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Breaking News Home | All | Religion | Society | Tech | Choice | SA Newsroom
FRONT PAGE  |  10/20/2019
FRIDAY, AUG 28, 2015  |  44 comments  |  1 commentary
Defiant Kentucky Clerk’s Office Again Refuses Marriage License to Gay Couple

Just hours after a federal appeals court upheld a ruling that mandated a Kentucky clerk to issue gay marriage licenses, she has reportedly once again defied the order.

The office of Rowan County Clerk Kim Davis turned away gay couple William Smith Jr. and James Yates for the third time on Thursday morning, the Associated Press reported.

The refusal was reportedly rooted in a belief by Davis — a Christian who opposes same-sex unions — that a judge’s previous delay grants her office until August 31 to begin issuing licenses.

This is the latest back and forth in Davis’ ongoing battle against same-sex marriage legalization, as U.S. District Judge David Bunning initially ordered her to begin issuing marriage licenses to gay couples two weeks ago. ...


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News Item8/30/15 11:44 AM
Lesser lesson | Link  Find all comments by Lesser lesson
Winston Churchill: "If you will not fight for the right when you can easily win without bloodshed, if you will not fight when your victory will be sure and not so costly, you may come to the moment when you will have to fight with all the odds against you and only a precarious chance for survival. There may be a worse case. You may have to fight when there is no chance of victory, because it is better to perish than to live as slaves."

Erwin Lutzer, in his brilliant book, "Hitler's Cross", wrote, "The swastika meant more to some pastors than did the Cross." And there is absolutely no question that many pastors in America today place far more value on the US flag (symbolizing to them the power and authority of the state) than they do the Cross of Christ or the teachings and authority of the Holy Scriptures
...
one German pastor in 1933 gushed, "Christ has come to us through Hitler." In like manner, many pastors today foolishly preach that God directs us through our President (whoever he is), or our Supreme Court, or virtually any other government agency

This is dereliction of duty by America's pastors &churches -the IRS 501c3 non-profit tax status, church /government corporation; who use an erroneous, fallacious view of Rom 13 but the Law of God is above all wicked "law".

44

News Item8/30/15 10:16 AM
FG | USA  Find all comments by FG
What the church needs today is another John Knox. Unafraid to stand AGAINST unjust, wicked and ungodly authorities, inside and outside the church. Someone who's prayers Barak Obama can fear more than the combined Russian and Chinese armed forces. Alas the church be full of Romans 13 bots that do not have the stomach for such a one. We couldn't handle Ian Paisley when he was alive who, zealous as he was, would himself admit that he would have the zeal of a John Knox if he could. BTW if you really carefully read Romans 13 you will find the Heavenly design for government. Inclusive in this are the words "higher powers" in V1, plural. Which have application to the lower magistrates' right to rule where it exists, you know,.... like in the USA,.... so far. Suggest reading Charles Hodge on Romans 13 if you have a copy. If you don't get one and get balanced. Good Lord's Day to you.
43

News Item8/30/15 9:47 AM
you missed | hereabouts  Find all comments by you missed
http://www.sermonaudio.com/sermoninfo.asp?SID=1017131416551
You forgot wrote:
35 minutes mercyseat.net.
It is
44 minutes : not 35
& at
SermonAudio: though it may be at mercyseat.net also

Funny that this message points out that sermons used to be 2 to 3 hours- he points out
now his messages are about 45 min long

Of course, if you play this faster on a mp3 player it might be 22 min. .

Mk 8:34-35 And when he had called the people unto him with his disciples also, he said unto them, Whosoever will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me.
For whosoever will save his life shall lose it; but whosoever shall lose his life for my sake and the gospel's, the same shall save it.

42

News Item8/30/15 8:12 AM
Lesser lesson | Link  Find all comments by Lesser lesson
1. The definition of a "license" demands that we not obtain one to marry.
Black's Law Dictionary defines "license" as, "The permission by competent authority to do an act which without such permission, would be illegal." We need to ask ourselves- why should it be illegal to marry without the State's permission? More importantly, why should we need the State's permission to participate in something which God instituted (Gen. 2:18-24)? We should not need the State's permission to marry nor should we grovel before state officials to seek it. What if you apply and the State says "no"? You must understand that the authority to license implies the power to prohibit. A license by definition "confers a right" to do something. The State cannot grant the right to marry. It is a God-given right.

2. When you marry with a marriage license, you grant the State jurisdiction over your marriage.
When you marry with a marriage license, your marriage is a creature of the State. It is a corporation of the State! Therefore, they have jurisdiction over your marriage including the fruit of your marriage. What is the fruit of your marriage? Your children and every piece of property you own. There is plenty of case law in American jurisprudence which declares this to be true.

