Sign in or signup
Radio Streams
SA Radio
24/7 Radio Stream
VCY America
24/7 Radio Stream

My Favorite Things
Home
NewsSITE
Events | Local | Blogs
New Audio | Video | Clips
Broadcasters
Church Finder
Live Webcasts
Sermons by Bible
Sermons by Category
Sermons by Topic
Sermons by Speaker
Sermons by Date
Staff Picks
CommentsALL -35 sec
Top Sermons
Daily Log
Photos
Stores
Online Bible
Hymnal
Daily Reading
Our Services
Sermon DashboardNEW
Members Only

Breaking News Home | All | Religion | Society | Tech | Choice | SA Newsroom
FRONT PAGE  |  9/20/2019
MONDAY, AUG 8, 2011  |  28 comments
Canadian Lutherans struggle over 'gay' marriage
Signs of fracture are appearing in Canada's Lutheran Church, specifically when it comes to homosexuality. The Evangelical Lutheran Church has voted to perform same-gender "marriages" and permit practicing homosexuals to become pastors.

Nolan Astley pastors Holy Cross Lutheran Church in Kitchener, Ontario, and serves as vice president of the Lutheran Church-Canada, which is the Biblical based branch of the denomination.

"Our concern is what's happening not just in the Evangelical Lutheran Church here in Canada but elsewhere as well is that social concerns and society's norms are becoming the norms for the church, and that's a matter of grave concern," says the pastor.

Astley says that by just reading comments from people within the ELC online, he senses that many members and pastors of the more liberal denomination are grieving over the vote. ...


CLICK HERE to Read Entire Article
www.onenewsnow.com

   09/19/19  |  Former Planned Parenthood President Speaks Out against the... • 2 comments
   09/19/19  |  OB/GYN confirms awful truth to Congress: Babies left to die • 3 comments
   09/18/19  |  China makes churches replace Ten Commandments with Xi Jinping... • 5 comments
   09/17/19  |  SermonAudio Tip: Enjoy Lamplighter Theatre on SermonAudio! • 1 comments
   09/17/19  |  Democrats Unanimous Forcing Schools To Let Male Athletes Compete... • 20 comments
OTHER CHOICE NEWS | MORE..
COMMENTS | show all | add new  
    Sorting Order:  
· Page 1 ·  Found: 28 user comment(s)
News Item8/10/11 2:48 PM
Jim Lincoln | Nebraska  Find all comments by Jim Lincoln
Crosskeys that is what with the AV, it was modified, [URL=http://www.kjv-only.com/rick/bancroft.html]]]The Influence of An Anglican Archbishop on the KJV[/URL]. There is no "J" or apparently that sound in the Hebrew language, that is why some 19th century Bible commentators sometimes put "Yehovah" instead of "Jehovah" The NET folks have a fairly good explanation of "Jehovah", [URL=http://bible.org/question/why-do-you-not-translate-divine-name-jehovah-or-yahweh-net-bible]]]Why do you not translate the Divine Name as Jehovah or Yahweh in the NET Bible?[/URL]. No the Net Bible is not one of my favorite Bibles, though of course better than the AV, [URL=http://web.archive.org/web/20071012194730/faith.propadeutic.com/conclusions.html]]]Comparing Bible Translations--Conclusions[/URL].

As another person pointed out it is important for a pastor to know some Greek, Hebrew, and Aramaic, hopefully quite a bit! In this commentary, [URL=http://www.bible.org/page.php?page_id=1824]]]Part III: From the KJV to the RV (from Elegance to Accuracy)[/URL], you find the comments of Martin Luther supporting this idea. (You'll find it in the Sidenote)

28

News Item8/10/11 10:17 AM
John UK | Wales  Find all comments by John UK
words wrote:
Two different Greek words.
Matt 5:22 - "moros" - From which we get the word "moron"
1Cor 15:36 - "Aphron"
Interesting, that!

And it just goes to show how serious a business it is, for when people call out, "You moron!" they endanger themselves of hellfire, probably for the sins of pride and judgmentalism. Maybe JYUSA ought to take note of that.

