Have you ever seen a news story that makes you so upset that bothers you so greatly that it really impacts your emotions for maybe a day, two days, three days, maybe for an entire week. It really makes you emotional. Maybe other people don't get it. Maybe many of you don't even understand that you've never encountered that. But if I'm being honest with you right now, the news article that I saw yesterday has me so upset and so bothered that I've had a hard time really trying to do anything else because I've been like, what? What can I do? And the answer is, I can't do anything. I can't change it. There's nothing I can do about it. And I know that many of those who listen to this program, they are celebrating it. They think it's wonderful. They think it's great. They probably think it's, I don't know, some wonderful gift from God. Who knows how they're going to interpret it, but there are at least some of us, and I'm hoping there are many more. I'm hoping there are a lot of Christians who are bothered by this. My fear is, and really the reason I'm so upset by this news story, is because I think many Christians are not going to be bothered by it. And that may be even more troubling than the news story itself. And we're going to talk about it, and I'm going to do the best I can to talk about this in a rational, Maybe there's going to be a motion, but maybe not two. I'm going to try to keep my emotions in check. That's what I'm going to do. And we'll do all of that right after I say good afternoon, everyone. It is Tuesday, January the 21st, 2025. It is currently 2.40 p.m. Central Time. And I'm coming to you live from the Theology Central studio located right here in Abilene, Texas. Now I'm going to begin by reading, I'm going to be kind of referencing some scriptures. I'll be kind of reading them, some of them direct, some of it I'll just be kind of summarizing and just offering a few scriptures that's going to kind of really try to frame this from a biblical and theological perspective. I want you to hear that again. I'm going to reference some scriptures right here. I'm going to offer a summary of some of these scriptures because I want to frame this discussion in a biblical and theological perspective. I mean, this podcast is called Theology Central. So as you listen, if this offends your political ideology, I'm just going to be blunt, I don't care because I'm not here to support or promote your political ideology. I am here to look at maybe a political ideology from a theological and biblical perspective. I think we just need to get that out of the way. Let's begin by at least referencing Psalm 82. Psalm 82. Now, depending on your Bible, if you have any kind of like a chapter heading or anything, my Bible in Psalm 82 is entitled right here, Unjust Judges. Unjust Judges. That's Psalm 82. Kind of the chapter heading is Unjust Judges. Not all Bibles have that, but you can tell kind of what this chapter is at least referencing. Here's one, kind of like a quote from Psalm 82 verses 1 through 4, maybe more of a paraphrase, but it reads like this, God has taken his place in the divine council. In the midst of the gods, he holds judgment. How long will you judge unjustly and show partiality to the wicked? Give justice to the weak and the fatherless. Maintain the right of the afflicted and the destitute. Rescue the weak and the needy. Deliver them from the hand of the wicked. Let me read this again to you one more time, all right? Listen carefully. How long will you judge unjustly and show partiality to the wicked? I think most people, if we just set aside this news article that has gotten me so upset, if we set aside the news article, set aside politics, if I was just to ask you, if someone issues a judgment that is unjust, does that not bother you? I think it would. If someone in power shows partiality to those who do wrong, those who have done wickedly, would that bother you? I think most of you would say, yes, it would bother me. I want justice. I don't want partiality to be shown to people who've done something wrong. It bothers me. In Psalm 82, 1-4, the psalmist on behalf of the oppressed pleads with God to rebuke unjust rulers and judges who favor the wicked and fail to protect the vulnerable. Isaiah 59, three through 15. Again, just reading parts of it, not reading everything, because if I read all of these passages, then it'll turn into a lengthy discussion, but I'm at least setting kind of the foundation and kind of just setting kind of what this is really, the perspective in which I'm going to look at this news article that we're going to talk about, all right? Isaiah 59, three through 15. It reads like this in some parts, "...justice is turned back, righteousness stands far away, the truth has stumbled in the public square, and uprightness cannot enter. Truth is lacking, and he who departs from evil makes himself a prey." Isaiah describes the societal breakdown where justice and righteousness are absent. The people acknowledge their sins but also cry out over the consequences. Truth is rejected and those who pursue righteousness are