You're free to leave at this time or you're welcome to stay as well before our church family We invite you to be able to stay Yes Get cozy Up in the balcony as well. We got two full rows good We're gonna invite our church family from the fellowship Paul since we're not going to be streaming this on the camera To come in as well. So brief transition for you guys would allow for a few minutes bathroom breaks and all of that and then we will get started. All right, might have some more trickling in, but we're gonna go ahead and get started. Thank you for sticking around, and I'd also like to share with you just a brief overview of what we have done moving our church in this direction. We have spent countless hours in researching this. I mentioned it in the sermon, but it was kind of funny, I'm joking with Scott now, maybe he's getting free labor out of me as a candidate for the associate pastor for researching all this child protection such, but it was important for us to be aware of what's going on and putting time into this. And this wasn't just something that, a checkbox, we wanted to be very thorough in what we're, the direction God would have us to go, but something that would benefit and bless. This was more than just, man, we wanna make sure that, We lock every door, and we wanna have bars, and we wanna have barbed wire around the church. No, we wanna be inviting, but we also have to have something in place that would allow for us to identify characteristics and behaviors we wanna learn from other churches. And so part of what the research that we've done is we've reached out to different pastors. I've reached out to pastors on the eastern seaboard side and looked at their policies. We've done research looking at churches in the local area. We've talked to attorneys, we've talked to our insurance and their attorneys and their representatives, but something else that we've done too is we've looked into reading articles, other concerned members of WCC and our deacons who have come to us with these concerns. We've just had a very open ear and wanting to learn and see where we can improve. Our elders retreat was spent more like an extended elders meeting. Probably the funnest thing we got to do was complete a puzzle Vicki Donald started. But I'm telling you, it was every meal we were talking about this. Every meal late into the evening, this was the top priority for us. It was important for us, important. And hearing from a number of you before we went on the retreat, it was obviously important to you as well. So my thanks to the elders and their wives for sticking it out and working through this. We've had correspondence via email and phone calls with multiple attorneys, both from CLA, if you're not familiar with CLA, they're a Christian Law Association, and with the legal department with Brotherhood, along with meetings with our insurance representative, Jeff Myers, with American Church Group, who represents Brotherhood Mutual. Another example of efforts made on the front end is that some of our deacons expressed desire to be trained with church security, go to a class, go to some place where they educate and equip, for churches to be able to protect themselves. It was something that we were all too happy to support. We were able to send a number of them and some other members to what was called Shepard's Watch Regional Training Class for Church Security. This was back in October. An example of the efforts made on the back end, not just the policy for protection up front, but on the back end as far as our ministering and counseling, efforts were made when we took steps to examine and purify our own church body. and our own individual families by equipping our men to battle sexual sin. This direction has the aim to take our men from being merely free from sin to leading our families and strengthening our church. Again, we're not just addressing the front end of the church's need but the back end to minister as well. I also want to make this known that we as your elders count it a privilege as well as our calling to get into the trenches and counsel and minister to you because your marriages are worth it. Your families are worth it. Your children are worth it. Your future for your families is worth it. If Christ died for it, it's a privilege for us as your elders to get in the trenches with you, have the hard conversations and minister and counsel. We do not begrudge it at all. It is our passion and it's our pleasure to serve Christ in that way. See, we want to fight for your marriages. We also want to help strengthen your walk with Christ. We believe we have done our best to manifest this faithfully by participating in the Conquers series. Talked to Pastor Scott about it. It'd be good for you to go. And he showed up and was blessed by it. And in turn was being able to be a blessing to others. But also, a couple of us are leading a couple of the groups, ministering to the guys. But also, Our elders took a bold step in just opening up their hearts to ministering, to share their story, unprompted, in the hopes of being a blessing to some that are hurting, that there is hope in the gospel. There is healing in Jesus Christ. This has been our foot forward to not mention it in passing. We understand that sexual sin is a big issue, but with the protection of our kids, dealing with sin, this is our job. This is what we're endeavoring to do. We want to show that support, that we want to protect what God blesses us. But we're also here to minister to the broken. We believe in the power of the gospel to pick up the broken pieces. and see what Christ does in making them whole. We are fully committed to faithfully shepherding according to our calling in the scriptures. Some