27

News Item8/10/11 9:48 AM
words  Find all comments by words
Silofolous wrote:
But I do also find it interesting, just looking at two different verses, that since Matthew 5:22 says "but whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell fire." The Apostle Paul himself used that exact phrase in 1 Corinthians 15:36: "Thou fool, that which thou sowest is not quickened, except it die" (KJV).
Two different Greek words.
Matt 5:22 - "moros" - From which we get the word "moron"

1Cor 15:36 - "Aphron"

26

News Item8/10/11 3:22 AM
John UK | Wales  Find all comments by John UK
Silofolous wrote:
But I do also find it interesting, just looking at two different verses, that since Matthew 5:22 says "but whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell fire." The Apostle Paul himself used that exact phrase in 1 Corinthians 15:36: "Thou fool, that which thou sowest is not quickened, except it die" (KJV).
The Bible is the word of God. In other words, it is God speaking. There is a difference then, between us saying "thou fool" and God saying "thou fool".

For he seeth that wise men die, likewise the fool and the brutish person perish, and leave their wealth to others.
Psalms 49:10 KJV

The fool hath said in his heart, There is no God. Corrupt are they, and have done abominable iniquity: there is none that doeth good.
Psalms 53:1 KJV

With man being made in the image of God but fallen, there is no doubt but that we all are fools, despite honour being placed upon us in creation. For "there are none that seeketh after God". The natural man behaves foolishly, in accordance with his nature. However, those that are regenerate, and have been given wisdom, have no cause to boast over the reprobate and call him a fool. Let the scripture, the word of God, accomplish that awful task.

25

News Item8/9/11 8:14 PM
preparation  Find all comments by preparation
I think it is the accuracy of the original manuscripits at issue, and the majority of us would expect pastors/teachers with a knowledge of those languages, at least I would hope that is true.
24

News Item8/9/11 7:47 PM
Silofolous | USA  Find all comments by Silofolous
True, and that is what I'm thinking, that all of those things Jesus mentioned in Matthew 5:22 are under this same "When you do this, do this righteously" as the KJV rendering of the verse shows regarding the first of the commandments. If the other two require further exposition in even the KJV, then it makes me think that while it may be omission in the newer versions, it does not strike me as the kind of omission that actually threatens any doctrine, since both the KJV and the NIV translation would require further exposition (such as Gill's commentary) in order to accurately perceive what the text is saying.

Since I'm sure someone will mention this, yes, we have the Holy Spirit to illumine the text for us. But I see nowhere suggesting that the Holy Spirit will only illumine from the KJV. I think He also illumines what the NIV (or NASB or HCSB or Tyndale, etc.) presents as well.

23

News Item8/9/11 6:54 PM
takeheed  Find all comments by takeheed
Silofolous wrote:
The Apostle Paul himself used that exact phrase in 1 Corinthians 15:36: "Thou fool, that which thou sowest is not quickened, except it die" (KJV).
Thou fool,.... Not transgressing the law of Christ, which makes him that calls his brother a fool in danger of hell fire; for the apostle said not this in anger, and from a malevolent disposition, as that rule supposes, but out of zeal for truth, and to reprove the stupidity and folly of such a bold objector; in opposing the veracity and power of God, in setting up his reason above divine revelation, and in not attending even to natural philosophy itself; in which professing to be wise he might be justly called a fool, and therefore sends him to the husbandman to learn of him how to answer his own queries...Gill's Commentary
22

News Item8/9/11 6:38 PM
Silofolous | USA  Find all comments by Silofolous
John UK wrote:
Yes indeed, you will find some versions have inexplicably omitted the words "without a cause" from the following verse, thus making anyone who is angry (even if it be righteous anger), in danger of the judgment.
But I say unto you, That whosoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgment: and whosoever shall say to his brother, Raca, shall be in danger of the council: but whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell fire.
Matthew 5:22 KJV
Do please report back your findings when you have a moment.
It certainly is very interesting, from what I've seen thus far, and certainly not enough to elaborate as though I know what I'm talking about

But I do also find it interesting, just looking at two different verses, that since Matthew 5:22 says "but whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell fire." The Apostle Paul himself used that exact phrase in 1 Corinthians 15:36: "Thou fool, that which thou sowest is not quickened, except it die" (KJV).

