesus. Thank you, Matt. You're welcome. All right. Well, God bless. So yes, I was having this discussion with these guys last night, and man, they were adamant. And when I presented this argument to them about the relationship with Christ and his two natures, literally, now I was saying, heresy begets heresy. So I said, this is what it teaches. They said, it's just philosophy. And I said, wait a minute, do you affirm or do you deny that Jesus has two natures, a human nature and a divine nature? And they wouldn't answer. They said, that's just human philosophy. We only go by what the Bible says in Colossians 2.9, for in him dwells all the fullness of deity and bodily form. So, do you affirm it or not? And they wouldn't do it. So, what they were then doing was denying the hypostatic union in order to hold on to their pagan philosophy. And that's what was going on there. So much heresy, so little time. Let's get to Jamal from North Carolina. Jamal, welcome. You're on the air. Hey, Mr. Slick, always a pleasure, sir. Thank you. I wanted to ask two questions. One will be a quick, possible softball one. Second one will be, I don't know, possibly, there might be softballs for the second one as well. Do I have time for two quick ones right now? Sure, go ahead. All right. First one is, when you're praying, Do you always have to say, in Jesus Christ's name? No. No. People prayed in the Old Testament, and they never said, in Jesus' name. And the prayer was certainly valid. They called upon the name of the Lord. They beseeched the Lord. They entreated the Lord. They cried out, called upon. And it was never, in Jesus' name. Now, when Jesus teaches us to pray, in Matthew 6, 9, I'll go to it, it says, pray this way, our Father, heart, and heaven, et cetera. It doesn't say, in Jesus' name. The reason that we do, we say that because there's a phrase, and if you go to Acts 4-7, it says, they placed them in the center. They began to inquire about what power or in what name have you done this? And Peter filled with the Holy Spirit said to them, rulers and elders of the people on trial today, et cetera, et cetera. It's by the name of Jesus Christ at Nazareth whom you crucified, et cetera. So he's saying is in the name of is by the authority of. So when we pray, we say in Jesus name, which I always do. And the reason I do is because, for me, it's a closure of the prayer. But it doesn't make the prayer valid. Because what if you're praying to God in your bed, you're going to sleep, and you're praying, and you're praying, and you just drift off to sleep, but you don't say in Jesus' name, oh, the prayer doesn't work, you know? It doesn't work like that. Exactly. Oh, OK. And you know what? That was almost kind of specific to what I was wondering about, because that has happened a few times. either pass out or daydream as, Oh, I didn't finish it out in Jesus Christ name. I guess I have to start all over. Um, so that's, that's good to hear that. Yeah. All right. Uh, second one is, um, I know the reasons why I tell people I was good to switch over to Christianity, but I wanted to get a year take on it. I didn't hear everything. Something about switching to Christianity or could you repeat that? Yeah, I have my reasons why I tell people to switch over to Christianity, but I wanted to get your take on why you think it's good for people to switch over to Christianity. Because it's true, because Jesus is God in flesh, because Jesus fulfilled prophecy and said that he's the way, the truth, and the life. And then without him, you'll suffer eternal damnation, Matthew 25, 41 and 46, Mark 3, 29. So that's why you need to come over to Jesus. Plus, it glorifies God for a person to do that. And we're created for his glory, Isaiah 43, 7. Okay? Yeah, those are pretty good. Just to give you a little flavor on what I say, I say, well, you know, what do you do with your guilt? I do mention about eternal salvation. Also, I say it's just a better lifestyle here while we're on this earth to be a Christian in many different facets. Then it's just a personal fulfillment. You just have the Holy Spirit living in you, and it comes out, and you are a genuinely happier person and you have purpose and you, you, um, well, let me ask, everything makes sense. Yeah, go ahead. Because the reason I'm asking is because are you, now here's something to think about. Are you teaching something that, or might you be saying something that a Mormon could agree with or a Catholic could agree with? I would say no because you can't get fulfillment through Mormonism through Joseph Smith. You can't get fulfillment through Buddha because Buddha hasn't lived. There's only one community. Okay, many Mormons and Buddhists feel very fulfilled. I'm quizzing you I'm gonna get you to some places a little slowly if you don't mind. Okay, so a little bit more because fulfillment is subjective and So I can be fulfilled, like me, I get fulfillment by studying cults. For me, that's fulfillment. For others, that would be torture. For them, it might be going to a sports game. For me, that would be torture. So fulfillment is so subjective. So what's something non-subjective that is also true? I'm trying to point you to something. All