House agrees to muzzle pastors with 'hate crimes' plan
Members of the U.S. House today approved a plan to create a federal "hate crimes" plan that will provide special protections to homosexuals and others with alternative sexual choices, but leave Christian ministers and pastors open to prosecution should their teachings be linked to any subsequent offense, by anyone, against a "gay."
The vote was 249-175, and came despite intense Republican opposition to the creation of the privileged class.
Bishop Harry Jackson Jr. of the High Impact Leadership Coalition also condemned the action, offering a warning about the future of the United States....
the fact that we see homosexuality and all other sins being magnified is because GOD is no longer restraining sin-HE has given this world up to its sins,and is preparing the churches and the world for Judgment Day(KJV 1 Peter 4:17, Romans cha. 1)We are in the Final Tribulation!
Thats okay. I like listening to Ken Ham also I've watched quite a few of his Answers in Genesis tapes over the years.
As you say, we need a lot of help here in Australia. We still send out missionaries, but what we really need is for the missionaries to stay here. There's more need here for God than in darkest Africa, mostly because we're so smug and sure that we're all good. That goes for the church and myself as much as for the world, unfortunately.
Saved By Grace Glad to hear we're on the same page However, I'm not quite sure what you mean about posting a site, as I don't know how to do that and haven't so far posted any sites on sermonaudio The reason I was posting on this thread about other sins being so much worthy of attention also, was that the bill proposed does not say anything about not being able to speak out against homosexuality; it talks about 'acts of violence' and incitation to violence. While I realise this can and most likely will be used in the way you suggest, I think it's important to read the bill itself (I believe Neil posted the link)and see that it is not criminalizing free speech, but acts of violence against the protected class of homosexuals, etc. I do think this is bad news, but I think there is a lot of hype about this that could still come to nothing. Homosexuality is wrong and always has been; it shouldn't change our point of view or our way of dealing with this issue; we should be teaching and preaching against it just as usual. God bless
I think we are pretty much on the same page. However, this report was an alarm for Christians about the legalization of perverted same gender sex rights(criminalization of pastors and ignoring their right to free speech as well as their Constitutional right to live without their rights being infringed upon by government intervention.) If you are going to be consistent in your approach to this forum then you will need to talk about the "other sins" on the other S.A. forums also, such as pride.
The icono site you posted looks good, except the page contrasting the true and the false church seems to be showing opposites, which prosperous and afflicted are not(maybe because it is okay for Christians such as Abraham, Job, etc. to have been blessed with wealth.) Have a "grace day"!
Saved By Grace, Yes, I agree with your point (it's one my father made to me). My point was simply that in all the hype of homosexuality we forget that other sins are eating away at society and concentrate on just the one. I find homosexuality extremely disgusting, and very much a sign of the times that we are in. But meanwhile, pedophiles, who took a great step forward when Bill Henson was given legal immunity from the police, notwithstanding his pornographic photos; are slavering for the time when they will be able to claim that their disgusting pictures are simply art. I don't think it will be a great step forward from that to an open if not legalised form of child prostitution. I've seen this creeping up in the same way the homosexuality crept up on society; by small degrees, yet certainly. In the same way, lying made itself acceptable and is now not looked upon as a sin, similar to adultery. I agree that homsexuality is a great, society-destructive, God-abhorrent sin. I just think that we need to realize that there is more than one sin bringing about the wrath of God.
Fundamental Baptist wrote: I can deal with working around liars but When you work around queers and they come on to you,and they will because they are aggressive and want to destroy morals well it causes the whole moral fiber of your being and the work place to cringe. Would you want a lire or a guy kissing guy or girl kissing girl to work next to you????
What about I Cor 6: 9-11? I know one poster on here (christian Swiss) who was a Sodomite and I know another who was a lesbian but now married to a pastor in N.I.
What if that queer next to you is one of God's elect-will he hear the gospel from you or will you batter him to death with a Phelps banner first? What is his only hope?
Yes I would detest the 'come on to you' in that abhorent way. But I suspect many a girl and married woman detests the same aggresive come on from the abhorent adulterer/fornicating male ALSO listed in the above scripture. What would you say to him, in the same lost condition, and yes both can know the grace of God IN Christ don't you believe
I can deal with working around liars but When you work around queers and they come on to you,and they will because they are aggressive and want to destroy morals well it causes the whole moral fiber of your being and the work place to cringe. Would you want a lire or a guy kissing guy or girl kissing girl to work next to you????
You make a perfectly valid and good scriptural point re: the abhorrent perversion of Sodomy
One could also say that Sodomy is always the consequence of believing Satan's deception-believing a lie. One isn't born a Sodomite one choses that wicked, perverted, abhorrent lifestyle. Why? One believes the Sodomite lie in the stead of God's Truth. Satan is the father of lies-so from whence cometh the wickedness of Sodomy?
Do we say as an example that Sodomy is worse than Antichrist counterfeit christianity?
Papal Rome in all its' satanic darkness in the stead of Christ incorporates homosexuality ( a practice of it's priests) but is it 'homosexuality' or the lie, the counterfeit, the deception-that makes Anti-Christ religion the great evil? Deception-another gospel and another christ-or any other way contrary to God's way is the consequence of believing a Lie. Like Lot was ordered out of Sodom, Revelation 18: 4 the order is to come out of Antichrist religion. Is that the major warning of evangelicals today?
Proverbs 6:16, 17 "These six things doth the Lord hate: yea, seven are an abomination to him: A proud look, a lying tongue..."
In Isaiah 14, Lucifer, in his foolish, prideful desire wanted to be exalted like the Most High God. This brought about that lie.