persecuted. Societal breakdown. Listen to this. Justice is turned back. Righteousness stands far away. The truth has stumbled in the public square. How about Ecclesiastes 3, 16-17? Moreover, I saw under the sun that in the place of justice, even there was wickedness. that again? I saw under the sun that in the place of justice even there was wickedness and in the place of righteousness even there was wickedness. The author in Ecclesiastes 3 is observing the corruption of justice and earthly courts and affirms that ultimate judgment will come from God who sees all. And all of these passages, we have some crying out for justice, decrying injustice, decrying partiality, saying that it is wrong. And I think most of us would agree, at least in some level, that we don't like that. We don't want that. We want some sense of justice, some sense of fairness. We don't want partiality. I think we can all say that. at least to some level, because if you throw out justice, you throw that all out, then just injustice reigns. And if there is no justice and there is, and we're just, and it's a kind of just anarchy, well, that may be great if your side is in control for a little bit, but guess what? I guess you can run around doing whatever you want, but when the other side starts doing the same thing, it turns into total anarchy and chaos, and nobody should want that. Now imagine, Now that sets up kind of the framework here, right? How we're gonna look at this. Now I want you to imagine you are a police officer and you've been given a job to provide security to a specific building, to a specific area. Your job is to protect. Your job is to ensure the right people get in and the wrong people stay out. Your job is to ensure that the people inside are safe. That's your job, right? And one day, you are attacked by a mob of people. You are knocked unconscious. You are tased with a taser. You then, not only are you unconscious, you have a heart attack because of being tased with the taser. Unconscious, tased with the taser, heart attack. All of this happens to you. And all you were trying to do was do your job. Now, what if you were to find out that that happens to you, unconscious, tase with the taser, heart attack? What if you were to find out later that, hey, those people who attacked you, guess what? And the president of the United States has just issued a pardon to them. They get to go free. Sorry. You shouldn't have, what you should have done is not done your job. You should have just walked away, let them in and do whatever they want to do because it was meaningless that you tried to provide security for people. It was meaningless that you tried to uphold the law because the law doesn't matter. How would you feel? yesterday a specific police officer had to deal with that very reality. Let me read exactly what the reaction and what exactly took place. A former police officer, no longer a police officer, who lost consciousness, suffered a heart attack after a rioter shocked him with a stun gun, appeared stunned to learn from an Associated Press reporter that those who assaulted police officers are among the pardon recipients. Now, who gave the pardon? Donald Trump pardoned rioters who attacked this police officer. He lost consciousness. He suffered a heart attack after being shocked with a stun gun. And he was shocked when he found out, wait, the people who attacked me were pardoned? He stated, this is what the American people voted for? How do you react to something like that? Now, if you don't know what I'm referring to, President Trump issued a sweeping pardon of 1,500 people, including rioters who attacked police. These 1,500 people who were pardoned were part of the January 6th riot. attack upon the Capitol? What words would make you feel better?" And here's a picture of him holding up, I guess, the pardon. President Donald Trump on Monday, pardoned or commuted the prison sentences of all 1,500 plus people charged with crimes in the January the 6th, 2021 US Capitol riot, including people convicted of seditious conspiracy and assaulting police officers, using his clemency power on his first day back in office to undo the massive prosecution of the unprecedented assault on the seat of American democracy. Trump's actions just hours after he returned to the White House paves the way for the release from prison of dozens of people found guilty of violent attacks on police, as well as leaders of far-right extremist groups convicted of a failed plot to keep the Republican power after he lost the 2020 election to the former President Joe Biden. Now, I could go through and read this entire article, but as soon as I saw this article, among many others, my daughter was sending me a lot of them. She was like, this is insane. Look, I'm just going to be honest with you. There was an anger that rose up in me that I don't even have words for. So basically what we're saying is, hey, hey guys, if your person loses an election, just go try to attack the people who's gonna certify the vote because it's a free for all. As long as your side wins the election, then you'll get