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FRONT PAGE  |  6/25/2019
FRIDAY, APR 10, 2015  |  40 comments
The New York Times Wants Us to Rewrite the Bible

How can the religious community live in peace and harmony with the LGBT community? New York Times columnist Frank Bruni has the solution. Just rewrite the Bible.

In his April 3rd column, "Bigotry, the Bible and the Lessons of Indiana," Bruni, himself gay, recognizes that Christian beliefs are not necessarily grounded in hatred. The problem, he claims, is that, "beliefs ossified over centuries aren't easily shaken."

Bruni, for his part, wants to shake us free from our fossilized faith.

According to Bruni, who evidences little or no understanding of how believers view the Scriptures (namely, as God's inspired Word), if we hold to the view that homosexual practice is sinful, this is our "decision" and "choice." ...


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· Page 1 ·  Found: 40 user comment(s)
News Item4/16/15 10:13 AM
SteveR | Mt Zion  Find all comments by SteveR
From your latest exchange w/TULIP

John UK wrote:
Oh I see, YOU want to go right back to baby doctrines whereas I want to move on to deeper things. Well, why didn't you tell me you were a young believer who is all excited about the simple things? I was teaching this sort of thing back in the early 80's, under the authority of the eldership in my church. Let's see, that's over thirty years ago.
But Christianity never did have just one string on its harp, as the hypermen seem to think. And Jesus rebuked Pharisees for tithing all manner of herbs yet neglecting mercy and the love of God. And they remind me of you. It's a plain fact, and I'm not being nasty, you need to hear this.
The acronym is a help in that it shows the natural estate of man and how God overcomes that in saving sinners. That's simple basic biblical stuff, but you were never designed to mumble about it every day for the rest of your life. And you won't score any points with God either, unless you back it up with works.
_____________
SC, quite correct, but I'm OOS. Later...
40

News Item4/13/15 3:16 PM
John UK | Wales  Find all comments by John UK
TULIP wrote:
The problem with DIY salvation is that in spite of seeking God and His mercy...
So which one here tried a DIY salvation?

Luke 18:10-14 KJV
(10) Two men went up into the temple to pray; the one a Pharisee, and the other a publican.
(11) The Pharisee stood and prayed thus with himself, God, I thank thee, that I am not as other men are, extortioners, unjust, adulterers, or even as this publican.
(12) I fast twice in the week, I give tithes of all that I possess.
(13) And the publican, standing afar off, would not lift up so much as his eyes unto heaven, but smote upon his breast, saying, God be merciful to me a sinner.
(14) I tell you, this man went down to his house justified rather than the other: for every one that exalteth himself shall be abased; and he that humbleth himself shall be exalted.

39

News Item4/13/15 2:51 PM
TULIP  Find all comments by TULIP
John UK wrote:
please explain what you mean by DIY salvation in the context of a sinner asking God to have mercy on him and give him eternal life.
The problem with DIY salvation is that in spite of seeking God and His mercy, God provides salvation only to His elect regardless of man's presumed aspirations.

God alone saves. Man in his natural estate does not and can not seek a saviour and salvation. (Dead in sin) Man can not discern spiritually until the Holy Spirit provides him with the gift of faith. Rom 11:7 -
"What then? Israel hath not obtained that which he seeketh for; but the election hath obtained it, and the rest were blinded"

Therefore DIY salvation is an oxymoron except in Arminian philosophy. Man seeking Christ before he is called and saved is an oxymoron. Man cannot discern spiritually until God draws him to Christ. God is always first cause. This is the reason why Billy/Franklin Graham calling people down to make a decision for Christ is pure heresy and unbiblical in fact totally impractical.