right, I'll give you the hint. The reason we want to become Christians is because God himself is the one who tells us what he wants us to know for him and in his will and work Jesus Christ, God in flesh, died on the cross, rose from the dead, and through faith in Him, you will be saved from the righteous judgment of God. And that's by faith alone, in Christ alone, and no other way. Now, that restricts, that'll get rid of all the other false religious systems. And this is for the glory of God. That's the ultimate reason. Otherwise, we might be promoting what's called moralism. Be good because being good is good. Trust Jesus because being trusting Jesus is a good thing to do. It isn't, but there's more, so hold on, we're gonna break, okay? Hold on, buddy. Hey, folks, we'll be right back after these messages, please stay tuned. Each word is a testimony. Come fly this place and fill the atmosphere. Your glory God is what our hearts long for. And His Word is always true on the Truth Network. It's Matt Slick live, taking your calls at 877-207-2276. Here's Matt Slick. All right, everyone, welcome back to the show. Hey, just give you a heads up. Rumble, the entire site is down. So we are aware of that issue. If you ever want to know if a website is down or not, you go to www.isitdownrightnow.com. Is it down right now? And then all you do is you type in the website and it'll tell you. And Rumble.com is down for everyone, which means the site crashed. And they'll work on it like they always do. And stuff like that. So that's why we're not on Rumble right now. That's the first time that's happened, I think, in a couple years. We've been on doing this. Anyway, no big deal. All right. So how's it sound? OK. Does it sound OK? Because I had to do a sound check thing. And change is better. All right, good. Let's get back on with Jamal. Hey, Jamal, welcome, man. You're back on, buddy. Yes, sir. Thank you. Appreciate it. All right. So where were we? Okay. Did that help? A little? It did. I think you were going to talk about not going to moralism. That's my argument there. See, the reason I say this is because I got taught a really big lesson in seminary when I preached a sermon, and you had to do it for class. It was really hard to do. You'd preach a sermon in front of your peers and get graded and stuff. But I preached, and the professor and I ended up over his house talking about it. And long story short, he said, Matt, could your sermon have been preached in a Mormon church or Jehovah's Witness church without any change, would they have accepted it? And that opened my eyes, because I said to him, you know what, you're right, it could. He said, then what's wrong with it? And I said, man, that is such a good, that was so good. And so it really helped me. So we want to be able to ultimately point people to Christ so that it's not so easily acceptable by Mormons, Jehovah's Witnesses, Roman Catholics, and stuff, and that they'll just agree. Now this doesn't mean that every single statement has to have a theologically precise subdomain, you know, 150 words dissertation of what this means and that means. But you say, look, you need Jesus. And he's God in flesh, which that negates the Jehovah's Witnesses. And there's only one true God. And that negates Mormonism. And that we're saved by grace through faith in Christ. That negates Eastern Orthodoxy and Roman Catholicism. And this glorifies God when we trust in him, which is the greatest thing you can do. And then people go, oh. So that's just a little comment there, OK? Yeah, that's pretty good. Now, I hit you with a lot of suggestions, but here's one more. I hope you receive it well. Okay. Do you have like a theology book for Dunleaf? You know, like a couple of quick notes on it? Yes, I do. Ah, good, great. Is it on the car website? Yes, there's a couple things you can do. One is you can go to, one you pay for, one, well, both are going to have to, I guess. One we have on the schools, and it's a theology school. We charge $33 each for the three schools, which is $99, but if you get all three, you get $75. That's what we do. But we also, I say this, people think we're just in it for the money, making money. No, no, no. We've got to pay the bills, we've got to keep the lights on, pay the missionaries, so we need donations. We really do. But what I say is that if anybody out there wants the schools and you can't afford them just Just email us. It's all you got to do just say can I have one school or all three of them? I can't afford it. We don't ask any questions. We don't care you just say that and we'll send you a free access to the schools lifetime, okay, and And you go to learn.carm.org, learn.carm.org, and that's where the schools are. And you can do it that way. And so I'm just letting you know. All right. And the other thing you can do, and with this, I don't know about right now, but hold on one second. Because we're going to be revamping this store. We have a store. So I'm looking at the CARM website and the shop page. We're going to be redoing it next month sometime. That's the goal. So I have something called the Basic Christian Doctrine Bundle. It's for $45. And you get a teaching manual, a student manual, a DVD, and