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FRONT PAGE  |  6/17/2019
Choice News SUNDAY, JAN 25, 2009  |  114 comments
Emerging Church movement threatens church foundation, says pastor
The Emerging Church movement is seeking to revitalise the faith but may end up severing Christ's church from the Word of God, says one Reformed Presbyterian pastor and theologian.

"If churches embracing the principle of Sola Scriptura (by Scripture alone) fail to understand and address the concerns voiced in the Emerging Church conversation, we may lose an entire generation of professing believers,” says the Rev Rutledge Etheridge, an adjunct professor of systematic theology at the Reformed Presbyterian Theological Seminary (RPTS) in Pittsburgh and pastor of Providence Reformed Presbyterian Church.

According to Etheridge, the Emerging Church movement – known for flexible methodology and efforts to be culturally relevant – seeks to glean the good from Christianity's past while painting a fresh picture of the faith today. Those familiar with the movement say its members seek to live their faith in ...


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Is emerging church dangerous?
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· Page 1 ·  Found: 114 user comment(s)
News Item1/30/09 7:11 PM
John UK | Wales  Find all comments by John UK
Joyful and elect soul in Oz

I am thrilled and encouraged to hear of your evangelistic endeavours. Especially since you believe the same things as myself. I read much of Spurgeon as a young Christian, and always with profit.

It is a wonderful thing, this catholic fellowship of believers. No doubt I would fit in with the believers in Perth on a Friday night, handing out tracts, praying, witnessing, enjoying fellowship with like-minds.

As you said, God has given us his Spirit, and Paul mentions this often. If we always seek to be led of the Spirit, and not 'do our own thing', then much good can result. Souls can be miraculously saved, and added to the church. Wouldn't it be nice to see additions to the church daily, such as should be saved. Here is a good scripture to encourage us in the way:

"For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God."
(Romans 8:14 KJV)

p.s. I like your chosen name, it is very biblical to be both joyful and elect. Ta very much for your prayers; and now I know you and others are preaching the gospel outside in Australia, I will remember you also.

114

News Item1/30/09 5:59 PM
joyfulelect | South Australia  Find all comments by joyfulelect
To John,UK praise the Lord for your evangelism. This is just what I did and still do, go to where the people are like Jesus. It doesnt stop you just because youre a calvinist which I am. God has given us a brain to be led by the Holy Spirit. I will pray for your evangelism and for God to bless your efforts. In Perth city WA christians gather every Friday night in the mall to street preach and sing the praises of our God and Saviour Jesus Christ and to hand out tracts. One can not help pouring forth the water of life if one is filled with it! God be with you ! As Spurgeon said once" if you have no concern for the unsaved, it is doubtful you are saved yourself!"
113

News Item1/30/09 4:42 PM
KK | USA  Find all comments by KK
The Prosperity Doctrine that has taken hold today is DANGEROUS !!!

There are many who twist GOD'S WORD around and they always seem to end up on their perverse prosperity messages and their same old pep talk feel-good messages ... Not to say we don't need positive uplifting messages.

Rom 6:9 Knowing that Christ being raised from the dead dieth no more; death hath no more dominion over him.

10 For in that he died, he died unto sin once: but in that he liveth, he liveth unto God.

11 Likewise reckon ye also yourselves to be dead indeed unto sin, but alive unto God through Jesus Christ our Lord.

12 Let not sin therefore reign in your mortal body, that ye should obey it in the lusts thereof.

13 Neither yield ye your members as instruments of unrighteousness unto sin: but yield yourselves unto God, as those that are alive from the dead, and your members as instruments of righteousness unto God.

14 For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace.

15 What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid.

16 Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness.

KK

112

News Item1/30/09 9:59 AM
Offscouring, scum of the earth | Locked out of Yuppieland  Find all comments by Offscouring, scum of the earth
Mike wrote:
Nice Obama-like answer to a yes-or-no question.
I gave the same answer that Jesus gave the other Pharisees. You say that is "Obama-like?"

So do you think Obama is The One?