Perhaps, (not certainly, just perhaps) the danger spoken of in Matthew 5:22 is not a guilty verdict, but rather a reason to "investigate" the causes behind such anger or statements. I don't know.

21

News Item8/9/11 5:46 PM
John UK | Wales  Find all comments by John UK
Silofolous wrote:
Understandable. You mention these things that are omitted, could you list some verses where the modern versions change the wording so much so that such concepts such as Jesus being "portrayed as a sinner in danger of judgment"? I'd love to do some research on that.
Yes indeed, you will find some versions have inexplicably omitted the words "without a cause" from the following verse, thus making anyone who is angry (even if it be righteous anger), in danger of the judgment.

But I say unto you, That whosoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgment: and whosoever shall say to his brother, Raca, shall be in danger of the council: but whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell fire.
Matthew 5:22 KJV

Do please report back your findings when you have a moment.

20

News Item8/9/11 5:26 PM
Silofolous | USA  Find all comments by Silofolous
John UK wrote:
Not really, no.
No matter what Bible a person uses, it is always wise to read the notes inside the cover to ascertain the translators' reason for why they did certain things. In the KJV the name of God "Jehovah" or "YHWH" is often put in full capitals as "LORD", and that is fine by me. I don't read Hebrew anyway, and when I'm reading the old testament I can always substitute Jehovah whenever I read LORD.
What concerns me though, is when in modern Bibles there is no BLOOD redemption, when eternal punishment in HELL is not there, when the DEITY of CHRIST is cast in doubt, when Christ himself is portrayed as a sinner in danger of judgment, etc etc.
Understandable. You mention these things that are omitted, could you list some verses where the modern versions change the wording so much so that such concepts such as Jesus being "portrayed as a sinner in danger of judgment"? I'd love to do some research on that.
19

News Item8/9/11 4:44 PM
Divit  Find all comments by Divit
"The dilemma for them apparently is whether they remain part of the liberal body and fight to overturn the decision, or simply leave and become a part of the Lutheran Church-Canada which is based on biblical teaching on the subject."

Hmmm What do we do?
Stay with the Word of God?
Or
Go with the Liberals?
Hmmm
Dificult isn't it?

Ditch the Bible and do what you want???

Only non-Christians find this to be a "dilemma."

As for staying within the Liberal body of the Lutheran church....
9 Whosoever transgresseth, and abideth not in the doctrine of Christ, hath not God. He that abideth in the doctrine of Christ, he hath both the Father and the Son. 10 If there come any unto you, and bring not this doctrine, receive him not into your house, neither bid him God speed: 11 For he that biddeth him God speed is partaker of his evil deeds. 2John.

18

News Item8/9/11 3:42 PM
John UK | Wales  Find all comments by John UK
Silofolous wrote:
Ok. Let me ask you this. Do you feel there are ever situations where a newer translation more accurately reflects the wording or intent?
Not really, no.

No matter what Bible a person uses, it is always wise to read the notes inside the cover to ascertain the translators' reason for why they did certain things. In the KJV the name of God "Jehovah" or "YHWH" is often put in full capitals as "LORD", and that is fine by me. I don't read Hebrew anyway, and when I'm reading the old testament I can always substitute Jehovah whenever I read LORD.

What concerns me though, is when in modern Bibles there is no BLOOD redemption, when eternal punishment in HELL is not there, when the DEITY of CHRIST is cast in doubt, when Christ himself is portrayed as a sinner in danger of judgment, etc etc.

Of course, according to Jim, Canada said NO to the KJV, and now we have this sodomite marriage catastrophy, bringing Canada under a greater deal of God's judgment on them. Phew!