pardoned. That's the way we wanna do things? That's what we call justice? That's what we call what is right in this country? Now, look, I'm all for Satanist, atheist, agnostics, anybody of any other religion justifying it, saying, hey, it's about winning. It's about maintaining power. Who cares about morality? Who cares about right and wrong? You know what? I'm all for you doing that and thinking that way, because that would be consistent with possibly your worldview. But when it comes to Christians, when it comes to the church, What happened on January 6th should have been majorly upsetting to Christians. But I listen to Christian radio, excuse it, come up with conspiracy theories to explain it away, claim that the people who were arrested and went to jail were being persecuted somehow for their faith. I don't even know what that even means. But I've sat back and I've been quiet about it because I don't like getting involved in it. Because as soon as I talk about it, It turns into this weird where Christians will argue with me and all you see is that they're defending their God, Donald Trump. All they see is that they defend their God, the Republican party. And it makes me just sick of being anywhere part of any Christianity that has become so politically hijacked. I don't even want to talk to Christians about it because almost inevitably they're on the side of the January 6 rioters or they'll say, well, I think they were just misunderstood or well, I just think that they're going overboard. Tell that police officer. So now there's a little bit of my emotion. I wanted to get my emotions a little bit out of the way. Now, let's try to discuss this in a rational way and a biblical and theological way, all right? Now, to summarize, on January the 20th, 2025, President Donald Trump issued pardons to over 1,500 individuals charged in connection with the January 6, 2021 Capitol attack, including those convicted of assaulting law enforcement officers. This action has significant implications for law, order, and justice. Let's start with the legal authority and the precedent here. Now, the U.S. Constitution does grant the president the power to issue pardons for federal offenses. Historically, presidents have exercised this authority to correct judicial error or to show mercy. However, Mass pardons, especially for individuals involved in actions against democratic institutions, are unprecedented. Legal experts express concern that such broad use of clemency could undermine the judiciary's role and the principle of accountability. You think it could undermine it? Absolutely. What are the impacts on law and order? Well, the pardons effectively nullify the legal consequences for those involved in the Capitol attack, which resulted in injuries to over 140 police officers and significant property damage. But hey, who cares if you're a police officer and attacked? We don't care. Oh, we support our law enforcement. Well, unless we need to attack you so that we can try to get into the Capitol building to stop the peaceful transfer of power because our president didn't win and we're mad. So we're going to act like children, we're going to act like absolute criminals, but we support law enforcement. Oh, you support law enforcement until you don't support law enforcement. You're pro-law enforcement until you're not pro-law enforcement. And don't get me, well, what about this and what about this? Pointing to bad behavior to justify bad behavior is a logical fallacy. Law enforcements warn that this could embolden future unlawful actions. You think so? I think it should. I think it could. I mean, it should, just logically, as the lack of consequences may diminish the deterrent effect of legal penalties. U.S. Attorney Matthew Graves emphasized that while pardons remove legal penalties, they cannot erase the established facts and accountability determined through judicial process. Well, it may not erase the facts, but I don't know if you realize this, everyone from Christian Radio to pastors have been erasing the facts about January 6th starting about January the 7th. And again, I want to make it very clear. I'm more concerned with this about how it impacted Christianity. Those outside of Christianity go for it, say, yeah, burn down the Capitol, kill whoever we want. I don't, you don't have any Christian rules or morality to govern what you do. Oh, that's all fine. But for Christians, we're like, whoa, wait a minute, wait a minute. We need to look at this from a theological perspective, from a biblical perspective. And it's amazing, Christians want the government now to pass law saying, you can't do this, or you can't do that, or we want to end this, and we don't want homosexual marriage, and we don't want this, and we don't want this taught in school, and we want these books banned. So we want to pass laws that other people have to obey. Oh, we want to end abortion. Why should anyone obey any law if you're going to support people trying to break into the Capitol to stop the peaceful transfer of power? If you don't want to support those laws, then why are you passing