We could go on with other sins but it does seem that the sexual perversion of the same genders is so abhorrent to Almighty God that he not only wiped out an entire area but he left them to themselves to destroy themselves. They were exceedingly wicked. You are correct about our culture of lasciviousness but it is clear throughout Scripture that this is totally debased. We all can be found guilty of committing lies periodically(white or black). Would it be possible ignorance or a lie to state that homosexuality is no worse than any other sin in Scripture? Or would it be possible ignorance or a lie to state that other sins are less abhorrent than the sin of same gender sexual perversion? Indeed, a perfectly, holy God hates all sin but it seems that this sin is exceedingly wicked. Have a "grace day". Job 1:8
I spoke of lying, because in my opinion, lying is a particularly pernicious form of sin. It is so easy to lie without really thinking about it; today in society there is not any absolute truth, just 'your' truth, or 'thier' truth. I find that truth is very much abused. It bothers me that lying is such an integral part of society that we no longer think about it. Once the regard for truth is gone, it is a small step to believing in 'my' truth, which may be completely opposed to the Word of God, and ususally is. Mothers telling children about 'santa claus' and the 'easter bunny', telling their children 'small, unimportant' lies to control them; husbands and wives lying to keep each other happy . . . it's grown in our society like a cancer; below the skin and to all intents and purposes, invisible until it kills you. To the poster "the ruin of you and me": Thanks, I couldn't have put it better
The Fundamental Baptist wrote: Homosexuality will ruin a nation faster then telling a lie just ask Sodom and Gomorra.
Wasn't it a LIE, once sown, that was the ruin of all mankind-just ask Adam and Eve
Genesis 3: 1 Now the serpent was more subtil than any beast of the field which the LORD God had made. And he said unto the woman, **Yea, hath God said**, Ye shall not eat of every tree of the garden?
Genesis 3:4 And the serpent said unto the woman, ** shall not surely die**
John 8:44 Ye are of your father **the devil**and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because **there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it**
But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.
Girl Australia "just as destructive to society. Namely, adultery, and lying".
This is false. God did not destroy a city for telling little lying, but for men "lying" with men and women "lying" with women. Homosexuality is filthy vial, wicked and they are people who according to Romans Chapter 1 have been given up by God. Homosexuality will ruin a nation faster then telling a lie just ask Sodom and Gomorra. I can confess a lie but it is hard to confess a lifestyle. Homosexuality is the only sin that can break down the moral fabric of a society and the Church. This is why it is paid for by the government to exist. Romans 1:24-28 Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonor their own bodies between themselves: Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen. For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature: And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet. And even as they did not
Girl wrote: It seems to me that the church itself needs to change; and begin practising what we preach.
I believe you touch upon the main issue for the church. If the world saw that the church was different and Godly then the church would have more authority but its much to wordly. to much is tolerated. Id agree that we should practice what we preach but actualy the problem is we do.
On anglesey we stone adulterers on market day, consequently there are no homosexuals on anglesey
It seems to me that every Christian is looking into this affair and making a lot out of it; whether homosexuality ought to be preached against, or not; but it seems to me that our society has already fallen to at least two other sins that are just as heinous in the sight of God and just as destructive to society. Namely, adultery, and lying. Nowadays it is considered perfectly normal for two people to live together outside of matrimony (same sex or otherwise) and when was the last time you or anyone else thought about that 'little' white lie told to keep someone happy? Lying has the same destructive power as homosexuality, only not so outward, and adultery has long been accepted. It's time we started preaching the whole Word of God, and not just the bit that's on the forefront of the public eye. I don't care how many people it offends out there in the world; whether homosexuality, adultery, or lying; it is ALL against God's law and needs to be preached against. I think we need to take our heads out of the sand and expect to be seen and labelled as the bad guys while we tell society that they need to change. It seems to me that the church itself needs to change; and begin practising what we preach.
Let me explain the absurdity of this whole discussion:
If there are people amongst us who really are "homosexuals", doesn't calling them that by it's very nature imply that they were "born that way"? They are a class of people. They are (by definition) homosexuals by birth.
If that's the case, why would any preacher preach against them? Why should they be told that what they are doing is wrong? If they are, in fact, "homosexuals" they were, in fact, "born that way". They are what they are thru no fault of their own.
But NO. They commit sodomy. They are therefore SODOMITES (or perverts) BY CHOICE and up until the last few years everyone, even the state & local governments, understood that sodomy was a crime against nature and those who commit it ought to be shunned if not prosecuted.
Preachers everywhere ought to be preaching against the soul and nation-destroying sin of sodomy! Not arguing about whether or not it's acceptable to offend "homosexuals".
If they are "homosexuals", just leave them be-they can't help it. But they are not. They commit sodomy by choice. They are SODOMITES and I personally hope I offend the living daylights out of every one of them.
If "sexual orientation" (defined broadly as any sexual desire) becomes federally protected, why must it only be limited to violent crimes?" Is this the thin end of the wedge to "outlaw" the Law of God? It certainly seems that this is the way societal philosophy today is leading us?
WND make a point that quote, " but leave Christian ministers and pastors open to prosecution should their teachings be linked to any subsequent offense, by anyone, against a "gay."" Note their words, - 'should their teachings BE LINKED to any subsequent offense' - Thus the point being that a "perceived" act of violence against a person might be "traced" back to preaching?
Yes the law herein is essentially against "violent crime." But it also produces a special class of people selected for judicial protection because of their so called "sexual orientation." That is new and an ominous legal precedent. Watch this space???