38

News Item4/12/15 4:17 PM
John UK | Wales  Find all comments by John UK
Acts 4:24-31 KJV
(24) And when they heard that, they lifted up their voice to God with one accord, and said, Lord, thou art God, which hast made heaven, and earth, and the sea, and all that in them is:
(25) Who by the mouth of thy servant David hast said, Why did the heathen rage, and the people imagine vain things?
(26) The kings of the earth stood up, and the rulers were gathered together against the Lord, and against his Christ.
(27) For of a truth against thy holy child Jesus, whom thou hast anointed, both Herod, and Pontius Pilate, with the Gentiles, and the people of Israel, were gathered together,
(28) For to do whatsoever thy hand and thy counsel determined before to be done.
(29) And now, Lord, behold their threatenings: and grant unto thy servants, that with all boldness they may speak thy word,
(30) By stretching forth thine hand to heal; and that signs and wonders may be done by the name of thy holy child Jesus.
(31) And when they had prayed, the place was shaken where they were assembled together; and they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and they spake the word of God with boldness.

37

News Item4/12/15 3:48 PM
s c | Oh  Find all comments by s c
Again,Tulip,when you say that you pray for the Holy Spirit are you saying that you pray for the indwelling of the Holy Spirit (which is unnecessary as we receive the Person of the Holy Spirit upon conversion) or are you saying,rather,that you pray for the power and ministry of the Holy Spirit?
Don't you see the distinction?
It almost sounds like you are supporting the false charismatic idea of a later baptism of the Holy Spirit.
36

News Item4/12/15 3:13 PM
TULIP  Find all comments by TULIP
Mike wrote:
1. Mr. Henry is talking about believers asking for empowerment from on high, as sc has said
Jesus states:
13 If ye then, being evil, know how to give good gifts unto your children: how much more shall your heavenly Father give the Holy Spirit to them that ask him? Luke 11

That seems pretty straightforward - "Ask for the Holy Spirit"

Also:
11 If ye then, being evil, know how to give good gifts unto your children, how much more shall your Father which is in heaven give good things to them that ask him? Matt 7:

It is the request for specifics which Jesus appears to be telling us to pray for.

As I said before to sc, better to ask for the Holy Spirit rather than not and disobey the plain speaking of Christ.

35

News Item4/12/15 2:23 PM
s c | Oh  Find all comments by s c
"These things are written that ye may believe....."

sweet words indeed!

And we know that his word never goes out void.

34

News Item4/12/15 12:24 PM
J. Leonard | Alabama  Find all comments by J. Leonard
Is the New York Times stupid. The devil is busy.
33

News Item4/12/15 6:41 AM
John UK | Wales  Find all comments by John UK
Michael Hranek wrote:
Brother Saint John UK Wales
Wow!
In the Providence of God I have been involved with better things today, like giving a Chic Tract: "The Empty Tomb" to a man I had the priviledge of giving a copy of the Book of John to some months ago when I met him shoveling snow
Brother and Saint Michael,

It always thrills me to hear of some witnessing going on, and it is great to hear of this fellow taking a chick tract. Once he begins to read it, he'll never put it down till it's finished. The Lord can well use such a thing, as it is not couched in religious jargon, but plain and simple, suitable for an unbeliever. God bless the work. And may he be encouraged to read through the whole of the John's Gospel, seeing as, "These things are written that ye may believe....."
_________

SC, to continue. Yes, the Spirit's work begins at birth and continues right through till death and beyond. At some point he quickens and enlightens and convicts of sin, which brings forth repentance and trust and calling on the name of the Lord. God confirms his acceptance and baptises with the Spirit, baptising into Christ. This is a one off.

Subsequent "fillings" are needful (because we leak).

Is that it?

32

News Item4/12/15 4:29 AM
John UK | Wales  Find all comments by John UK
TULIP wrote:
Nope John. Not often you're right but you're wrong again. That's not what I said. In his "natural" estate man cannot pray, discern spiritually.
Oh I see, YOU want to go right back to baby doctrines whereas I want to move on to deeper things. Well, why didn't you tell me you were a young believer who is all excited about the simple things? I was teaching this sort of thing back in the early 80's, under the authority of the eldership in my church. Let's see, that's over thirty years ago.

