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Breaking News Home | All | Religion | Society | Tech | Choice | SA Newsroom
FRONT PAGE  |  9/15/2019
SATURDAY, JUL 21, 2018  |  21 comments
Federal Court to Decide if Church Can Fire Pastor for Not Attracting Members

A federal appeals court is set to decide this year if a historic black church in Pittsburgh has a First Amendment right to fire its pastor after church expenses doubled and membership plummeted under his leadership.

Sixth Mount Zion Baptist Church of Pittsburgh, a historic church founded in the late 1800s and located in one of the city's poorest communities, is defending its right to choose its own religious leaders free from government interference, according to the Becket Fund for Religious Liberty.

The church's former pastor, the Rev. William David Lee is suing the church for $2.6 million for breach of contract for dismissing him in 2015. The church hired Lee in 2012 and approved, at his insistence, a 20-year contract early in his tenure as senior pastor, according to court documents cited by Trib Live. Lee's lawsuit was previously rejected by a federal trial court, citing Hosanna-Tabor ...


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www.christianpost.com

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· Page 1 ·  Found: 21 user comment(s)
News Item7/25/18 11:28 AM
John Yurich USA | USA  Find all comments by John Yurich USA
That church can not fire that pastor just on the basis that he has not attracted new members.
21

News Item7/22/18 12:35 PM
2cents | America  Find all comments by 2cents
We all desperately need a Holy Ghost revival!!!
20

News Item7/22/18 6:22 AM
Christopher000 | Rhode Island  Find all comments by Christopher000
Thanks MS...I think you and Frank are right, and US as well. I don't believe the other side of the scale is close to being empty, but I was looking at too large of a picture. Once I filtered out the faith healers, the prosperity preachers, those claiming new revelations to preach new things, and those who tread a fine line so as not to offend, etc., etc., the numbers really do begin to thin. However, if anyone is on a quest to find the perfect preacher with a perfect flock, good luck. I also get that nobody should ever need to settle on any church that disagrees with their conscience, just to attend a church, because if the Pastor is out of line, his flock are as well. The reason we're not to forsake fellowship is because we draw strength from those of like mind, and vice-versa. Some are strong enough on their own, and scripture, along with audible sermons/videos, etc., keep their strength up. Me, I'm not strong on my own and need other Christians for added strength because I can be sucked into this world quickly. Considering what I came out from, I need every little bit of strength I can get, and am fortunate enough to have some God-fearing Pastors/church bodys around me. I understand that some others are not as fortunate.
19

News Item7/21/18 10:29 PM
Wayfarer Pilgrim | Lubbock,tx  Find all comments by Wayfarer Pilgrim
Sounds like he duped the church into a “secular “ C.E.O. contract that no one in their right mind should have agreed too. If the court agrees , and it won’t, every knuckleheads bad preacher can breathe a sigh of relief. Just think of every controversial pastor that has been fired for moral lapses, staying put.
18

News Item7/21/18 5:10 PM
Unprofitable Servant | TN  Find all comments by Unprofitable Servant
Thanks Frank. I was pretty sure you didn’t but there are many new posters here. God bless brother

MS, I live in the “Bible belt” and churches are quite numerous. I would say you described the vast majority of them. Yet though percentage wise they who proclaim truth are small I have yet to find them scarce. I am not doubting your description of your situation and hope and pray that God will put a God fearing preacher in your area that declares what saith the Scripture

17

News Item7/21/18 5:05 PM
MS  Find all comments by MS
Quite beneficial to anyone who is interested.

Rightly Dividing The Word.
Darvin Pruitt.

16

News Item7/21/18 4:12 PM
penned  Find all comments by penned
that's sure a lot of money and a long contract. never heard of such a thing.
15

News Item7/21/18 3:38 PM
MS  Find all comments by MS
Oops..worldlings not wordings.
14

News Item7/21/18 3:36 PM
MS  Find all comments by MS
I agree with Frank.
In my area and state you would be hard pressed to find a faithful preacher of the Gospel of God’s Sovereign Grace.
The prevailing religion of the day is rank “free willism”, humanism, entertainment for the wordings, and every stripe of man centered Babel.
As I have stated several times if y’all have a God called pastor who faithfully preaches the Gospel and gives God all the glory for salvation, you are indeed blessed.
13

News Item7/21/18 3:22 PM
Christopher000 | Rhode Island  Find all comments by Christopher000
Hi Frank...you got me thinking a bit more, and I may have been a little more than generous when I said that the other side of the scale is packed and heavy. I would still agree with, "far outweighs", if I had said that instead, but I think you're probably right about the importance of worldly priorities outweighing, and overpowering spiritual things, oftentimes, whether its ever witnessed externally or not. The world creeps in, and it's a minute by minute battle to keep it out, and to keep ones eyes on Heavenly things, and priorities straight.
12

News Item7/21/18 2:57 PM
Frank  Contact via emailFind all comments by Frank
Unprofitable Servant wrote:
Frank, just for clarification you are not saying that a pastor should not receive wages or even benefits. I can sure produce some Bible verses that say he should. I would say from John 10 that the problem with the hireling wasn't that he got paid but that he didn't care for the sheep. I am going to say the number of God called pastors who are in following the admonition of I Peter 5 are not few as suggested by dear sister MS, but are more than likely in the hundreds if not thousands as witnessed even by the number who's sermons are on this site. The New Testament is a record that perfect churches don't exist. Thanks
Hey brother! Of course I didn't say they couldn't receive a salary, health benefits or retirement. But, you and I would definitely disagree on the number that care more about those benefits then they do spreading the gospel and strengthening their congregations.

