We want to welcome you to Abiding in the Vine, the podcast of the pastoral team at Heather Hills Baptist Church. I'm Pastor John Kirby. It's my privilege to host a special edition of our podcast as we interview an extraordinary servant of the Lord who also happens to serve with us here at Heather Hills. you've heard his voice many times on this podcast but now you can hear his story an interesting story and one marked by much grace from god so without further ado uh... we welcome a pastor bob hayes good morning good morning pastor bob we're going to uh... interview you put the spotlight on you uh... you have had uh... many faithful years in ministry and You lived a very interesting life, so we're going to interview you and let people who may not know you into your life a little bit. Okay. So first question here is where were you born? I was born in a little industrial town in Ohio, Hamilton, Ohio, just outside of Cincinnati, just a little ways north. We was raised in just a small town. Now, what kind of kid were you? I really had just a normal childhood. I really had a happy home, and for all intent and purposes, we just, back in those days, we didn't have television and so forth, so the kids just hung on the corner and played their normal kid games. Yeah? Were you like an active child? Very. Very active? Always very hyper. Always very active. Never sat down. I just was wired that way. Really? Yeah. We know. Your motor is still running now. We know that. What did you like to do as a child? Anything in particular? Baseball was a very strong love for me. Basketball, sports in general, but baseball and basketball were the two domineering parts of my growing up. Very good. And you said you had a happy home growing up. Anything else you can say, what kind of home life you had just growing up? We were basically a low-income home. My dad was a stationary engineer working in boilers in hospitals. We never had a lot of money, but we were too poor to know we were poor. The first family car we got when I was in the seventh grade, so I was accustomed to using the bus everywhere we went. But my parents had a happy marriage, and we attended church, and we were just a normal, low-income neighborhood family. So what kind of church was that that you attended? It was an American Baptist church that we went to. So when did you come to know Christ as your Savior? Walk us through that. How did that happen? Our pastor Back in those days. I used to have an opening exercise before Sunday school and the pastor came in for the opening exercise and presented the gospel and I was touched by the presentation and so I raised my hand that I wanted to know Jesus and My Sunday school teacher took me into a room and opened the scriptures and led me to Christ Good And what kind of change about your life when you received Christ? What things did you notice that were new and different, I guess we could say? Well, I was raised in a very strong Roman Catholic neighborhood. And all my buddies, of course, they went to their catechism classes and they would talk about different things, spiritual things, that I didn't know anything about. But when I accepted Christ, I knew that I had something they didn't have. And it wasn't necessarily an evangelistic approach that I took with them, but I did take a stand to let them know that I didn't have to go to confession every Saturday, and I didn't have to have my communion, and all of the things they had to do to know I was saved. And that's where the rubber hit the road with a Roman Catholic neighborhood and one lonely Baptist. Yeah, you knew that you could go to Christ as the one who forgave your sins. Exactly. Yeah, good, good. So is it kind of there that your hunger for the Word of God started at that point? I think basically yes, my parents plugged into a new church being started in our neighborhood and so my parents got involved in helping to plant that church. And that's where I really began to want to know about the scriptures, a very godly pastor, loved the Lord, an expositor. I had never been exposed to expository preaching before. And it was just a great experience. And my dad was a charter member of that church. And actually, that pastor counseled me into ministry later on in years. Wow. Yeah, that's amazing. Alright, so moving on a little bit here. How did you meet your wife Claudia? I met her in church. I had been in the military for five years and while I was gone her folks started coming to the church where I had been going and when I came home She was singing in a choir, and I asked my mother who that choir girl was. So as it turned out, we met and began dating. She had just graduated from high school and was going into nurses school in Cincinnati. So we dated then when she started into nurses school for about four years before we got married. Isn't it in my recollection that you got engaged at Castle? Yeah. In Cincinnati there's a park called Alt Park and when I'd go down to the dormitory in Cincinnati in the evening times when she was in training There wasn't a whole lot to do, so we'd go to Alt Park and there was a castle there that had been established as part of the scenery for the park. There were some stairs that you could walk up on the top of the castle. I had it all planned out and I took her up to the top of the castle. proposed to her and she accepted him. That's pretty romantic. Not many men have a good story like that. That's a good one. How long have you been married? How many years? We'll be 48 this year. That's great. Praise the Lord for that. And how many children and grandchildren do you have? I have three children. All parents and each of the three children have two children of their own. So I have three kids and six grandkids. Very good. Alright, now back to this baseball player thing. I think you're a pretty good baseball player. Tell us about you playing baseball or your baseball playing days. What position do you play? I played center field and I played on several championship teams. I was privileged to hook up with guys that were pretty gifted and pretty talented in that regard. In the Cincinnati area, we played a lot of ball. As I say, I played center field and I batted around 300. My peers encouraged