other laws for other people to keep? How about we just get rid of all laws and it just be complete anarchy? How about that? imagine what Christians would be saying if a mob of people tried to break into your church and try to stop things. You'd be screaming, this is persecution, this is not right. The Implications for Justice Justice is rooted in the fair application of laws and holding the individuals accountable for their actions. By pardoning individuals convicted of serious offenses, including seditious conspiracy, the pardons may be perceived as undermining the justice system's efforts to address the events of January 6. Critics argue that this sets a concerning precedent where political considerations override judicial outcomes, potentially eroding public trust and the impartiality of the justice system. While the presidential pardon is a legitimate tool, its application in this context raises complex questions about the balance between executive authority, principle of law and order and justice, the long-term effects of these pardons on the rule of law and public confidence in the justice system remain to be seen." Now, what if we look at this, that's kind of looking at from law, justice, order, that's kind of looking at more from a societal perspective. How about from a theological perspective? Now, if we look at this pardon, pardons of over almost 1600 people, if we look at this from a theological perspective, this would involve us evaluating principles like justice, mercy, and accountability. So let's consider this. First, biblical principles on justice and authority. What about God's view on justice? The Bible consistently emphasizes justice as central to God's character. For example, Isaiah 6.18, for I, the Lord, love justice. I hate robbery and wrongdoing. Justice requires that wrongdoing be appropriately addressed and not ignored or dismissed. The concept of justice includes accountability for actions. Whomever sheds the blood of man, by man shall his blood be shed, for God made man in his image. This reflects God's desire for proportional consequences. That's Genesis 9.6. So I think we can say God has a strong view of justice. And the Bible cries out when there's injustice, or people in the Bible cry out when there's injustice. We'll look at a lot of scripture, but you get the idea. I think we can say the Bible seems to be a book that would uphold the idea of justice. rioting and breaking into the Capitol building and doing all the things that were done, I think you can argue, injustice. Now, listen, you can go through the 1600 people, right? And you can say, well, what about this person? And I got no problem say, well, maybe that person, okay, did they deserve to go to jail for what they did? Okay, what about this person? But when you just do a blanket pardon, even for people who are guilty for violent assault upon police officers, come on, I think even though, I would hope anyone who's a Christian who's also like, Trump, Trump, Trump, Trump, would be like, well, okay, maybe that's a little too far. Come on, can we at least agree on that? How about accountability and responsibility? Romans 13, one through four. I know it used to teach this. It used to teach that governing authorities are established by God. Do you remember a long time ago when people used to believe that? I know it seems like a hundred years ago, but there used to be a time that Christians believed that Romans 13, one through four taught that governing authorities were established by God and they were there to punish wrongdoing and to maintain order. This implies that leaders have a divine responsibility to uphold justice, not to subvert it for personal or political gain. someone's going to be like, but what about, but what about, but you can do the what about-ism at some other time. For now, can we address this issue? The government has a responsibility here not to pardon those who attack people trying to protect. And what about the rioters themselves? How about justice and partiality? Scripture warns against partiality in administering justice. You shall do no injustice in court. You shall not be partial to the poor or defer to the great, but in righteousness shall you judge your neighbor, Leviticus 19.15. Pardons must not show favoritism or undermine justice for political reasons. You can't do that. Now that's looking at everything from the perspective of justice and authority. How about we look at it from mercy? And does mercy have limits? Well, mercy is a key biblical value. I think we can agree with that. Matthew 5, 7, blessed are the merciful for they shall receive mercy. But does mercy negate justice? Or does it work alongside it? Now, this can get complicated, right? Because on one hand, I'm all for showing mercy. We should show mercy in every situation. But isn't it amazing how Christians will be like, well, in this case, we show mercy. In this case, no mercy. Now typically we would say those, you know, it would be one thing if you've got those who participated in the January the 6th riot who are like, man, I don't know what I was thinking. I was