there's a PDF download that you get for $15. That's supposed to work. So if you try it, it doesn't work, let us know. We discovered some problems. And we don't know which the problems are. We're just redoing the whole thing. We're going to go to a different system. And I have to do it myself. And it's going to take a while. So that's it. Or, and or, you can just go through the karm.org website, go to the Christian Theology section, which I'll do right now, Christian Theology, and then Doctrine and Theology. You go there, and all the articles you need are right there. okay he's close to start reading to do so here comes the uh... and i think i need to have a reference to look for the stuff but sometimes and i'm not going to have one that i can carry around with me also there you go okay we'll try this if you go to google docs because you can do this on your phone too you go to google docs and you create an outline and what you learn you put in your outline so that you can always have it on your phone Also, you can Google Docs. And so, you know, like my article, what is the gospel? You know, I'm looking at it in the doctrine section. Well, you know, the gospel is a singularly most important. And then there's a noise in the background. And then you can read through and take a paragraph or whatever it is that you like that fits what you need. And you copy it, you put it into your document. And then you just do it with every topic, Trinity, you know, Salvation, whatever. And you just start putting in an outline form. And then what happens is you always got it. You go someplace and, you know, you can edit the document. You can read it. Okay. It's easy. Yeah. That's a good idea. I'm going to have to, I haven't done that before. I think I actually, I think I accidentally did that. And I was wondering why I had documents on my phone. So I've got to figure out how to purposely do that. That would be a good idea. It is a good idea. Even if I do say so myself, it's a good idea. And it's what I do. I have Google Docs. But I also do this. For example, I have my Logos Bible program, which I've had for 20 some odd years. And I have it on my phone. Now, my phone is one of those phones that folds out. It's a Galaxy Note 5 or Galaxy Fold 5. So it's big. Real fancy. Yeah, it is fancy. Well, I can justify it because I'm always researching. And so what I do is I have Microsoft Notes. I put stuff in there and I'll transfer it into other stuff. But what I can also do is access all of my notes that I create in my... I don't use the Google Docs. I do that because I'm computer... I'm very computer literate. and so I use other stuff, but what I've done also is gone to my Logos program and I've taken my notes from my Catholicism page and put them in to the program so there's a little folder. As you click on it, my notes pop up on each and every verse that I've examined and studied. So there's different ways of doing stuff. I should do a little course on how to do this. You know, different options. I didn't want to say that, but I was thinking that. Yeah, it's not hard. And I used to build computers and teach computers and teach, you know, Office and Word, Excel and all that stuff. I love computers. I love them. I would marry them. That's how much I love them. All right. Good deal. Well, I appreciate it, sir. And take care and God bless. You too, John. God bless, man. All right. Hey, folks, we'll be right back after these messages. Please stay tuned. Oh, hey, look. Rumble's back up. Good. It's Matt Slick live, taking your calls at 877-207-2276. Here's Matt Slick. All right, everyone, welcome back to the show at the bottom of the hour. If you want to give me a call, 877-207-2276. Let's get to a more from North Carolina. Welcome here on the air. Hey, Matt, how are you? I almost listen to you every day. I'm not the first time caller. I have called you before. Uh, I really, one of the thing I admire you, I'm listening to your, uh, previous caller and other callers. You are really patient and how to explain. I admire you for that, that you, you really explain how to do that. You, you, you are good. I don't have much of that, but, but anyway, uh, we'll cut to the case in here. I went, you were taken this, I know. Um, i don't know if we can say there is a reason for them ministerial uh... all about the internet in the region everything especially you i know we have to uh... obey the one that we authority like the government the police the sheriff uh... because god allowed them to be there or ordained them to be there or whatever so we have to uh... follow to the authority okay well i get that i agree with that but i think sometime uh... the government or the law enforcement do uh... bad things of course some government even do ungodly things uh... you know you know what i mean and then i'm not even go back to the roman empire to the greek i'm not even go further that way it's too far for that i will just go to our foundation of our country which is we rebel against king george that time he's the one with the authority when they rebel in Massachusetts and everything, Washington and everything, you know, that's where the country was born. You have a question? Well, my question