me to try to go into AAA ball but I got a job when I got out in my senior year of high school and I didn't pursue it although many have said they wished I would have. Now you're a lefty? through lefty and batted lefty? No, I batted right. Oh, you batted right. Well, my dad taught me how to bat, and he was right-handed, so... Okay. But, yeah. A little unique there. Yeah. Now, you're also in the military, right? Ah, yes. Tell us how that came about. How'd you sign up for that, and where and when did you serve? Well, after I graduated from high school, I knew that I wanted to go to the military. and get that behind me. So I joined the Naval Air Corps after the summer was over in 1957. And while I was in there, I was in five years, and I worked on jet aircraft. I was stationed in Maryland, California, Oklahoma, Japan in a five-year period of time. I was on a carrier part of that time, and the rest of the time I was on naval air bases. I came out as an E-5, which is A fairly good accomplishment for a first-hitch sailor. Any good military stories you could tell us, sir? Basically, the one that always jumps off the page, when we were over in Japan, we were going to have a squadron party and I didn't want to go. I was not a drinker and my division officer said, you will go to the party. and we're going to play some tag football." So we were playing tag football and he was a middle guard for some large college. He built like Anyway, he took me out and broke my leg and I spent three days in the hospital and walking on a cask for like four or five weeks. So that's the one memory I have of military life that I didn't want to go and I ended up, I was ordered to go. and ended up with a broken leg. So you were a good soldier. You obeyed your superior's orders despite the foolishness of them, right? Oh yeah. Paul likens being a Christian to being a good soldier. What are some ways being a Christian is like being a soldier or being in the military? Well, I think probably a couple of things come to mind. Discipline is very important. That was the one thing the military taught me. I was very undisciplined when I went in. I was just a typical kid, and I didn't like taking orders, and I didn't like somebody telling me what to do. But about two or three weeks into boot camp, I learned that that was not going to be the way it was going to be for the next few years. So discipline was important and then study and use of the training, the things that I was taught, I used and in my days on the carrier, I was up on the flight deck and that's some place you better know what you're doing or you're going to get killed. And as I remember the first time I was on the flight deck, we had about 22 planes taken off that day. And I didn't know which way to go, and I just shadowed one of the other mechanics. But I had been taught what to do, and I just had not been put into that arena. So basically, use of the training was something that I had to really understand, because that's an easy place to get hurt. Then I think confidence to be on top of your foe. The military trains us to be assertive and aggressive against an enemy and you know the scriptures teach us the same thing. We are in a spiritual warfare and I think basically As Christ is the captain of my life, I follow his teaching. So the military has a lot of things in common with the spiritual life and spiritual warfare. Yeah, good. That'll help us kind of turn the corner here, too, that the Lord is our master, and just like in the military, you're the one under command. As Christians, we're people under command. Now let's kind of transition. How did you go from being under the command of military commanders to being called into the ministry, the Lord's army, so to speak, under the tutelage of the scriptures and the shepherding of the Great Shepherd to be his under-shepherd? How did that happen? Where did you go to seminary? Kind of tell about your call to ministry and maybe your preparation for ministry. When I got back from the military and met my wife, just before we got married, I took a job with General Motors there in Hamilton, Ohio. And I just felt burdened to do something in the plant to let my testimony be seen. So I started a morning prayer breakfast with any of the men that wanted to join. There were two or three of the executives of the plant and here I was a boxcar loader and they came at six o'clock in the morning. Our church was in route to the plant so I'd open the church up and we'd have coffee and have a prayer meeting and then little by little I just felt like General Motors is a great place to work, but I don't want to do this the rest of my life. So we prayed about it and then I counseled with my pastor and he pulled some strings to get me in Bible college because I was not a good high school student. I did not like school. I just liked sports and girls. So basically I was not a good student and my record would not have gotten me in a college. But he wrote a very strong letter to Moody Bible Institute and I was accepted at Moody for a time and then I went ahead and we got married. After we got married, I still felt like full-time services were the Lord was leading. In the meantime, in my local church, I was put on the deacon board and the trustee board, and I was a Sunday school superintendent. I was doing a lot of the things that a laity does, but I still was not happy. So finally my pastor said, you know, why don't you just get serious and get your degree and go in ministry, which I did. I went to Detroit Bible College and ultimately I got my undergraduate degree. My first church was a student pastorate in Redford, Michigan, which is outside of Detroit, and I pastored there two years as a student. And then when I graduated, I got my first full-time church in Ohio. And then after I was there five years, and then I went to Byrne, Indiana from Ohio. And I went to Byrne because I wanted to go to Grace Seminary. So Grace was about 50 miles away from Bern, so I went to Grace Seminary part-time while I was pastoring. I was there eight years in Bern. I didn't finish my degree in Grace Seminary, so I finished it in a program in Huntington, Indiana. Huntington School of Ministry so I got my master's degree in that