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Breaking News Home | All | Religion | Society | Tech | Choice | SA Newsroom
FRONT PAGE  |  2/25/2020
TUESDAY, NOV 18, 2008  |  74 comments
Educated Catholics have sown dissent and confusion in the Church
The Rt Rev Patrick O'Donoghue, the Bishop of Lancaster, has claimed that graduates are spreading scepticism and sowing dissent. Instead of following the Church's teaching they are "hedonistic", "selfish" and "egocentric", he said.

In particular, the bishop complained that influential Catholics in politics and the media were undermining the Church.

While not naming names, he suggested that such people had been compromised by their education, which he said had a "dark side, due to original sin". ...


CLICK HERE to Read Entire Article
www.telegraph.co.uk

Is Roman Catholic Christian?
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· Page 1 ·  Found: 74 user comment(s)
News Item2/2/18 12:07 PM
Jim Lincoln | Nebraska  Find all comments by Jim Lincoln
After 10 years, the article is still accessible Too bad it was written by a Romish priest
[URL=http://www.chick.com/reading/tracts/0071/0071_01.asp]]]Are Roman Catholics Christians?[/URL]
The article is even more true today for Great Britain and the rest of the English-speaking world than when it was written.
74

News Item12/8/08 2:37 PM
Jim Lincoln | Nebraska  Find all comments by Jim Lincoln
John, I think anyone who supports [URL=http://www.sermonaudio.com/sermoninfo.asp?SID=5504151546]]]The Doctrine of Apostates[/URL] and doesn't [URL=http://www.sermonaudio.com/sermoninfo.asp?sid=711081138464]]]Disassociate with False Teachers[/URL] is not a Christian. Just stating you went through some ceremony and think it is some magical formula, is just pure Catholicism, which is why [URL=http://www.ihcc.org/images/booklets/pdf/L117.pdf]]]Christian and Catholics -- never together![/URL]

If your brother could leave the Catholic Church, then you can also, though I would hope to a more biblical church than the one he is going to.

73

News Item12/8/08 12:08 PM
rogerant | Saskatoon Canada  Contact via emailFind all comments by rogerant
JVJ wrote:
It would be like Abraham, called of God to leave his home, and to go out, not knowing where he was going.
Gal 2:11 Now when Peter had come to Antioch, I withstood him to his face, because he was to be blamed; for before certain men came from James, he would eat with the Gentiles; but when they came, he withdrew and separated himself, fearing those who were of the circumcision. And the rest of the Jews also played the hypocrite with him, so that even Barnabas was carried away with their hypocrisy.

Luke 12:51 Do you suppose that I came to give peace on earth? I tell you, not at all, but rather division. For from now on five in one house will be divided: three against two, and two against three. Father will be divided against son and son against father..

John 10:3 To him the doorkeeper opens, and the sheep hear his voice; and he calls his own sheep by name and leads them OUT And when he brings out his own sheep, he goes before them; and the sheep follow Him, for they know his voice.

Now is the time to come OUT

We have all come OUT of the RCC. DJC49, Michael Hranek and myself and many others here. Yes your family and church friends will hate you. But your EXODUS will be a witness to them.

72

News Item12/8/08 11:58 AM
DJC49 | Florida  Contact via emailFind all comments by DJC49
JVJ wrote:
THINK. . . large. . . Italian . . . families . . .culture. . . lifestyle. . . tradition. . . and, being separated from all that.
Gravy (or sauce) is thicker than religion when it comes to Italians ... but I know where you're coming from, JVJ.

JVJ wrote:
Faith would have to be operative to overcome the sacrifice of family and community and tradition for a different belief system.
I probably need not remind you that:

"For I am come to set a man at variance against his father, and the daughter against her mother, and the daughter in law against her mother in law. And a man's foes [shall be] they of his own household. He that loveth father or mother more than me is not worthy of me: and he that loveth son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me. And he that taketh not his cross, and followeth after me, is not worthy of me. He that findeth his life shall lose it: and he that loseth his life for my sake shall find it." [Matt 10:35-39]

There's a LOT more to being truly "born again" than having a ticket to ride. Right, Mr. Yurich?
_

"Yurich" ... that's NOT Italian, is it?

71

News Item12/8/08 11:19 AM
JVJ  Find all comments by JVJ
DJC49 wrote:
John Yurich,

There's something that's holding you in that church ... and it isn't the TRUTH, John.

THINK. . . large. . . Italian . . . families . . .culture. . lifestyle. . . tradition. . . and, being separated from all that.

Similar loss for the Jewish person converting to Christianity. It would mean LEAVING everything that makes life worth living.