wrong. I renounced what I did. It was, I am never going to do anything like that again. And you, and you see sincerity and they really, they really don't, they're going to move away from this crazy radical political ideology that would cause them to engage in that. Then show mercy. I'm all for pardons there. But if they show no mercy and they're like, I would do it again tomorrow, Trump, Trump, Trump, then okay, then you know what? Maybe not. There's gotta be something. Pardons typically can reflect mercy when applied to those who repent or show genuine contrition. However, indiscriminate pardons without regard for repentance may not reflect biblical mercy. It may actually be a distortion of it. How about the dangers of injustice? Micah 6, 8 calls believers to do justice, love mercy, and walk humbly with God. Pardons that appear to ignore justice could perpetuate a culture of lawlessness and rebellion. Isaiah 5, 20 warns against calling evil good and good evil. Actions that absolve individuals from accountability for serious offenses, particularly those involving violence and harm, risk falling into this category. Do justice, but love mercy. Walk humbly with God. I mean, those are specific things that we should be trying to uphold here and looking at this. Christians are called to model God's justice and God's mercy. Pardons that bypass justice challenge the church to speak prophetically against actions that undermine truth and righteousness. Is the church going to stand up and say, wait, wait, wait, this may not be right, but no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. See, we would do that if it was Biden, but if it's Trump, oh no, he's basically God. From a biblical and theological perspective, mass pardons, particularly for those involved in acts of violence or rebellion, risks undermining justice and accountability, which are essential biblical principles. While mercy is vital, it must not come at the expense of justice or appear to condone sin. Believers are called to uphold both justice and mercy in a way that reflects God's character and challenging actions that compromise these values. just going through some more, I'm just gonna go through a list of scriptures here. Micah 6, 8, he has told you, oh man, what is good and what does the Lord require of you, but to do justice, to love kindness and to walk humbly with your God. This verse highlights God's expectation for justice, kindness and humility. It definitely serves as a framework for discussing the balance of personal and societal responsibility for justice. How about Isaiah 117? Learn to do good, seek justice, correct oppression, bring justice to the fatherless, and plead the widow's cause. This verse is a direct call to action, showing that justice involves active efforts to correct wrongs and protect the vulnerable. Now, of course, in Isaiah 117 has specific historical context to Israel at that time, but we still need to learn to do good and seek justice and correct oppression, should we not? Should we not be bothered by these types of things? Amos 5.24, let justice roll down like waters and righteousness like an ever-flowing stream. Should we not long for some type of unstoppable justice, some kind of abundant justice? We looked at Psalm 82, give justice to the weak and the fatherless, maintain the right of the afflicted and the destitute, rescue the weak and the needy, deliver them from the hand of the wicked. The scriptures are filled with this. Proverbs 21, 15, when justice is done, it is a joy to the righteous, but terror to evildoers. Ecclesiastes 3, verse 16, moreover, I saw under the sun that in the place of justice, even there was wickedness. And in the place of righteousness, even there was wickedness. I said in my heart, God will judge the righteous and the wicked, for there is a time for every matter and for every work. The scriptures are filled with this call for justice or crying out when there's injustice. And here we are, we wake up and, well, hey, I'm now the president, so I'm going to pardon all these people who were involved in a riot and an attack upon the Capitol, an attack upon an institution working for the peaceful transfer of power. Now, if you want to pardon that, you want to justify that, then okay. Then let's just throw out basically any law. Let's not go after anyone for anything. I don't have words for it. The whole situation just, even just talking about it, I'm exhausted. I'm just exhausted over it. And I know we're just getting started. We got four more years in front of us now of Christians running around, defending it, defending everything Trump says, everything Trump does. It's going to be viewed as basically coming from the throne room of God. And I know we're going to have to go through it again. And you can't say anything because the people who are Trump supporters, you say anything like, no, that's not true. No, that's not true. Trump's never done anything wrong in his entire life. He's basically God. How dare you criticize him? And you say, well, that's a, that sounds like a little bit of an exaggeration. Not much. For many