But Christianity never did have just one string on its harp, as the hypermen seem to think. And Jesus rebuked Pharisees for tithing all manner of herbs yet neglecting mercy and the love of God. And they remind me of you. It's a plain fact, and I'm not being nasty, you need to hear this.

The acronym is a help in that it shows the natural estate of man and how God overcomes that in saving sinners. That's simple basic biblical stuff, but you were never designed to mumble about it every day for the rest of your life. And you won't score any points with God either, unless you back it up with works.
_____________

SC, quite correct, but I'm OOS. Later...

31

News Item4/11/15 7:39 PM
Mike | New York  Find all comments by Mike
TULIP wrote:
---
Quote;
"The direction he gives us what to pray for. We must ask for the Holy Spirit, not only a necessary in order to our praying well, but as inclusive of all the good things we are to pray for; we need no more to make us happy, for the Spirit is the worker of spiritual life, and the earnest of eternal life. Note, The gift of the Holy Ghost is a gift we are every one of us concerned earnestly and constantly to pray for." (Matthew Henry)
---
One of two things here:

1. Mr. Henry is talking about believers asking for empowerment from on high, as sc has said, or

2. Mr. Henry is talking about unbelievers asking for the indwelling.

If the former, he is correct. If the latter, he would not be correct.

Which do you think he means? Consider who the "we" is in the quote.

30

News Item4/11/15 5:48 PM
s c | Oh  Find all comments by s c
Tulip,I do not take Jesus to task.
Did you or did you not receive the Holy Spirit when you were saved?
Are you suggesting that a believer has to ask for the indwelling of the Holy Spirit after he has been saved or are you saying,rather,that we should pray for the Holy Spirit to empower and work through us?
There is a distinction.
There is no being baptized in the Spirit a delayed time after conversion. There is the indwelling of the Holy Spirit AT the time of salvation.
Context is key,isn't it?
29

News Item4/11/15 5:35 PM
Michael Hranek | Endicott, New York  Find all comments by Michael Hranek
Brother Saint John UK Wales
Wow!

In the Providence of God I have been involved with better things today, like giving a Chic Tract: "The Empty Tomb" to a man I had the priviledge of giving a copy of the Book of John to some months ago when I met him shoveling snow

Back to this thread, where oh where is the love of the Truth, the love of the Bible with some people

I know, I know they pervert even these things for whatever their "religion" whatever that happens to be

TULIP wrote:
Nope John. Not often you're right but you're wrong again. That's not what I said. In his "natural" estate man cannot pray, discern spiritually.
28

News Item4/11/15 4:42 PM
TULIP  Find all comments by TULIP
John UK wrote:
Man, you're all over the place. One minute you say a man cannot do anything until he is indwelt by the Spirit, and now you're saying that man can ask God for the Spirit.
Nope John. Not often you're right but you're wrong again. That's not what I said. In his "natural" estate man cannot pray, discern spiritually.

_________________________

sc wrote:
I would take you to task if you are suggesting that one must ask for the indwelling of the Holy Spirit after one has been saved.
But sc; it is not me you need to "take to task" - It is Jesus. He left us with this recorded command. All we poor sinners do is obey. HE knows best.

Quote;
"The direction he gives us what to pray for. We must ask for the Holy Spirit, not only a necessary in order to our praying well, but as inclusive of all the good things we are to pray for; we need no more to make us happy, for the Spirit is the worker of spiritual life, and the earnest of eternal life. Note, The gift of the Holy Ghost is a gift we are every one of us concerned earnestly and constantly to pray for." (Matthew Henry)

sc:
Better to ask than to ignore Bible instructions.

27

News Item4/11/15 3:44 PM
s c | Oh  Find all comments by s c
Tulip,as we are sealed with the Holy Spirit when we are saved -
Ephesians 1:13
In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,
one must distinguish between the Person of the Holy Spirit and the ministry/power of the Holy Spirit.
I would take you to task if you are suggesting that one must ask for the indwelling of the Holy Spirit after one has been saved.
No deception/inconsistency with what Christ said.
26

News Item4/11/15 3:07 PM
John UK | Wales  Find all comments by John UK
TULIP wrote:
Strange! You ask the question but refuse to accept the answer. Perhaps you cannot deal with it?
Man, you're all over the place. One minute you say a man cannot do anything until he is indwelt by the Spirit, and now you're saying that man can ask God for the Spirit.