Having close friends in each camp, and having witnessed to them, these are the heartfelt reasons for not leaving the Catholic church, and also, in the case of my Jewish friend, Judaism.

It would be like Abraham, called of God to leave his home, and to go out, not knowing where he was going. Heb. 11:8.

Faith would have to be operative to overcome the sacrifice of family and community and tradition for a different belief system.

70

News Item12/8/08 10:16 AM
DJC49 | Florida  Contact via emailFind all comments by DJC49
John Yurich,

Did it ever occur to you that although you consider yourself to be a RC, the RCC does NOT consider you as one of hers?

According to the Council of Trent, because you hold to Sola Fide, you are anathema.

Did it ever occur to you that since you believe that you were "born again" by saying a prayer for Jesus to come into your heart that you, in essence, NEGATE and (by implication) DENY the RC doctrine that at the sacrament of Baptism one is "born again?" So, how many times were you "born again?"

Therefore, according to the Council of Trent, you are twice anathema (Canons on Baptism, Canons 3&5).

So not only do you deny the actual body and blood of Christ in the RC Eucharist -- a central doctrine of the RCC -- you deny that RC baptism actually makes a person "born again" (according to RC Doctrine).

What other ESSENTIAL RC doctrine(s) do you deny, John, and still assume that you maintain your membership-in-good-standing with the RCC? How many unofficial yet binding anathemas can a RC have upon his head and still be identified as a Catholic by the RCC?

You need to stop playing the pretender, John. You really haven't thought any of this stuff through.

There's something that's holding you in that church ... and it isn't the TRUTH, John.

69

News Item12/8/08 7:27 AM
DJC49 | Florida  Contact via emailFind all comments by DJC49
John Yurich wrote:
DJC49: As important as Heb 10:23-25 is it is not required for salvation and gaining entrance into Heaven. There are individuals in the RCC, EO and Mainline Protestant Churches who are Born Again and saved. Just because someone who becomes Born Again does not want to leave the RCC, EO or Mainline Protestant Churches does not mean that they will not gain entrance into Heaven.
You're workin' both sides of the street, John.

And you did NOT answer my question -- as a matter of fact, you totally avoided it -- about worshipping and fellowshipping with the saved.

As far as I can determine, John, you THINK you have your "born again ticket" and that's all that matters. You can worship where you want, how ever you want, commune with whomever you want, even go through the motions with others who do NOT believe as you do.

Let me ask you something here, John: If a Jehovah's Witness became "born again" by hearing and believing the Gospel, would it be okay for him to remain in fellowship with his former JW brethren and continue attending JW services each week? Perhaps he could even still claim to be a JW -- only now a "born again" JW who worships alongside other JWs -- he just doesn't believe ALL the things that they do.

Get the picture?

68

News Item12/8/08 6:49 AM
John Yurich | USA  Find all comments by John Yurich
John UK:I hear the Gospel Of Christ by watching Trinity Broadcasting Network and Word Network where they preach the Gospel Of Christ. I never stated that Pastry had a devil. I can't remember ever stating that.

DJC49:As important as Hebrews 10:23-25 is it is not required for salvation and gaining entrance into Heaven. There are individuals in the RCC, EO and Mainline Protestant Churches who are Born Again and saved. Just because someone who becomes Born Again does not want to leave the RCC, EO or Mainline Protestant Churches does not mean that they will not gain entrance into Heaven.

rogerant:I do not teach that Christ's sacrifice was not "sufficient" to save those who are lost. I teach that Christ's sacrifice was sufficient to save those who are lost and I believe in Justification By Faith in Christ alone. And just because I am remaining in the RCC does not mean that I condone the unscriptural RCC doctrines and unscriptural parts to the Mass. If I have totally dispensed with the unscriptural doctrines and unscriptural parts to the Mass then I am not condoning those doctrines..

Jim Lincolno you believe that unless someone who becomes Born Again is not a member of an Evangelical Protestant Church that they will not gain entrance into Heaven?

67

News Item12/7/08 4:14 PM
Jim Lincoln | Nebraska  Find all comments by Jim Lincoln
Excellent comment, rogerant, However, while John, if he were a Christian, would [URL=http://www.johnankerberg.org/Articles/roman-catholicism/RC0200W2.htm]]]Come out of the Catholic Church[/URL], but then perhaps that would upset too many family members? Would that happen, John?

Luke 9
26 For whosoever shall be ashamed of me and of my words, of him shall the Son of man be ashamed, when he cometh in his own glory, and the glory of the Father; and of the holy angels.
Luke 12
51 Think ye that I am come to give peace in the earth? I tell you, Nay; but rather division:
52 for there shall be from henceforth five in one house divided, three against two, and two against three.
53 They shall be divided, father against son, and son against father; mother against daughter, and daughter against her mother; mother in law against her daughter in law and daughter in law against her mother in law.