From 5 reasons link

41

News Item8/30/15 5:43 AM
Dave | from oz  Find all comments by Dave
Well done to this clerk, I admire her stance
40

News Item8/30/15 5:42 AM
Dave | from oz  Find all comments by Dave
39

News Item8/29/15 5:25 PM
You forgot  Find all comments by You forgot
struggle on wrote:
People who are lukewarm towards their religion want a convenient religion. And such is the state of American Christianity. Because American Christians are lukewarm in their devotion to Christ, they have made Christianity into a religion of convenience. Christianity isnow convenient to your lifestyle - whateverthatmay be - in which you can pick and choose those parts you like and want, and reject those parts you find unappealing or displeasing. We have accommodated ourselves to this world. Our consumption for ease and materialism is no different than the world's. Our consumption of MEism is no different than the world's. We have created theologies which justify our accommodation. We have created a convenient Christianity. You can now be a Christian, and love this present world too. You can pick a Christianity which fits YOUR lifestyle.But Jesusand the Scriptures call us to something far different.
[URL=http://www.sermonaudio.com/sermoninfo.asp?SID=1017131416551]]]overcome don't go the easy way[/URL]
35 minutes mercyseat.net. ......
38

News Item8/29/15 5:07 PM
pennned  Find all comments by pennned
struggle on wrote:
[URL=http://www.sermonaudio.com/sermoninfo.asp?SID=1017131416551]]]overcome don't go the easy way[/URL]
another great sermon! thanks for the encouragement.

Greetings Brother Lurker!

37

News Item8/29/15 1:51 PM
struggle on | path  Find all comments by struggle on
"To the people, all religions were equally true; to the philosophers, all religions were equally false;and to the politicians, all religions were equally useful."-EdwardGibbons, The Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire.

... it is the nature of the State to always use religion for its own ends. Most States use religion to homogenize, utilize, and manipulate the people. Even those States which are atheistic still find religion useful. Thereare always those in religion who are willing to accommodate the State's designs in using religion.

A state religion of "homofascism" is used by the state now & the choice is to conform as cowards or oppose in Christ.

36

News Item8/29/15 1:45 PM
MS  Find all comments by MS
SteveR wrote:
The pews.
----- nope, from unsaved churchicans on the pulpit and in the pews.
35

News Item8/29/15 1:34 PM
SteveR | Mr Zion  Find all comments by SteveR
Lurker wrote:
And where does this "convenient Christianity" come from......... the bible or the pulpit? Lay the blame squarely where it belongs. 2 Tim 2:3-4
The pews
34

News Item8/29/15 1:21 PM
TMC | Midwest  Find all comments by TMC
...does not absolve us of responsibility.

Apparently, I need to condense my thoughts better!

33

News Item8/29/15 1:18 PM
TMC | Midwest  Find all comments by TMC
I believe that thoughtful discussion of these topics is very important and helpful. The church has not had to face these issues in quite sometime, making it feel like we're reinventing the wheel.

What is our duty as Christ's bond-slaves? He has sovereignly placed us in a nation that holds elections. We are not subject to whoever happens to be next in line. Do we simply stand by, and react to whatever the heathen impose on us? Our do we seek to use every political right the Lord has given us (as Paul did)? By what standard do we judge how we cast our vote? What impact does our Heavenly Citizenship have on our earthly citizenship? What resources has the Lord given us, and will he hold us accountable if we bury them?

Politics is a divisive issue, but almost every time Christians are rounded up it is because the government wants to be recognized as the ultimate authority. Saying that we ought to obey God rather than man is a political statement that hundreds of Christians have underlined with their blood.

Persecution waxes and wanes through out history. Right now it is waxing. While scripture says that evil men will wax worse and worse, history shows that Christians do not fall steadily under more and more persecution.

God IS sovereign, but that does not ab

32

News Item8/29/15 1:10 PM
Lurker  Protected NameFind all comments by Lurker
struggle on wrote:
People who are lukewarm towards their religion want a convenient religion. And such is the state of American Christianity. Because American Christians are lukewarm in their devotion to Christ, they have made Christianity into a religion of convenience. Christianity isnow convenient to your lifestyle - whateverthatmay be - in which you can pick and choose those parts you like and want, and reject those parts you find unappealing or displeasing. We have accommodated ourselves to this world. Our consumption for ease and materialism is no different than the world's. Our consumption of MEism is no different than the world's. We have created theologies which justify our accommodation. We have created a convenient Christianity. You can now be a Christian, and love this present world too. You can pick a Christianity which fits YOUR lifestyle.But Jesusand the Scriptures call us to something far different.
[URL=http://www.sermonaudio.com/sermoninfo.asp?SID=1017131416551]]]overcome don't go the easy way[/URL]
And where does this "convenient Christianity" come from......... the bible or the pulpit? Lay the blame squarely where it belongs. 2 Tim 2:3-4
31

News Item8/29/15 12:58 PM
struggle on | path  Find all comments by struggle on
People who are lukewarm towards their religion want a convenient religion. And such is the state of American Christianity. Because American Christians are lukewarm in their devotion to Christ, they have made Christianity into a religion of convenience. Christianity isnow convenient to your lifestyle - whateverthatmay be - in which you can pick and choose those parts you like and want, and reject those parts you find unappealing or displeasing. We have accommodated ourselves to this world. Our consumption for ease and materialism is no different than the world's. Our consumption of MEism is no different than the world's. We have created theologies which justify our accommodation. We have created a convenient Christianity. You can now be a Christian, and love this present world too. You can pick a Christianity which fits YOUR lifestyle.But Jesusand the Scriptures call us to something far different.