Mike wrote:
Here's two more: Under our system, Does Caesar have the authority to decide what is Caesar's?
Not under God. We have no right to surrender to Caesar that which belongs to God. If we do, we have betrayed God and apostatized, which is why the Hebrew children went into the furnace, why all the disciples were executed by the state, and why there is a deep and wide trail of blood of Christians throughout history.

Mike wrote:
What do you think of the Emerging Church movement?
I already said in the post you partly copied below, and $ermonaudio removed my post, that you will know them by their fruit and that religion has been taken over by the dark side.
111

News Item1/30/09 9:49 AM
Mike | New York  Find all comments by Mike
Offscouring, Scum of the earth wrote:
Render unto Caesar that which is Caesar's and unto God that which is God's.
Does God want men to defend their wives and children, maybe even their neighbor, from thugs and murderers and rapists?
Did Jesus tell his own disciples to buy a sword or two?
That is a question you will have to answer for yourself what you think God wants you to do regarding self-defense because Jesus also said to turn the other cheek.
You could try to harmonize these scriptures, or you could just cherry-pick whichever one you like best.
Nice Obama-like answer to a yes-or-no question.

Here's two more: Under our system, Does Caesar have the authority to decide what is Caesar's?

What do you think of the Emerging Church movement?

110

News Item1/30/09 9:45 AM
Offscouring, Scum of the earth | Locked out of Yuppieland  Find all comments by Offscouring, Scum of the earth
Mike wrote:
If Congress bans and confiscates guns, will you comply?
Render unto Caesar that which is Caesar's and unto God that which is God's.

Does God want men to defend their wives and children, maybe even their neighbor, from thugs and murderers and rapists?

Did Jesus tell his own disciples to buy a sword or two?

That is a question you will have to answer for yourself what you think God wants you to do regarding self-defense because Jesus also said to turn the other cheek.

You could try to harmonize these scriptures, or you could just cherry-pick whichever one you like best.

109

News Item1/30/09 9:09 AM
Mike | New York  Find all comments by Mike
Offscouring, scum of the Earth wrote:
At least 10 bills in Congress pending for total gun control, banning, confiscation. Congress is legislating at this moment to authorize the relocation (ie death) camps the govt under COG has been secretly building for 30 years FOR US.
Congress announcing it, making it legal and above-board, doesn't make it any less evil. Acknowledging troops in our streets, the universal draft or the destruction of our constitution doesn't make it okay. And Freedom is not Slavery, no matter what slavish Yuppie Neocons say about "compulsory volunteerism."
"The NWO is upon us, full of hope and promise." (quote from Wall Street Journal two days ago)
Resist the NWO, Refuse the Mark, Expose Zionism.
If Congress bans and confiscates guns, will you comply?
108

News Item1/30/09 8:28 AM
Offscouring, scum of the Earth | Locked out of Yuppieland  Find all comments by Offscouring, scum of the Earth
[Removed by SermonAudio.com]
107

News Item1/29/09 8:29 PM
John UK | Wales  Find all comments by John UK
Neil wrote:
Speaking of testimonies, I have a question: what if one doesn't have a very exciting one like Paul's, with its flash of light & voice from Heaven? How do you go back and get a better one? Churches seem to expect thrilling conversion speeches from newcomers, which implies that dull ones are deprecated (if not disbelieved).
The elders in one church I was [regretfully] in were deadly serious: if they didn't hear of "darkness to light" or the like, then fellowship was denied. "No soup for you!"
Candidating for baptism is a similar issue.
Hi Neil,
I made that dreadful mistake when I was first converted, thinking that all conversions must be of the same ilk. But thankfully, when I started going to church, one of the first books I loaned from the church library was George Whitefield by Dallimore. It was there that I read even Whitefield made that mistake when he was first saved. He said he came to realise that sparks and lights were unimportant in a true conversion. What counted was a genuine and simple faith, and true repentance manifest by a changed life. (Or something like that.) It is so sad that you had that experience in a church.

Well, g'night all, and God bless all evangelists and witnesses to Christ everywhere.