17

News Item8/9/11 3:22 PM
Crosskeys  Find all comments by Crosskeys
Jim Lincoln wrote:
NASB doesn't use "Yahweh" either, because giving God a particular name makes Him look like among and unknown number, and the vowel placement for YHWH are not certain
Jim; Yahweh is also most likely an incorect transliteration - since there is no 'W' sound in Hebrew.

The Article topic::
Ro 1:25 Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen.
26 For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature:
27 And likewise also the men..."

Change the Bible and you can write your own book, invent your own religion, and Liberalism will do the rest. Namely prove that you are hell bound.

16

News Item8/9/11 3:09 PM
Silofolous  Find all comments by Silofolous
preparation wrote:
HCSB/Silofolous
Are you related to the Messianic teachers at the Refiners fire?
No. Why?

And Jim, I personally disagree about the number thing, but that's a personal viewpoint issue and not a doctrine issue, so I suppose to each his own.

15

News Item8/9/11 2:56 PM
Jim Lincoln | Nebraska  Find all comments by Jim Lincoln
The [URL=http://www.lockman.org/nasb/nasbcmp.php]]]NASB[/URL] doesn't use "Yahweh" either, because giving God a particular name makes Him look like among and unknown number, and the vowel placement for YHWH are not certain. I suppose I wouldn't have that much difficulty with YHWH being used in place of LORD. It is usually placed in the notes that is what LORD is being used in place of. You have to remember the AV used the incorrect term, "Jehovah" seven times, which of course is a complete erroneous way of rendering God's name.

Oh, the article, [URL=http://www.sermonaudio.com/sermoninfo.asp?SID=92807123612]]]The Bible Says Homosexuality is Sin[/URL].

14

News Item8/9/11 2:53 PM
preparation  Find all comments by preparation
HCSB/Silofolous

Are you related to the Messianic teachers at the Refiners fire?

13

News Item8/9/11 2:43 PM
Silofolous | USA  Find all comments by Silofolous
John UK wrote:
It is when the MV's change words that truth becomes mercurial. Some no more have "blood", and some have no more "hell", some have no more "sodomite".
Ok. Let me ask you this. Do you feel there are ever situations where a newer translation more accurately reflects the wording or intent? One such example is that in most, if not all, situations in the Pentateuch the King James Version (and, I would assume, its contemporaries) renders God as "The Lord" instead of "Yahweh". This reflects not the author, Moses, but rather the Masorites who did not mention the personal name of God, and went so far as to remove the diacritical markings from the word. The Holman Christian Standard Bible in most circumstances that use the Tetragrammaton uses His personal name:

KJV:

Wherefore say unto the children of Israel, I am the LORD, and I will bring you out from under the burdens of the Egyptians, and I will rid you out of their bondage, and I will redeem you with a stretched out arm, and with great judgments:

HCSB:

Therefore tell the Israelites: I am Yahweh, and I will deliver you from the forced labor of the Egyptians and free you from slavery to them. I will redeem you with an outstretched arm and great acts of judgment.

12

News Item8/9/11 1:28 PM
John UK | Wales  Find all comments by John UK
Silofolous wrote:
Fair enough. And I'm on the side of the inerrant Word of God.
But I can't help but notice that you did not answer..
Also, you clearly imply that "No KJV = Deviation from the Truth".
1. Correct!

2. Correct! My apologies.

3. Incorrect!

There is no implication in my post that the KJV is the only accurate Bible. Rather, I took pains to make sure I could not be accused of such a thing, mentioning the KJV AND its contemporaries.

So you would need to find a KJV-Only to answer your questions about legalism in some camps. Paul's letter to the Galatians shows us that legalism is a bewitchment, and certainly another scheme of the devil, who would love to have liberated believers bow down before the law once again and become despondent through failure. I praise God that salvation is by grace alone. WITHOUT WORKS. Yea and Amen!

It is when the MV's change words that truth becomes mercurial. Some no more have "blood", and some have no more "hell", some have no more "sodomite". And the end result of this is that it becomes easier to change words in the next new, shiny, "Bible". This is what I say!

11

News Item8/9/11 10:28 AM
unifolious  Find all comments by unifolious
Silofolous wrote:
"No KJV = Deviation from the Truth". Would then the reverse be true, that "KJV = No Deviation from the Truth"?
Why don't you use the Holy Spirit Silofolous?