[URL=http://www.sermonaudio.com/sermoninfo.asp?SID=1017131416551]]]overcome don't go the easy way[/URL]

30

News Item8/29/15 12:11 PM
MS  Find all comments by MS
Frank wrote:
There is little difference between the dominionists of today and the RCC of yesteryear and Islam today. Both groups want to set up a political agenda and then would force "or" compel others to follow their lead. I strongly believe that as an individual Christian I should disobey immoral laws when I can and I would recommend others do the same, but not using immoral political/social methods. My agenda is to serve Christ and not set up a worldly kingdom that is worthy for Him to rule and reign over.
I am a stranger and a pilgrim on this evil earth and a bond-slave of my Lord, not His partner in any way. These dominionist thoughts would say we partner with the God of this universe in some unhealthy way. A slave is not a partner, but a slave. Now I will admit there is a nuance to my thoughts, so I don’t want to argue or debate this position. Although emails will get a long long meditation of this thought. This world will grow worse and worse and although I should not help it to do that, I must realize that is reality.
Yep
29

News Item8/29/15 11:49 AM
Frank  Contact via emailFind all comments by Frank
Get Real wrote:
God Bless you Frank and MS for speaking out
There is little difference between the dominionists of today and the RCC of yesteryear and Islam today. Both groups want to set up a political agenda and then would force "or" compel others to follow their lead. I strongly believe that as an individual Christian I should disobey immoral laws when I can and I would recommend others do the same, but not using immoral political/social methods. My agenda is to serve Christ and not set up a worldly kingdom that is worthy for Him to rule and reign over.

I am a stranger and a pilgrim on this evil earth and a bond-slave of my Lord, not His partner in any way. These dominionist thoughts would say we partner with the God of this universe in some unhealthy way. A slave is not a partner, but a slave. Now I will admit there is a nuance to my thoughts, so I don’t want to argue or debate this position. Although emails will get a long long meditation of this thought. This world will grow worse and worse and although I should not help it to do that, I must realize that is reality.

28

News Item8/29/15 10:45 AM
pennned  Find all comments by pennned
the doctrine of lesser magistrates is rather simple. it means that each Christian must obey God, and the higher laws of God and that they cannot obey man when it conflicts with the higher laws of God. You see this discussion between the Nazi officer and corrie ten boom's father when they are arrested. Just like today, they used Romans 13 as a weapon against the conscience of the Christian, saying you must always comply to the world, especially to a centralized power. Kind of Darwinist world where the biggest fish eats whatever he wants and everyone must feed his belly and grow him bigger.

In tyranny, evil demands compliance from all and each has to "count the cost", and "put all things at the foot of the cross".... so the state comes down with new regs and says that a nurse has to perform abortions on demand as part of her job.... well, she cannot. So she refuses and takes the consequences, and others agree and they stand together. It may not go well for them or a beurocrat may reconsider his position.

its called "loving thy neighbor", when the state tells everyone in the nation that they must let boys into girls bathrooms, and people are concerned for the privacy of their children, and they say "no"..... Christians cannot comply with evil, its undignified.

27

News Item8/29/15 10:29 AM
Lesser lesson | Link  Find all comments by Lesser lesson
[URL=http://www.mercyseat.net/pdfs/lessermagistrate.pdf]]]Lesser magistrate:Historic Legal & bible teaching [/URL]

The truth is Christ is a king (I Tim.1:17). He is “the ruler over the kings of the earth” (Rev. 1:5). He is the King of kings and Lord of lords (I Tim 6:15). His kingdom is to expand in the earth (Lk.13:18-20). His is a conquering kingdom (Mt.16:18). The reputation of the early Church Christians was that they “turned the world upside down...saying there is another king – Jesus.” (Acts 17:7).

No King but King Jesus!

[URL=http://www.mercyseat.net/pdfs/escharticle.pdf]]]Oppose Wickedness - occupy until He comes[/URL]

In regards to this issue at core:

[URL=http://www.mercyseat.net/marriagelicense.html]]]5 reasons Christians should not get state license [/URL]

George Washington was married without a marriage license. So, how did we come to this place in America where marriage licenses are issued?
...
Ask ourselves, "If a man and a man marry with a State marriage license, and a man and woman marry without a State marriage license - who's really married???

Early Americans were married without a marriage license. They simply recorded their marriages in their Family Bibles. So should we.

26

News Item8/29/15 9:45 AM
TMC | Midwest  Find all comments by TMC
... her life to appeal to Ahasuerus.

I think what this clerk is doing is spot on and I pray that more Christians will have the backbone to stand for their consciences.

25
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