is, I'm glad you asked that. I'm talking about my topic. So my question, when are we going to obey the government or the authority? How are we going to obey them if some of them even do ungodly things? How do we do that? Okay, so the issue is when should we disobey the government, right? No, but sometimes if the police is doing wrong or the... Okay, hold on, hold on, hold on. I need a question, okay? So what's your question? So my question will be, when is the time, when is the right time or biblical or God way to protest the one with authority if they're doing it wrong? to protest that that specific verb means uh... implies the idea of going to petition getting out in front of the police with signs and things like that. I'm not talking about rebellion, shooting and all that. Like as I said again, the uh... our founding fathers when they find the King George and the British are not doing... I'm trying to get you to a question though. I understand about King George. I understand about the Civil War. I know the Revolutionary War and things like that. I've written on this very topic so I'm not exactly sure what your question is. So when are we, according to God or according to the Bible, are we allowed to I will not say rebellion, that's a very harsh word. Are we allowed to protest grievance if a government or a town or a government is doing wrong, even doing ungodly? Okay, yes we are. We're supposed to resist evil. And if our government is doing evil, we are to resist it, we're not to follow in line. There is a book I'd recommend called The Doctrine of a Lesser Magistrate. The Doctrine of a Lesser Magistrate. and it's a good book that goes through this issue and let me see it's who is it by it's uh by Matthew Trujillo it's a very well written book and it goes through the issue of of the obligation of Christians to risk what's necessary risk even their security for justice and righteousness. Christians are called to do this. Jesus even said in Luke 22-36, he sent the disciples out and said, buy a sword. He knew there would be persecution and he knew we had the right of self-defense. As Christians, we're obligated to defend people and we need to, as Christians, stand up and protest the murderous abortion stuff, the oppressive alphabet mob. We need to do this. But too many Christians are just comfortable with just being on a Sunday morning pew. And that's their Christianity. They don't know they're called more than that. And that's just something I've talked about frequently. But yes, we are supposed to resist evil and not stand for it, even if it means risking ourselves. Here's a quote from that book that I think is really good. The interposition of the lesser magistrate requires a willingness to risk personal security for the sake of justice. This is the kind of thing that Christians need to be taught from pulpits among other things. Not Jesus has a wonderful plan for your life, pre-trib rapture, we're gonna get out of here, everything's gonna be fine. He's a blond-haired, black-occasioned surfer dude who wants to have a nice life and everything be healthy, you know. That's just not what we're called to in Christianity. But that's what's being taught because it tickles the ears of people. But anyway, go ahead. Sorry. So tell me the name of the book again, Matt. The Doctrine of the Lesser Magistrates. the doctrine of the lesser magistrates, a proper resistance to tyranny and repudiation of unlimited obedience to civil government. How about that? I will check that out. Matt, thank you for always taking my call and continue what you do. God bless you, man. You have a nice day. I will listen to the rest of my radio. Thank you, man. Thank you. All right, just to review that book, I do recommend people read it, The Doctrine of the Lesser Magistrates. The Doctrine of the Lesser Magistrates, and copyright 2013 by Matthew Truhela, T-R-E-W-H-E-L-L-A. I do recommend that every Christian be educated on our duties as Christians to resist evil and even at the the risk of our own safety. This is what we're called to do as Christians. I know people don't want to hear this because it's not comfortable and it's not coochie-coochie-coo theology. Oh well, too bad. Let's get to Carl from Ohio. Carl, welcome you on the air. Hello. I just have a quick, I guess a quick statement. I called into a show. I think it was somebody Brown, Dr. Brown show. I called in and I was just inquiring about Rick Warren, um, ordaining female pastors and you know, I guess we're congregations and man, he, I mean, he just like went off on me. I wasn't expecting it. I wasn't trying to be rude. I just wanted to know what he thought of it. And he went off on me, told me I probably wasn't saved. He started mentioning women that worked in the Bible, like, you know, Phoebe, Dorcas. I'm like, yeah, but they weren't pastors. And he just cut me off. And he was this real curt with me, very smart. So I assumed that he and Rick weren't friends. And I'm just going to listen to what you think of that, and I'm going to go. Thank you much. Well, no, hold on, hold on, man. We can talk a little bit afterwards. Women are not to be pastors and elders, and Rick Warren should not be ordaining women as pastors and