Christians, as much as they would deny it all day, but I think they've traded in the cross for a red hat. Not in all cases, but in many. And many say, no, no. They say no, and then they turn around and defend and defend. And any criticism, like, that's not fair. That's not right. Well, that's just misunderstood. And they make every excuse under the sun. We pardon people. broke into the Capitol. But we want to make sure we don't pardon anyone who breaks in across the border. You cross the border, we want you gone. Build the wall. Get rid of them. But if you break into the Capitol, hey, that's okay. I don't know. I just, I don't know where we go from here. You know where we go from here? This is what is going to happen. There's going to be the Christians who support Trump and everything. They're going to excuse everything, and their Christianity is going to become more and more politically driven. Their Christianity is going to become more influenced by political ideology. Christian nationalism is going to grow, and we're going to see that whole movement move. They're going to try to institute laws and tell everyone how to behave, and you can't do this, and you can't watch this, and you can't read this, and no, no, no, no, no, no, no. And you can't do this because we want to impose our morality on everyone else. So we're going to see a rise of that. We're going to see a more politically emboldened and more politically energized church. You're going to see a kind of a Christian nationalist mindset that's going to explode over the next four years. they'll have their day and we'll see what they do with it, right? We'll see what we do. For those who don't want a politically hijacked Christianity, you may have a hard time. I don't know. You may look at your church and go, what in the world is going on? And you may have to go somewhere else. I think that's a very fair thing to say. Right? And there's going to become division amongst Christians. You're going to have those Christians used to be like, just never mind. Just don't talk to me. Because it's political politics, politics, Trump, Trump, Trump, Trump, Trump, Trump, Trump, Fox News, Fox News, Fox News. And it's just like, OK, never mind. They're in a different world. I don't know. So that's, we're going to see this. Now, how do we respond to it? Well, on one hand, you can dedicate 24 hours a day, seven days a week to trying to call out all the misinformation, the disinformation, trying to call this out and correct it. And to me, that's that plays right into the hand of it, right? Because then what you would have is you would have the politically hijacked Christianity, right? And so it basically destroying pure Christianity because it becomes something else. So you'll have that, and then you'll have those trying to fight it. you'll have a Christianity dedicated to fighting the politically hijacked Christianity, but if you dedicate all of your time trying to fight the politically hijacked Christianity, in a sense, you become politically hijacked as well. So really, then there's no Christianity either place. I think my approach is going to be, when I need to, I may address something, but for the most part, I'm just going to put my head down and move forward, and we're going to talk about scripture and hermeneutics and Bible interpretation and review sermons, and we're just going to go that direction. We're going to try to continue to—I'm going to be more concerned with the hermeneutical issues inside the church, how they can't handle Isaiah chapter 40, 41, 42, 43. I guess Isaiah 40 through 55 is impossible to handle. We're going to talk about those kinds of things. We're going to try to stay focused and not get caught up, because look, I could go through every little issue that's going to happen over the next four years, and you could spend your life just trying to respond to it and respond to it. And where does that put people? Either you're going to go listen to the Christianity that's politically hijacked, or you're going to listen to the Christianity trying to fight the politically hijacked Christianity, and that leaves you nowhere. So I'm not going to try to fall for either. Now there's times I got to address this because this whole issue about these pardons go right directly to the Bible and biblical justice. Now let me make it very clear. I believe the essence of the gospel is mercy for those who don't deserve it. So from a theological perspective, I want mercy. Yes, I want forgiveness, right? I like people to be forgiven. I like people to be restored. I like because that's what the gospel is about. And like I said, in many of these cases, I'm all for issuing individual pardons to specific individuals. at the same time, from a legal perspective, from a legal perspective. Think of it this way. If someone is in a church and they're found guilty of some kind of sexual assault, right? Yes, there's mercy and forgiveness in Christ, but there has to be legal accountability for their crime. That's a crime, right? That's a crime. Well, attacking the Capitol building and attacking police officers, that's