John 16:13 Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come.

Using the Holy Spirit is much more accurate than using Westcott and Hort or Nestle-Aland.

10

News Item8/9/11 10:00 AM
Silofolous | USA  Find all comments by Silofolous
John UK wrote:
Odd. I don't invite anyone to a fight.
Jim of Lincoln and I have opposing views, and I trust that this event will assist him in coming to understand the agenda of Satan regarding the inerrancy of scripture. Jim's a good younger brother who can be helped.
Whose side are you on in the battle for THE BOOK?
Fair enough. And I'm on the side of the inerrant Word of God.

But I can't help but notice that you did not answer my other questions. The ones forming the majority of my previous post. I'll repost so that you don't have to scroll down:

Also, you clearly imply that "No KJV = Deviation from the Truth". Would then the reverse be true, that "KJV = No Deviation from the Truth"? If so, how then do you account for all the legalism from some (not all) KJV-onlyists? If not, then what makes you think the KJV has any definitive connection to whether or not someone has deviated from the truth?

9
There are a total of 28 user comments displayed | add new comment |Subscribe to these comments
Jump to Page : [1] 2 | last
Last PostTotal
NBC News Asks Americans To Confess Their Climate Change Sins
the quiet christian: "i've suggested before that progressives want to shame others..."
-21 min 
Evangelicals challenge Northern Ireland Human Rights...
the quiet christian: "ah, 'a woman's right to personal and bodily autonomy' is it..."
-27 min 
Whites need not apply: Campus sci-tech symposium to only...
moderator alpha: " dr. tim sa moderator, are you ever going to ask jim to refrain..."
-2 hrs 22 


Don Green
Moralistic Therapeutic Deism

Moralistic Therapeutic Deism
Midweek Service
Truth Community Church
Play! | MP4 | RSS

Beware the flatterer
Shane Stegemann

Drew McKeown
Restoring the Hopeless:..

Fearless in Faith
Drew McKeown
Play! | MP3

Rev. Arnoud T. Vergunst
Marriage Enrichment (6) The..

Marriage Enrichment
Netherlands Reformed
Transcript!Play! | MP3

Kevin Swanson
Warnings About Public Schools

Finally Time to Get Them Out?
Generations Radio
Play! | MP3

Sermon:
Preaching and Communion
Bob Vincent

SPONSOR | 3,900+

SPONSOR




                   
In heaven is no warfare but all well-fare. ... John Boys


Gospel of John
Cities | Local | Personal

MOBILE
iPhone + iPad
Church App
Watch
Android
Church App
Fire Tablet
Wear
Chromecast TV
Apple TV
Android TV
ROKU TV
Amazon Fire TV
Amazon Echo
Kindle Reader


HELP
Knowledgebase
Broadcasters
Listeners
Q&A
Uploading Sermons
Uploading Videos
Webcasting
Tips & Tricks
YouTube Screencasts
2-MINUTE TIPS

FOLLOW
Weekly Newsletter
Staff Picks Feed
SA Newsroom New!
RSS | Twitter | Facebook
SERVICES
Sermon Dashboard | Info
Audio | Video | Podcast
Sermon Player | Video
Church Finder | Info
Mobile & Apps
Live Webcasting
Listen Line
Events Support
Transcription | PowerClips
Billboards
Business Cards
SOLO Sites
Favorites | QR Codes
Online Donations
24x7 Radio Stream
INTEGRATION
Embed Codes
Goodies
WordPress
Twitter
Facebook
Logos | e-Sword | BLB
JSON API

BATCH
Transfer Agent
Protected Podcasts
Auto-Upload Sermons
Upload via FTP
Upload via Dropbox
Picasa
ABOUT US
The largest and most trusted library of audio sermons from conservative churches and ministries worldwide.

Our Services | Articles of Faith
Broadcast With Us
Earn SA COINS!
Advertising | Local Ads
CONTACT
info@sermonaudio.com
Privacy Policy | Support Us | Stories