elders. For him to do that is in rebellion against the Word of God. I challenge him, if he wants to take me up with it, Dr. Brown and Rick Warren, I'll challenge them to public debates on this issue. Does the Bible support women pastors and elders? And that's it. I will do that. I'd be glad to go through and do that. I've been offering this debate for anybody who'll take it for about 20 years or so on the radio. I don't know how long, but a long time. And no takers yet. So Rick Warren is, in my opinion, in sin for rebelling against the clear teaching of the Word of God. Yes, I know about Dorcas and Phoebe and stuff, but those are not, just like you said, are not the issues of being pastors and elders. So, yeah, they are in rebellion, and I would call, you know, I would call them. I do have Dr. Ralph's number, but I would say, no, he's mistaken in this. He's wrong, okay? if he holds to that position. So if Dr. Brown affirms women pastors and elders, I would say no. That is against scripture. He needs to repent of that. The same with Rick Warren. He needs to repent of that as well. Women are not to be pastors and elders. I can give you an in-depth study on that. I've written a lot on it. I defend it. Maybe I'll talk about this after the break, too. We've got a break coming up here in a minute or so. Look, ladies and gentlemen, I'm not against women. I'm not against women being able to do things. That's not what the issue is. It's just what the Bible teaches. And the Bible teaches women not to teach or exercise authority over a man, but remain silent. And that's just how it is. It goes into the elders. I can go into all this stuff about the elders being the husband of one woman. Women can't do that. And so we have to understand something. This is not just an issue of patriarchy as unfortunately too many Christians, I don't know what these guys are doing, but too many Christians take their doctrinal finger, put it up in the air and see which way the doctrinal wind's blowing and then they go that way. That's not how we're to stand. As Christian men, we're to stand on the word of God. That's what it says on, in the Bible, in the word of God. And so we're to stand on that. And anybody who rebels against that needs to be corrected and rebuked. That's what needs to happen. This is a serious issue. Eighty percent, this is my personal research that I've done, and I did it three, four, five years ago. Eighty percent of the denominations and churches that adopt women pastors within two generations start approving of homosexuality. And the reason is because they're not taking the Word of God seriously in that particular area, and they're bowing to the sensibilities of the world and not Scripture. That's what I believe about that whole thing. Now, if you want to give me a call about it, 877-207-2276. Be right back. It's Matt Slick live, taking your calls at 877-207-2276. Here's Matt Slick. All right, and welcome back to the last segment of the show here on, let's see, Tuesday, June 18th. I just felt like saying that. All right, let's get to Gordon from Charlotte, North Carolina. Gordon, welcome. You're on the air. Thanks, Matt. I grew up in a Christian family. Parents were missionaries for 25 years in the Philippines. And, uh, I ran with the devil for 30 years and got saved 10 years ago. And I listened to you from time to time. I wanted to call last week because I hear you from time to time and just wanted to call. I don't know how many calls you get like this, but just to encourage you because you speak truth and you use the word to back it up. And the last gentleman that called about, um, you know when women being ordained and and and that the bible certainly back that up but you know not not to be in the weeds on that i just people that listen to you i think they know the truth when they hear it and if not the holy spirit will guide them i had a good quote today i heard from alistair begged this morning which i think it's worth repeating truth is no good unless it's often by love love is no good unless it's hard by truth and uh... like that I know you give all grace to Jesus and I know you point to him. I've heard you many times and Just wanted to let you know here in Charlotte I pray for you and praise you that you're getting the word out because we're just here planting seeds So this is for an old retired 60 year old business guy that's been saved by the blood of Christ ten years ago and I have a word for your listeners that if you haven't tried Jesus give him a chance man, it's a I did everything in the book for 30 years, had all the world to offer. Learjets, big house, still have a lot of that. But at the same time, you'll never find peace, fulfillment, or happiness because the world doesn't offer it. Satan is a liar. So that's what my call is for, Matt. That's right. Okay, well good. Praise God, man. Appreciate you listening. And keep listening. Yeah. Okay. I do. I do. You bet. All right. Praying for you, man. Love you. All right, man. Hey, thanks. You bet. God bless. OK. OK. Bye-bye. All right. Bye. All right. I like that. That's good. Let's get to Glenn from Virginia. We've got calls coming in right now. Let's get to it. Oh, that's right. I've got to say