106

News Item1/29/09 8:01 PM
Neil | Tucson  Find all comments by Neil
Speaking of testimonies, I have a question: what if one doesn't have a very exciting one like Paul's, with its flash of light & voice from Heaven? How do you go back and get a better one? Churches seem to expect thrilling conversion speeches from newcomers, which implies that dull ones are deprecated (if not disbelieved).

The elders in one church I was [regretfully] in were deadly serious: if they didn't hear of "darkness to light" or the like, then fellowship was denied. "No soup for you!"

Candidating for baptism is a similar issue.

105

News Item1/29/09 7:51 PM
Mike | New York  Find all comments by Mike
DJC49 wrote:
This is my understanding of Armini/freewill fishing:
Dang fish. Won't bite less'n they want to.

Wraggles: Wouldn't netting fish be akin to group salvation?

104

News Item1/29/09 7:43 PM
John UK | Wales  Find all comments by John UK
When I was first converted, and I saw a friend of mine converted, he encouraged me to attend a church (the angler's keepnet). It was then I wrote out my testimony, had a few hundred copies made, and went round old Anglican churches posting them in their foyers, saying that if they wanted me to come and give a testimony of my conversion I would do so. I knew even then that those churches were full of unsaved religious people, and I wanted to help them find Jesus. None replied, so I went from house to house, delivering testimony tract, but got no replies.

So I then got a small PA system for my old car, fited it myself, and went out into the countryside to practise preaching. Then I took my friend Mike out on a preach one Sunday afternoon to the local reservoir where people were desecrating the Sabbath, fishing, sailing etc. And we preached the gospel to them through the horn speakers mounted in the front of the car. It was very exciting.

Then I joined the open-air team from church at their summer meetings in the town centre market. That was wonderful, and the pastor preached the gospel each time. I gave my testimony, but it was very poor, as I was so young in the faith. Still, as time went on, other young converts got together with me and we formed a small team to ...OOS

103

News Item1/29/09 6:53 PM
John UK | Wales  Find all comments by John UK
Wraggles wrote:
Also Mk 1:17. Fishers of men
Ah my dear Wraggles,
Now I see what you meant about the horrible hyper C evangelism.

Let me explain, me ol' mate.

The Christian churches would do well to heed the learning learnt from the ordinary angler.

What did I say? "An angler needs to decide on his species."

The gospel is for lost sinners. It is designed to save lost sinners. And there is no shortage in the provision of God for lost sinners. The 'species' then is lost sinners.

What did I say? "Select a water which contains the species."

The water is anywhere that you find lost sinners. That means forgetting the church! The church is made up of people who once were lost, but now are found. No, the places to go fishing are where the sinners hang out. Some sinners hardly move from their environment from week to week. To catch, you have to go where they are. My best experience of this was a midnight to four am sortie in London's Soho. If you want to see 'seedy life no-hopers get saved, you have to go where they hang out. Down the pubs, night clubs, town centres, preaching at Hyde Park Corner, on trains, in shops, at surgeries, on the beaches, Hells Angel camps, wherever. Open air concerts, fairs, shopping malls, coffee shops etc.

102

News Item1/29/09 6:23 PM
Michael Hranek | Endicott, New York  Find all comments by Michael Hranek
DJC49 wrote:
This is my understanding of Armini/freewill fishing:
DJC49

But thanks for the reminder of what kind of fish you'd be.
101

News Item1/29/09 5:48 PM
Wraggles  Find all comments by Wraggles
Mike wrote:
This is my understanding of hyper-cal fishing: The Angler digs a pond, stocks it with exactly the fish he decided on prior to digging it, predecides to fish only for the fish he wants, predecides to blind the other fish he stocks, (so they cannot find the bait) and marks them to destruction. (which is why they were stocked there in the first place) He patiently waits while his servants sprinkle the pond with his irresistable bait. When the fish nibble on this bait, they cannot help but to seek the Angler. The Angler places the hook in their mouths, and he reels them in. At the end of the day, all the fish that were stocked and blinded for the purpose of destruction, are netted out and tossed into a bonfire.
Thats exactly my point Mike.