What made you think that I believed they shouldn't receive salaries, etc? To me a hireling is someone who is more interested in their various forms of compensation, then serving Christ.

Please don't think I am trying to draw people away from their places of worship!

11

News Item7/21/18 2:44 PM
Christopher000 | Rhode Island  Find all comments by Christopher000
...The right, and good, and holy are too boring and harm sales, so we are bombarded with so many church leaders gone bad that our focus tends to tunnelvision and shift to a limited periphery which sees, and makes assumptions based upon what, and who the media chooses to report on, and when it's mostly all bad news within the churches, I think it's natural to paint a picture that may be much worse than what the reality is. Kind of like when a mere 10 people are polled, with five identifying as Christians, and five identifying as Athiests. The poll is used to report that 1/2 Americans are Athiests, or 50% of Americans are Athiests. All I'm saying is that I think the media does a great job shaping our opinions, assumptions, and what we often believe to be accurate and true, when the reality is that we are operating on very limited, or creatively created information.
10

News Item7/21/18 2:43 PM
Christopher000 | Rhode Island  Find all comments by Christopher000
I think a big part of our perceptions are due to all of the Pastors who have been outed for infidelities, gross doctrinal error, collusion, comprimise, theft, materialism as their priority, and even, crimes against children. We hear all of the bad, and the ugly, and we hear it often, but very rarely hear of the faithfulness, selflessness, genuine love, compassion, humility, strength, and faithfulness of so many others who remain in the shadows, and without ever a mention because those sorts of characteristics and traits just aren't newsworthy, so we never learn of them. We hear mostly of the bad, and I think we naturally tend to see only that side of the scale when it's all we ever get a look into, while the other side is packed and heavy, easily tipping that scale, but all of those standing on it are invisible because their deeds and faithfulness go unnoticed by a world that loves to report on, and read about the sins of others. This world just loves to sit in judgement and point fingers, while those in faithful service, and bearing great fruit are dismissed because people prefer to read about chaotic lives, crimes, and wicked things.
9

News Item7/21/18 1:43 PM
Unprofitable Servant | TN  Find all comments by Unprofitable Servant
Frank wrote:
found definition of a hireling from the internet. I have often said that most pastors today are simply hirelings working primarily for wages, health insurance and retirement benefits. These types normally simply do what gives them the most. I didn’t read the article, but did ask myself how any pastor could even remotely want to stay in a congregation that didn’t want them?
KJV Dictionary Definition: hireling
hireling
n. One who is hired, or who serves for wages.
1. A mercenary; a prostitute.
a. Serving for wages; venal; mercenary; employed for money or other compensation.
A tedious crew
Frank, just for clarification you are not saying that a pastor should not receive wages or even benefits. I can sure produce some Bible verses that say he should. I would say from John 10 that the problem with the hireling wasn't that he got paid but that he didn't care for the sheep. I am going to say the number of God called pastors who are in following the admonition of I Peter 5 are not few as suggested by dear sister MS, but are more than likely in the hundreds if not thousands as witnessed even by the number who's sermons are on this site. The New Testament is a record that perfect churches don't exist. Thanks
8

News Item7/21/18 1:00 PM
Frank  Contact via emailFind all comments by Frank
MS wrote:
Yes, they both post on SA.
Ken Wimer.
Greg Elmquist, a former RC,and he is in your home state of Florida.
Thanks, I'll check them out later!
7

News Item7/21/18 12:38 PM
MS  Find all comments by MS
Frank wrote:
Hey sister! If they are part of SA, please post their names or internet sites.
Yes, they both post on SA.

Ken Wimer.
Greg Elmquist, a former RC,and he is in your home state of Florida.

6

News Item7/21/18 12:28 PM
Frank  Contact via emailFind all comments by Frank
MS wrote:
You are so right bro. Frank.
There are very, very few God called preachers.
But, there is a remnant that are faithful to Christ, His Gospel, and His elect.
I know two of them that are humble servants of our Lord.
Thanks for your post.
Have a blessed day.
Hey sister! If they are part of SA, please post their names or internet sites.
5

News Item7/21/18 11:35 AM
MS  Find all comments by MS
You are so right bro. Frank.

There are very, very few God called preachers.

But, there is a remnant that are faithful to Christ, His Gospel, and His elect.
I know two of them that are humble servants of our Lord.

Thanks for your post.
Have a blessed day.

4

News Item7/21/18 11:26 AM
Frank  Contact via emailFind all comments by Frank
I of course found the below definition of a hireling from the internet. I have often said that most pastors today are simply hirelings working primarily for wages, health insurance and retirement benefits. These types normally simply do what gives them the most. I didn’t read the article, but did ask myself how any pastor could even remotely want to stay in a congregation that didn’t want them?

KJV Dictionary Definition: hireling

hireling

HI'RELING, n. One who is hired, or who serves for wages.

1. A mercenary; a prostitute.

HI'RELING, a. Serving for wages; venal; mercenary; employed for money or other compensation.

A tedious crew

3

News Item7/21/18 9:50 AM
Jaycobee | Fl  Find all comments by Jaycobee
Agree with quiet Christian. This lawsuit only tarnishes the body.
2
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