something about the debate on Saturday. We'll get to Eric next, but go ahead. Glenn, go ahead. What do you got, buddy? I have a question because I believe in the gospel. And I've had people ask me this question, if Jesus is in the bloodline of David, how is he connected to the bloodline of David? If he can't be, if he's not, if he doesn't have an earthly mother and an earthly father. No, he has an earthly mother, Mary. I mean, yeah, he has an earthly mother, but no earthly father. Correct, but I have an article written on this on Karm. Okay, if you go to Karm, why are there different genealogies for Jesus in Matthew 1 and Luke 3? What I do is I present the genealogy in Luke, the genealogy in Matthew, and present them in two paragraphs at the top. And then Mary is from Luke, and Joseph is from Matthew. And both the genealogies of Luke and Matthew, you can trace them back to Abraham. But they diverge after David. And so then it goes through one and the other. And then you can check it out, all right? That's what it is, all right. OK. Now, where is that found in the Old Testament? The verses are there. And so you can go and look on that article and you'll see the genealogy, uh, what's listed. All right. It's right there. Okay. All right. Can I ask one more question real fast? We've got a couple of guys waiting. What's up? Okay. The Sabbath day. If you are, you know, a believer in Jesus, are we to keep the Sabbath? yes and no if you want to keep the sabbath and keep it you're not obligated to keep it sabbath is technically on saturday but the christian church moved from saturday to sunday calling it the lord's day because that's the day that jesus rose from the dead in first corinthians sixteen two uh... they're gathering together hearing a message they're tithing and things like that on the first day of the week on sunday and that's uh... how the early church did it as well so you're free to be able to worship on Saturday or Sunday and you go to Romans chapter 14 verses 1 through 12 for that particularly in verse 5 which says each man must be fully convinced in his own mind and is talking about Sabbath days and furthermore Colossians 2.16 or 2.17 oh I didn't get to this I haven't recorded this one in a long time Colossians 2.17 Therefore, let no one act as your judge in regard to food or drink, or in respect to a festival, which is yearly, a new moon, which is monthly, or a Sabbath day, which is weekly. No one can judge you on that. And you go to Romans 14, verse 5, and it says this. One person regards one day above another, another regards every day alike, each person must be fully convinced in his own mind. So you can worship on the Sabbath or not worship on the Sabbath, but you should really have one day of the week that you set aside for the things of God and rest. I think that's good for you, okay? Wasn't he talking to, that was Saul talking to the Gentiles though, right? That was Paul speaking to the Christian church. Yeah. Speaking of the Christian church. Right. OK. Yeah. All right. OK. Go check. Check it out, buddy. All right, man. God bless. All right. Now let's get to Eric. I think I know who this guy is. Hey, Eric, how you doing, man? Hey, Matt, how are you? Doing all right, doing all right. Keep forgetting to mention everything on the radio. Get going. So that's what you're calling. I know. Go ahead and fill us in what's going on. Well, I mean, you're going to be here on Saturday at the Utah Christian Research Center in Draper, Utah. I know for a lot of your people in the South, that doesn't mean a lot unless they want to fly out. But you and your friend Andrew Rappaport are going to be talking about the charismatic gifts. Are they for today? And, uh, I just wanted to let your people know that we have limited seating, but they can come. They can look at our website, utahchristianresearchcenter.com, and they can see the schedule there. I don't think we put the debate on there yet, because we're thinking that's going to be filled out. But if your people want to come, 530 is when the door opens, and then 6 o'clock is when the debate starts, two-hour debate. It's going to be friendly because you guys are friends, and that's the way an in-house debate ought to be. Well, yeah, until after the debate. Andrew and I, we've warred about different things, like buying each other dinner and stuff like that for years. So I know you have about 35, room for 35. What if there's more people shows up, then what? We are going to have to close the doors, because the fire marshal won't want, we just have a limited room. uh... yeah i think one of the they want to see this uh... they probably will need to come earlier we are going to try to film it and it will be it's not going to live stream but it will be up later but uh... yeah i think it's going to be an interesting time and uh... for people to be able to meet you you know in a intimate setting really uh... and then andrew is speaking all that week uh... thursday friday and saturday morning three times each on on thursday and friday and twice on saturday morning And they can go to utahchristianresearchcenter.com and they can see the times. If they're in the Utah area, I know a lot of people here are listening on 820 AM, and if they wanted to come, we have this wonderful center one mile off the freeway. It's within an hour of 75% of the entire state of Utah, the population. 