a crime. So there may be mercy and forgiveness and Christ, and that should be preached and given to those individuals. But there's a crime that has to be committed. Right? I'm all for forgiveness and mercy. But when a crime, we have to maintain some level of justice that crimes require punishment. Now, even in some of those 1600, you'd have to look at it case by case and go, well, what about this? And what about that? And what about this? That was a horrible day. I'll never forget that day as long as I live. I'll never forget it. I remember standing in the living room watching Trump's speech on that day saying, we got to fight. We got to fight. And I won't use the word that he used. We got to fight. And I'm like, fight how? What do you mean fight? You lost the election. It's over. What are you talking about? There's nothing to fight! You lost the election! Send all of your followers home and accept the peaceful transfer of power because that's what we do here in America and accept it and stop acting like a defiant child! But no, fight! And well, his followers fought. And what did I hear Christians? Oh, the election was stolen. The election was stolen. The election was stolen. After all the lawsuits, after everything, no evidence found that would change the result of that election. Election workers were lied about and their lives were, they were put in danger and they were threats on their lives. because of many cases, Christians spreading lies. Christian radio spread so many lies about that. It was insane. Now, at the time I was addressing all of it, but I'll never forget when I heard the speech, I'm like, what does he want these people to do? And then I left, went to the church because I was going to broadcast. And by the time I got to the church, chaos was unfolding and I could not believe what was happening. I could not believe what I was witnessing. And what was most troubling, again, was turning on Christian radio and hearing basically every excuse in the world. Because Christianity no longer can see things from a biblical perspective. We can only see it through the lens of our political ideology. And Christianity should not have a political ideology. We are not beholden. We should not be politics. We're not involved. We're not even of this world. We're not even citizens here from a theological perspective. Our citizenship is in heaven. So, whatever you think about the pardons, here's what I will do. I'll just end with this. Over the next four years, this is what my predictions are. Christianity, Christian nationalism is going to become more influential throughout churches all over the place. They won't call it Christian nationalism, but they're going to be nationalistic, political, and it's going to infiltrate churches everywhere. you watch. It's going to be everywhere. Church political ideology and Christianity is just going to be all over the place, and it's going to be crazy, and you're going to find yourself looking around going, what happened to my church? It's going to become more and more political ideology, I guarantee you. And then on the other side, there's going to be those who are going to be like, well, then we've got to fight against this, we've got to fight against this, and all they're going to do is fight against it and fight against it. And somewhere in the middle of all of that are going to be people like, I don't want the political ideology, and I don't want to just necessarily listen to people constantly fighting the political ideology. Where is Christianity? And it's going to be, for a large part, gone. Now, how I handle it, I'm not gonna say I'm gonna handle it perfectly because I'm not, I'm a sinner, okay? I'm gonna get frustrated at times, I'm gonna get irritated, maybe at times I'm gonna be talking about things more than I should. But I've always said this podcast is just a sinner with a microphone trying to figure out Christianity. That's all I am, that's all I'm going to be. I'm still just gonna be a sinner with a microphone trying to figure all of this out and expressing my own frustrations and my own irritations with some of this. But I am gonna try to maintain Okay, today we're going to be looking at this, and we're going to be looking at this, and we're going to just try. Now, for my own personal gain, If I go full-blown fighting the political, then, of course, all my podcasts would be controversial. I could probably increase downloads and streams, and I could probably become right there in the midst of the fight, and you could be a part of the whole discussion. Well, I have no desire for that, because fighting things politically, you can't get anywhere, right? I mean, when you listen to Christians argue about January 6th, listen to their arguments. None of their arguments are biblical or theological. It's just nonsensical, political, blind ideology or crazy conspiracy theories. Sound like they've been hanging out with Q. I mean, QAnon is what I'm referencing. It's gonna be like that Alex Jones is their pastor. And it's like, oh no, forget that. I'm not even gonna engage in that nonsense. So fighting it