66

News Item12/5/08 10:40 AM
rogerant | Saskatoon Canada  Contact via emailFind all comments by rogerant
John Yurich wrote:
Why should I leave the RCC? I will still gain entrance into Heaven even if I do not leave the RCC because I fulfilled the only requirement there is for gaining entrance into Heaven which is to receive Jesus as ones Savior.
The RCC does not teach that through faith alone one receives the imputed righteousness of Christ. They teach that Christ's righteousness is "infused" into the believer through the physical baptism by a priest at birth, enabling him to fulfill requirements of the law "through love"

The RCC has anathematized the Gospel of Free grace and anyone who believes it. Staying in this communion with it's official teaching condones these teachings.

In other words you, and your communion teach that Christ's s sacrifice was not “sufficient” to save those who were lost. Man must be: Baptized by a priest, believe the church’s teachings, live a life of charity and love, confess one’s sins to a priest, and pray for forgiveness to idols, and then suffer the chastisement of your shortcomings while in purgatory.

Heb 10:29 Of how much worse punishment, do you suppose, will he be thought worthy who has trampled the Son of God underfoot, counted the blood of the covenant by which he was sanctified a common thing...

65

News Item12/5/08 7:35 AM
DJC49 | Florida  Contact via emailFind all comments by DJC49
John Yurich wrote:
Why should I leave the RCC?
John,
Do you feel as if you are presently worshipping and fellowshipping with THE SAVED? IOW, are you coming into contact with the "body of Christ" by attending RC mass? Take into consideration the following from Hebrews 10:23-25

"Let US hold fast the confession of our hope without wavering, for He who promised is faithful; and let US consider how to stimulate one another to love and good deeds, NOT FORSAKING OUR OWN assembling together, as is the habit of some, but encouraging {one another;} and all the more as you see the day drawing near."

How are you to hold fast a confession of (OUR) hope with those who do NOT believe as you do? And don't these verses exhort you to assemble together with other members of Christ? Is that what you are doing now? Don't you realize the danger of NOT coming together with fellow Christians?

Are you not now forsaking the assembling together with your true brothers and sisters in Christ? So why continue flying the [URL=http://www.freewebs.com/pauldmolina/Papal%20Flag%20(1).jpg]]]wrong flag[/URL] of allegiance above your masthead?

64

News Item12/5/08 6:43 AM
John UK | Wales  Find all comments by John UK
John Yurich,

Hello again, John. You make a perfectly logical deduction in your post - well done!

But! If you are attending a Roman Catholic Church, where will you take contacts to hear the gospel? Not to your own church, they will never hear it there. Plus, you will not hear it yourself, thus denying yourself the sanctifying and encouraging word of God towards sinners. You will only be hearing gross error, and your 'faith' may well decline. If you have 'faith', that is.

And another thing, did you ever repent of saying that Ian R.K. Paisley had a devil? Tut tut! That is a dangerous thing to do!

63

News Item12/5/08 6:14 AM
John Yurich | USA  Find all comments by John Yurich
DJC49 wrote:
BTW, your incisive logic and analytical prowess should have -- by now -- informed you that it is necessary to get out of a church in which you no longer believe in.
Why should I leave the RCC? I will still gain entrance into Heaven even if I do not leave the RCC because I fulfilled the only requirement there is for gaining entrance into Heaven which is to receive Jesus as ones Savior. But since you guys keep stating that when someone becomes Born Again that they have to leave the RCC, EO and Mainline Protestant Churches and join a Evangelical/Fundamentalist Protestant Church then the only logical summation is that you guys believe that there are 3 requirements for entrance into Heaven:
(1)Receive Jesus as Savior
(2)Leave the RCC, EO and Mainline Protestant Churches
(3)Join a Evangelical/Fundamentalist Protestant Church

If you guys believe that there is but one requirement for gaining entrance into Heaven namely receive Jesus as Savior then it would be totally superfluous to you guys if someone who became Born Again remained in the RCC, EO and Mainline Protestant Churches and did not align themselves with a Evangelical/Fundamentalist Protestant Church.