Ephesians 1:12-14 KJV
(12) That we should be to the praise of his glory, who first trusted in Christ.
(13) In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,
(14) Which is the earnest of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession, unto the praise of his glory.

Now if you have your own thoughts (apart from the WCF), how about trying to share them with me?

And while you're at it, please explain what you mean by DIY salvation in the context of a sinner asking God to have mercy on him and give him eternal life.

25

News Item4/11/15 2:50 PM
TULIP  Find all comments by TULIP
John UK wrote:
An anonymous, secretive person wants to teach me over the internet? Are you one of those ten thousand instructors? On yer bike, mate.
Strange! You ask the question but refuse to accept the answer. Perhaps you cannot deal with it?
__________________________

sc wrote:
The Holy Spirit comes to dwell within us at the moment of receiving Christ.
It is unnecessary to ask for the Holy Spirit.
So what you are implying is that all these verses, the words of Jesus, are - "not true"? "unnecessary"?
EG:: V9 - sc teaches, "No need to ask"???

Luke 11:9 And I say unto you, Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you.
10 For every one that asketh receiveth; and he that seeketh findeth; and to him that knocketh it shall be opened.
11 If a son shall ask bread of any of you that is a father, will he give him a stone? or if he ask a fish, will he for a fish give him a serpent?
12 Or if he shall ask an egg, will he offer him a scorpion?
13 If ye then, being evil, know how to give good gifts unto your children: how much more shall your heavenly Father give the Holy Spirit to them that ask him?
= sc - Do you say Christ is deceiving us here?

24

News Item4/11/15 2:25 PM
s c | Oh  Find all comments by s c
In reference to Luke 11:13-
When Jesus spoke this the Holy Spirit had not yet been given:

John 7:39
(But this spake he of the Spirit, which they that believe on him should receive: for the Holy Ghost was not yet given; because that Jesus was not yet glorified.)

The Holy Spirit comes to dwell within us at the moment of receiving Christ.
It is unnecessary to ask for the Holy Spirit.
And many pray who are unbelievers.

23

News Item4/11/15 2:11 PM
John UK | Wales  Find all comments by John UK
TULIP wrote:
If I have prayed the prayer and I am one of God's elect, then why do you not believe what I teach you in posts John?
An anonymous, secretive person wants to teach me over the internet? Are you one of those ten thousand instructors? On yer bike, mate.
22

News Item4/11/15 2:06 PM
TULIP  Find all comments by TULIP
John UK wrote:
I wonder if you ever ask God for the Holy Spirit, as Jesus intimated?
No need to look up the WCF
Do you accept that I am a true Christian John?
If I was not then I wouldn't pray anyway.
If I was a nominal believer then the prayer would have no effect with God.
So
Have I prayed the prayer to ask for the Holy Spirit (Luke 11:13) - (Yes) And if so does the Holy Spirit dwell within me?

If I have prayed the prayer and I am one of God's elect, then why do you not believe what I teach you in posts John?
For example that the WCF is sound Biblical doctrine teaching?

John; I pray in the Spirit :-
Eph 6:18 "Praying always with all prayer and supplication in the Spirit, and watching thereunto with all perseverance and supplication for all saints"

As the "Sword" instructs me.

Now John; this Arminian problem in the churches. TULIP teaches:
1. Man is powerless under the dominion of sin.
2. God needs no other reason to elect than HIS purpose and HIS plan.
3. God uses the blood of Christ to save the elect.
4. God is omnipotent thus HIS Grace is omnipotent.
5. Without the help of God living this life In Christ "In Faith" would be impossible for the sinner.

God Bless.

21
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