and then just continued going to take courses along the way to continue to help myself. Now how many total years have you been in pastoral ministry? well counting the student ministry in nineteen seventy three animal it'll be forty years this year that's amazing praise the lord for that that's great forty forty years of faithfulness that's really uh... you know god's grace in you and and also uh... you know as you work out your salvation with fear and trembling that's uh... it's commendable for for uh... your longevity as well we and we in these last years, recent years, have been the beneficiaries of your ministry. So, praise the Lord for that. Tell us a little bit about your ministry in Bern. You said you were there for, what, eight years? Yeah. What kind of things did you learn there? What kind of ministry was that? Byrne was probably the heart of my ministry full-time. It was a community of 3,000 people plus 1,000 Amish. And I had never been around an Amishman. And the church was right square in the middle of an Amish community, surrounded by horses and buggies and all of that. And I raised three children there. They went to junior and senior high there. And that's where I completed my master's degree. And the people in the community, There were 23 churches in a town of 3,000, so there were a lot of people wanting to serve the Lord there. I also taught in the high school part-time for some added finances, so Byrne is just a wonderful place to raise your kids. I was involved in what is known as the IFCA, Independent Fundamental Churches of America. I was an officer in that for about four years. Bern was a wonderful time in my life for me to look back on. Yeah, now you mentioned two things. You mentioned a growing family and the fact that finances might have been a little tough. So I think that kind of segues us to our next topic, the next facet of your life. You're a licensed nursing home administrator, is that correct? Yes. So kind of tell us about how you got into that and I may have seeded that a little bit. But tell us about your getting into that and your experience as a nursing home administrator. My children are all 18 months apart in age. So when they graduated from high school, naturally the next step was going to be college. So I had at one time three kids in college. And financially, there was just no way that we could keep up with that. And so ultimately when I left the church, it burned. I went into an internship program for nursing home administrators that was a six month internship and then following that I had to take a state and federal examination and once I got that behind me then The company that had given me the internship placed me in a nursing home up in LaGrange, Indiana. And the next thing I know I'm getting involved in a ministry because The company gave me the latitude to run the nursing home in a Christian way. I had a Bible study. I had a staff that I controlled their language and I basically didn't put up with a lot of things that secular employment does. The company liked that it was good for marketing for them so as it turned out I was I have learned so many things from working with the senior population that That was a natural transition to what I've been doing here at Heather Hills for the last nine years because the training with hospitals and in declining health and Dementias and strokes and heart attacks and all of that. That's really a lot of what I do right now with our congregation is Work with people that are shut in and hospitalized and all of that. It was a wonderful training ground it was my Moses on the backside of the desert kind of training and it was invaluable to me and as i look at my ministry now you know it's amazing to see how the lord in his providence took a situation that uh... may not have seemed uh... you know the best at the time uh... you probably enjoying a wonderful ministry there at burn and uh... you know getting out of that for uh... financial reasons pressures uh... but yet having the lord allow you to to still minister have Bible studies and use your gifts in that regard and provide for your family, but also to be prepared for future ministry, what you're doing here. I guess what Genesis 50-20 comes to mind, you know, what men meant for evil, God means for good. You didn't necessarily maybe think that was the most beneficial thing at the time, but it really has come full circle. The Lord has used that And I didn't see it on the horizons. That's the irony of it all. I would have never guessed that he was preparing me for a different kind of ministry altogether. It's wonderful. I love it. Yeah, praise the Lord for his providence. He sees all things and he knows all things and he does all things well. Now that brings us to Heather Hills. How did you come to Heather Hills Baptist Church and then how did you come on staff? Well, I was operating a nursing home in Indianapolis and my wife was also a licensed nursing home administrator and she had a transitional care unit in Hancock County Hospital. She opened that unit. So as we were looking for a church to worship, we came to Heather Hills. We were here a couple of years and I didn't get involved in any active ministry here because I wasn't sure how the pastor at that time felt about another pastor being in the church, so I wanted to walk lightly. I didn't want to intimidate or threaten or coerce. So we didn't do much the first two years except just worship. I didn't teach anything in the way of Bible classes then one day I was approached and asked could I Take a Wednesday night service for two or three weeks in in a particular series, which I was glad to do and And that just went from that to then I was asked to be on the leadership team and get involved with different ministries and it was wonderful because I had been kind of idle for two years with active ministry except in my nursing home. I still had things going on there. So as it turned out, Then I was approached to see if I was interested in coming on staff and by that time I was looking to phase out of the nursing home field because my kids were all through college and now had kids of their own. And the bills were all paid from the college debts. So I thought this is a good