62

News Item11/28/08 11:16 AM
GG  Find all comments by GG
Aside from my being a Catholic, was there a good reason for deleting my last two posts? Was what I wrote more offensive than DJC49's posts? See if send you a Chrismas card this year!
61

News Item11/27/08 9:05 PM
Michael Hranek | Endicott, New York  Find all comments by Michael Hranek
GG wrote:
Lyn: You say our God-made Tradition are worthless and tasteless, but we have survived as a Church for over 2000 years, something very few organizations, and absolutely no Protestant or Non-Denominational Churches in the entire world can claim; this is solely because God is on our side.
GG
It might be quite important to you to realize just what "god" is on your (RCC's) side (same one as is on the side of the Muslims? CCC 841) and for that matter realize that the Only True and Living God has been long suffering towards you not desiring you to perish, to stand guilty before Him in your sin, as a RC that would include the sin of idolatry where the RCC has made God to be someone He is not and in RC Tradition worship Him in vain.

Popularity proves nothing regarding what is right and wrong or true and false...for example President elect Obama is quite popular right now but you should know that doesn't make him right does it. Or Islam is another example of "popularity" and that doesn't make Allah any less a false god and doesn't make Mohammend any less his false prophet does it.

60

News Item11/27/08 7:09 PM
DJC49 | Florida  Contact via emailFind all comments by DJC49
GG wrote:
In Isaiah 22:23 [ff] ... Clearly, this part of the quote has nothing to do with St Peter.
Clearly, NOTHING in all of Isaiah 22:20-25 has anything to do with Peter! For that matter, there's not a stitch in all of the Old Testament that has anything to do with Peter.
_

Now ......... Even if I were still a RC religionist, I'd thoroughly enjoy listening to [URL=http://www.sermonaudio.com/sermoninfo.asp?SID=1023072014154]]]THIS SERMON by Brian Borgman[/URL] entitled:
"Oracle Concerning the Valley of Vision (Pt 2)"
Give it a listen.
It's the BEST treatment of Isaiah 22:15-25 you'll find here on SermonAudio.com

Brian is a wonderful exegete of Scripture who NEVER uses God's Word as a "springboard" for his own particular pet preaching topics. His intent is to get to the bottom of what the specific Scripture verses mean -- the original intent.

I double-dog-dare you to listen to this sermon, GG. You'll thank me!

_

Lance,

What was definitely NEW about it was that the Assumption was now official RC DOGMA! It also instituted August 15 as a Holyday of Obligation for all RCs. Mass attendance was mandatory on that date thereafter. IF a RC missed a Mass on Aug 15 that went unrepented of, MORTAL SIN was thereby committed and hell assured!

59

News Item11/27/08 7:08 PM
Lance Eccles | Goulburn NSW  Contact via emailFind all comments by Lance Eccles
DJC49 wrote:
On November 1, 1950, Pope Pius XII solemnly declared:
It was hardly anything new. Belief in the Assumption of the Blessed Virgin Mary goes way back. The Orthodox churches, which separated from Rome 1000 years ago, believe it too.
58

News Item11/27/08 6:15 PM
lyn | usa  Contact via emailFind all comments by lyn
GG~everything that you spew out is nothing more than your OPINION, and that you are entitled to. You cannot prove with any concrete evidence ANYTHING you say. You come on these boards and argue round and round, the same old garbage, why? NO ONE here is interested in converting to a man-made tradition.
You will find out for sure if your opinion is right, the very minute you draw your last breath and your soul separates from your earthly body. Then, the truth will be oh so plain.
57

News Item11/27/08 5:52 PM
GG  Find all comments by GG
[Removed by SermonAudio.com]
56

News Item11/27/08 5:38 PM
DJC49 | Florida  Contact via emailFind all comments by DJC49
lyn wrote:
GG~How in the world do you establish any kind of office of papacy from Isaiah 22?! ...
Again, other offices were clearly established in scripture, apostles, bishops/elders, and deacons. Why would such an 'important' office of 'pope' be overlooked by Jesus Christ and not clearly be taught; instead of having to take some passage from the old testament and twist it to fit?
What's amazing about Pope Peter I is this:
Although the other apostles and disciples were on hand when Jesus proclaimed Mt 16:18,19 -- none of them afterward ever acknowledged Peter's primacy. John never wrote about it. Neither did James or Jude. Peter himself never made claim to it. And in the entirety of the book of Acts is Peter's "papacy" ever even hinted at. As a matter of fact, it was JAMES who was center-stage at the Jerusalem council in Acts 15, not Peter. And throughout the NT epistles it's clearly seen that James (not Peter) is the head honcho of the church at Jerusalem. For why do you think that Peter did an "about-face" concerning eating with the gentiles when JAMES' boys showed up at Antioch in Gal 2? Because Peter was Pope??

BTW, there is no clear evidence in Scripture that Peter was ever in Rome nevermind being its 1st bishop!
All they have is oral tradition.

55
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