John said

John UK wrote:
An angler needs to decide on his species, select a water which contains the species, know the depths and likely hidey-holes where the fish might hang out.
See he is fishing for a specific type.

Now The Lord's method was cast your net and take what ever the Lord elects to put into it.

John 21:6 And he said unto them, Cast the net on the right side of the ship, and ye shall find."

Also Mk 1:17. Fishers of men

100

News Item1/29/09 5:33 PM
Jessica Dawson | Canada  Contact via emailFind all comments by Jessica Dawson
Rogerant God bless! Well I guess I may have met the man in the picture somewhere, because he looks familiar. The Episcopals call their pastors "father" also. He is not necessarily RCC, or it also could be a nick name.

May God bless all persons that use sermonaudio, help them in their lives and bless their loved ones!

99

News Item1/29/09 5:25 PM
DJC49 | Florida  Contact via emailFind all comments by DJC49
Mike wrote:
This is my understanding of hyper-cal fishing:
This is my understanding of Armini/freewill fishing:
Before He even created a pond, the All-Powerful, Know-It-All Angler made a decree about how he's going to catch a "bunch" of fish -- but he didn't know exactly how many. He *claimed* to have SEEN IT ALL in the future, and he knows which fish will choose to be caught -- but he just doesn't know exactly which fish they might be. (Huh?)
He then digs a great pond, stocks it with 2 fish, which both go blind (MUCH to his surprise) and reproduce a pond full of blind "deadfish" which do not like him. The Angler tells all his buddies that he really REALLY wants to catch ALL the blind "deadfish" in the pond. ALL of them ... if they will let him. The Know-It-All Angler then sets out in his boat, drops a huge net big enough for all the blind "deadfish," and he waits while wringing his hands. After a while, he hauls in his net only to find NO fish! But turning around, he looks in his boat, and many blind "deadfish" happened to have jumped into his boat because they chose to! The Angler later drained the pond and set fire to all the remaining blind "deadfish." Later, at home, he was seen pouting because he couldn't catch ALL the fish.
98

News Item1/29/09 4:55 PM
John UK | Wales  Find all comments by John UK
Roger
That ice shack is amaaaazing. You actually build it on the lake, after driving on there, and then, when it up, you can sit indoors and fish through a little hole in the floor. And have a gas fire burning as well. Wa Hey! Nice and peaceful for praying, or reading the Bible also.
97

News Item1/29/09 4:33 PM
rogerant | Saskatoon SASKATCHEWAN Canada  Contact via emailFind all comments by rogerant
Jessica Dawson wrote:
Rogerant, peace be with you! I really like the big fish! I wonder if I may have met you before, you look so familiar. God bless you brother! If God has made you as great a fisher of men as you are a fisherman, you are blessed indeed!
Disclaimers:

As I noted in my post, the one set of pitures are of a PRIEST who caught the world record walleye while praying Luke 1:46-55. I am not a RCC priest.

The other set of picture was of my son in law in my boat, he is not a priest.

The other set of pictures were of a typical ice shack. It is not my ice shack and that is not me in it and I don't know whether the fellow fishing is a priest or not.

96

News Item1/29/09 4:12 PM
Mike | New York  Find all comments by Mike
Wraggles wrote:
Hey John
That sounds like a good recipe for Hyper-Calvinism.
Is that your bag???
This is my understanding of hyper-cal fishing: The Angler digs a pond, stocks it with exactly the fish he decided on prior to digging it, predecides to fish only for the fish he wants, predecides to blind the other fish he stocks, (so they cannot find the bait) and marks them to destruction. (which is why they were stocked there in the first place) He patiently waits while his servants sprinkle the pond with his irresistable bait. When the fish nibble on this bait, they cannot help but to seek the Angler. The Angler places the hook in their mouths, and he reels them in. At the end of the day, all the fish that were stocked and blinded for the purpose of destruction, are netted out and tossed into a bonfire.
95
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