75% of the people can be here in one hour. We're so central. So you've been here before. and spoken here, but yeah, we're looking forward to having Andrew come and having you and him dialogue on an important issue. Well, you know, I got a suggestion for everybody. When they meet Andrew, just tell him that he owes me a lunch and see what he says. Oh, man, classic, the way you guys have... Well, I tell you what, I'm going to barbecue for you on Saturday if you get here early enough before the debate. So come and I'll get you some barbecue. Well, I wanted to come down on Friday, so I'm going to bring a guy, we're going to... Oh, you're coming on Friday? Yeah, it's just easier that way, you know, I can sleep in late. Because if we're coming down on Saturday and there's a road closer, we're going to have problems. So I'll come down on Friday. Yeah, no. All right. And so we look forward to having you come. And yeah, I just, I hope that those of you, the people who are listening in Utah would make it over here and get a chance to meet you and hear what the debate is all about. Now, what are we going to do afterwards? People want to stay and answer. I think we're going to have to debate more all the way through the night, you know. I mean, come over to my backyard and we'll have a great discussion. But yeah, it'll be a fun time. Good time to fellowship. Yeah, you have a nice big house too, and you're very hospitable. And I tell people, because we've got nobody waiting right now, I tell people about you guys, you and Terry, what you did, how you opened up your house to us, when Anique needed, my wife, people don't know my wife's name, Anique, when she needed open-heart surgery. How you opened up your home and displaced yourself for, what, three weeks while we went through the process and everything. I still appreciate it. I mean, of course, I always will. Matt, I always tell you, you would have done the same thing. So we lived, uh, what, 20 minutes away from where the surgery took place. And so it made obvious sense. So yeah, we, we love having you guys and we love a Nick and I haven't seen her in a while. We'd love to someday be able to see her again. But, um, uh, yeah, we love you guys. She wants to go, but she hasn't decided if she can make it because of the drive. Um, so right. It's a long one. It's alone for her. Yeah. Yeah. And plus being stuck in a car with me, that's not good. When the debate gets up online, we'll make sure that your people know about it so they can watch it. And it'll probably be a couple weeks, because we edit the tapes and everything. So we'll get that up, and people will be able to see that later. But yeah, to see a live debate is a lot of fun. All right, so you edit them. So if I slip you some cash, will you make me look better on the edits? I'll put Mickey Mouse. I'll put Mickey Mouse on the tape there for him, and then I'll make you sound really princely. That'd be good. That'd be good. We need all the help we can get. Yeah, it's going to be fun. It's going to be fun. Well, good. All right. All right. Well, Matt, I just wanted to call and let your people know, and thanks for letting me advertise your dialogue debate with Andrew. And you should remember, you're always welcome to call in prompt to whatever and say what's going on with MRM and just let me know. I just, no problem. You always get there. Always get on. All right. Well, people in Utah, make your way over to the Utah Christian Research Center. We're on a Google maps. Uh, we're easy to find and we have a Bible museum here. We have a Christian bookstore. We have, um, uh, displays on, uh, the book of Mormon, the first vision and other things like that. We, we just put up a poster. of the 33 wives of Joseph Smith. That's up on our wall right now. We just put that up a few weeks ago. So we're adding things regularly here. We have a 1615 Geneva Bible, 1634 King James Bible. We've got archaeology here. It's just a lot of fun. We're going to teach you some things when you come through. We'll give you a tour. And it looks really good. I said to Bill when he took me through, I said, you did this? He goes, thanks, Matt. Because it looks so good. Bill McCaber did a great job. He's a visionary. And when he saw the building, we ended up purchasing the whole first floor of this building. And he already knew what he wanted to do before we ever sat down and talked. So he did a great job of laying it out, and together we've got some great things here. And then the room is not huge. Thirty-five people is all we can fit, but every Saturday morning we're having seminars here, and it's working out great. Different local pastors are coming and speaking. I love that, that's great. Okay, God bless. There's your music, we gotta go. Talk to you later, Eric. We'll see you, God bless, man. Thank you so much. See you, man. All right, bye. Okay. Everybody, that was Eric Johnson from mrm.org. And hey, by his grace, we'll be back on tomorrow. We'll talk to you then. God bless, bye. Another program powered by The Truth Network.