to me is like meaningless, meaningless. There's gotta be a place where we can be like, hey guys, let's get right back here. How do we handle this text? Oh, we got Isaiah 40 in front of us. How do we handle this? Hey, what about artificial intelligence and theology? We're gonna deal with, I'm gonna try my best. I can't promise you anything, right? I mean, we're already, we're January the 21st, and you know, what, yesterday, President Trump becomes president, so we're less than 24 hours into it, and I'm already addressing it. See, that's not a good start. but I'm addressing it not on the basis of politics, right? It's not about politics. Let me make it very clear. If Joe Biden was to pardon people engaged in the very same act, but in the opposite direction, right? He was screaming that the election was stolen and a bunch of liberals and Democrats tried to storm the Capitol. I would be just as upset. And we could talk about all the people that, we could talk about the entire pardon system president's having the ability to pardon people. And one thing, it's a great thing. It shows mercy. It shows giving people a second chance. At the same time, and let me make it very clear, because some are going to say, well, not every one of those 1600 people deserve to go to prison. You may be right. And you could say, well, maybe some in the judicial system, this was a political witch hunt. Maybe you're right. I'm not willing. I'm not gonna deny it. In any particular case where you show me the name of the individual, show me exactly what they are found guilty of and what they were charged for, then I'd be more than willing to go, yeah, that person probably shouldn't have went to prison or jail. I can see what you're saying there. Okay, let's go to the next one. We could go through all 1,600 if you so desire. Most people aren't really willing to do that. They just try to find one or two and then try to excuse the whole 1,600, which is illogical and irrational as well. I love the idea of a pardon. I love the idea of mercy. I love the idea of a second chance. I love the idea of redemption. I love that idea because I'm in need of it every single day. But I'm not in favor of pardoning people who violently attacked police officers who are trying to storm the Capitol building to stop the peaceful transfer of power. That is unacceptable. goes against everything America should be about. This democracy, representative republic, however you would like to describe all the elements of our governmental system, the idea of voting and then a peaceful transfer of power, we have to at least maintain that. You want some level of stability and law and order and justice so that we can all pursue happiness and live lives, right? We all want that, right? I want that for anyone. I want that for everyone. I want everyone to be able to pursue their life. I want people to have freedom. I want people to be as safe as they can be. I like the idea of people having that for everyone, people I agree or disagree with. You just can't break down in lawlessness and then pardon it because, because, well, you know, they, they were trying to defend me. They were trying to keep me in power. Well, you didn't deserve to be in power because you lost the election. And guess what? He won this election. All right, great. Now Trump supporters rejoice. You're all happy now. You got you what you wanted. Great. But at the same time, this is wrong. All right. My therapy session is over. Thank you. I will send you $100 for this hour of therapy. Thank you for letting me lay down on your couch and express my frustration and my disbelief. My daughter, I'm like, I don't know what to tell you. I'm like, we knew it was coming. We knew this was going to happen. Yeah, she was greatly bothered by it. I'm like, I don't know what to tell you. This is the way it is. But, you know, it's the confusing part. Again, it's the church, Christians' response to it. I'm not shocked at all by non-Christians' response to it. Whatever. But Christians, we're supposed to justice, justice, mercy, righteousness, obey the law, right? Not try to overthrow the government doing its job. And I got no problem. A peaceful protest, surround the Capitol, being wherever, applying for the permit, protesting, yelling and screaming that the election was stolen. We want an investigation, but you don't storm the Capitol. That, I think, I think we can all agree, a peaceful protest, we're all, we're okay with. All right. I'm gonna stop there. so that I can move on with my day. Thanks for listening. For all those, I know all the Trump supporters are going to be mad, and you're going to try to send me your 37 justifications for why they were persecuted. I mean, you can do so. It's better for you just to, you know, go find a more Trump-friendly podcast, maybe, and that's perfectly okay. I'm going to move forward, and I'm not going to be Trump-friendly or Trump-unfriendly. I'm just going to move forward and try to find a way that somewhere Christianity can exist and this politically hijacked nonsense can go away. All right. Thanks for listening. God bless.