time to get away from the ministry of nursing home and back into the Lord's ministry. So I accepted the position of minister to senior adults here at Heather Hills Baptist Church. And it's been a honeymoon for me. It has just been wonderful. Yeah, it's amazing to see the grace of God on your life, how He's taken you from, well, the domain of darkness, really, you know, being in that heavily Catholic-influenced area, very works-righteousness-based system, bringing you into the domain of His Son, the Kingdom of Light. And we've seen your Acceptance of Christ as your Savior at a young age. We've seen how the Lord changed you from one who would rely on his own works, but possibly one who is forgiven by the Savior, one who has been given a love for God's Word, one who's been called into ministry, called into a wonderful relationship with your wife. And so I guess through all your years of pastoral ministry, I know this is hard to do, to boil it down, what are maybe a few things that stick out that the Lord has taught you? What sticks out the most in your mind right now through all your years of pastoral ministry, of the Lord's lessons? I think the first thing is to preach the truth no matter what because in my ministry I'm a little bit strong headed and I have pretty strong convictions and trying to be tactful and still maintain integrity has been kind of a stumbling block for me. I have just buried in to say I'm going to preach the truth no matter what. That's kind of my motto. And then also to trust the Lord even when it seems impossible to keep going. I went through some dark days in a couple of places in my ministry that were very difficult times. accepted the fact that we were where God wanted us and we were going to, even though it seemed impossible, we were just going to trust Him through it. And then I think the last thing I think of is that Christ is going to build his church no matter what and He's privileged me to be part of that That's good. Yeah, that humility. That's That's wonderful. Now. What is your favorite passage of scripture to teach? What do you what do you enjoy teaching most? Well I really, I don't know, is I have a favorite subject to teach. Is it the one that you're doing right now? That's always my case is my favorite thing to teach is the one that I'm teaching right now. Well, that's kind of true. I've been teaching the epistles of Thessalonians, 1st and 2nd Thessalonians in the evening service here at Heather Hills for the last five Sunday nights and we're going to begin 2nd Thessalonians this Sunday. So yeah, that's kind of a favorite thing right now. I spend a lot of time in preparation and I get more out of it than they do, I know, ultimately. Yeah, that's the truth. As ministers, we are blessed. More than we bless. Do you have any goals that you still haven't attained that you'd like to attain? If so, what are they? Well, as I think about that question, at age 74, I know I'm in the twilight years of my ministry, but I also know that I'm another step closer to seeing Christ. And like Paul, that is the ultimate goal of every believer, is to see the eyes of Christ. And I think that's kind of the way I would answer that question as goals. Yeah, no, that's good. I mean, that's every Christian's vision is to see the Lord and to finish strong in that sense. So that's wonderful. Yeah. What's an area that you can see where we can improve here at Heather Hills? From your vast wisdom and experience of 40 years of pastoral ministry, what admonition would you give to the church here at Heather Hills? outreach from the church. We have certain initiatives and as we look at these initiatives, one of them that we wanted to see done here at Heather Hills is a counseling center. And I think that that would greatly improve the ministry and the opportunities of our neighborhood. There's a lot of need, whether it's marital counseling or chemical abuse counseling. There are just so many things. And I think that would improve the ministry here at Heather Hills greatly. And what do you see as a key to the sustained future of Heather Hills? Well, that seems pretty simple to me. First off, continue teaching truth. And secondly, to continue training the people to ministry. Our pastor is very into training disciples and certainly that is the commission that Christ gave us but to continue training means that we're looking forward outside the walls of today And that's going to happen when we get people in step, and it goes back to my military days. I was trained to do certain things because down the road I was going to need those things. And as we train young men here and young women here, I think that that is a key to the future of Heather Hills Baptist Church, is to train people to ministry. It's interesting you should bring up back the military because we do need to ask you this one last question. Give us the background and maybe the history or the comings about of your title of Watashi Boy. I was stationed in Japan for a year when we were offloaded from the carrier and I learned a little bit of the Japanese language and Watashi in Japanese means I or myself or me and somehow I just kind of picked that up as When I talk to people and I want to say something about myself, I always say, well, Watashi Boy wants to do this, or Watashi Boy wants to do that. And in fact, one time we had a guest group from Japan came into one of the churches where I was, and I said something about Watashi Boy, and they looked right up and said, oh, this guy, he's a round eye, and he understands the word Watashi Boy. I laughed right out loud at that one. That's good. It's one of the many hazisms that we have enjoyed learning from you. Well, thank you for letting us interview you. We just praise the Lord for your ministry here at Heather Hills. We praise the Lord for your faithfulness throughout 40 years of ministry. And we look forward to what the Lord has in store in the future. We'd like to thank everyone who's been listening to this special edition of Abiding in the Vine. If you'd like to contact us or get more information about our ministry here at Heather Hills on the east side of Indianapolis, you can visit us on the web, www.heatherhills.org. Thanks for listening.