things that were learned in our communication with Jeff Myers and the attorneys as well as our training in church security are as follows. And these are things that were very important when we learn these things that help guide and shape the direction of what the policy should look like. Insurances are now dealing with more claims of abuse of youth by other youth rather than youth by adults. That was a shocking one for me when you hear what's on the news. But the reality of what the insurance companies are dealing with is this. This came from Jeff Myers. He said, with the availability of pornography and pressure of making sex education available at the primary level in our schools, it is no wonder that we would be seeing this. And research conducted by CDC, which centers for disease control and prevention, estimates that approximately one in six boys and one in six girls are sexually abused before the age of 18. 35.8% of sexual assaults occur when the victim is between the ages of 12 and 17. Something else that we learned was that our church's physical layout has some inherent vulnerabilities. They were pointed out to us during our walkthrough when we had Jeff, when we were renewing our insurance policy, we took a walk through the church He's also very impressed, though, by what the deacons did with the emergency responses. You guys have seen the clipboards there in the foyer, in the fellowship hall. He was blown away by that. He did say, your church's head and shoulders above most churches I work with. But he was also pretty clear when he said, there's some things that need to be changed or looked at at the very least. This would include things like unused rooms not being locked, ease of access to the ed building from the front parking lot during Sunday school hour. And I'm not saying that we're taking everything and we're just, we're doing whatever they direct. We pray about these things. We seek counsel, we seek wisdom from God on what changes need to look like. Something I learned from talking to a couple of the attorneys with CLA is that churches that have the kind of environment where predators thrive have two characteristics. Number one, they are small town churches where everyone knows everyone and is too trusting. Now this is not to say we need to be looking over the shoulder all the time. But he did say there is an inherent risk when we assume. And that's one of the benefits of having a policy. We're not looking for defamation of character, but we're looking for behaviors that lend itself to a threatening situation. That's why we have this moving forward. We want to make sure that it's the most up-to-date. Something else he pointed out, too, is he said the abuse of authority is the other characteristic. He says it's not restricted, really, to church leaders, but it's also well-known in faithful adult church members, Sunday school teachers, and so on. So that is to say there is nobody, no member of this church that is above the policy. I mean, we can see examples in scripture. Look at King David. There is no person who is above what is right and what is wrong. Something else that was shared I thought was sobering is he said, you know, Limelight seems to go to the Catholic Church for all of these things that are happening. He says they got numbers ranging from 2011 to 2014, I believe it was. It was like 120 somewhat confirmed allegations of sexual abuse. And he said they can do that because they have the authority structure of reporting. He said fundamental churches are churches like this. When I described our church, he said, you don't have that kind of structure because we're autonomous. He said what they did is they went to the three major, research was done in three major insurance companies that cover these churches. And he said, with these characteristics, you want to guess what those numbers were. I couldn't hope to imagine. And he said, same time frame between 2011, 2014, the allegations were in the ballpark of 180 compared to the Catholic churches, or I think it was 280 to the Catholic churches. And he said the number, and here's the thing is the numbers are continuing to increase. And he said, I want that to sink into your mind, Pastor Richardson, when you think about this. And it did. It burdened my heart. This is the reality of the world that we serve in. This is the world we're called to minister to. And so we have taken this very seriously, and we do appreciate your patience, but this is a snapshot, just a snapshot of the time put in to the research and time spent away from families to send people off to training, because we want to be equipped. We wanna have our church protected. At this time, though, I wanna give you an update on our progress. I'll be speaking on behalf of the elders regarding the policy of where we are at, but I've asked Steve Moeller and some of the deacons to kind of funnel yourselves to the front to help answer any questions, but Steve's gonna give us an update where the deacons are at as far as changes that we're looking at. Nothing's set in stone, but these are things that we are considering, but I wanna share with you where we are at with our policy. The policy's been reviewed. And it is in the process of actually being sent to Brotherhood. We've asked a number of people, including our elders. We've asked a number of our deacons and those who participated, go into the training to review anything that they see from the training that stood out that needed to be either amplified. But we want to make this clear, too. We don't submit it to the insurance and they write off and say everything's okay. They're going to get back to us and say, eh, or they're going to approve. So we're still in the process of, it's pretty close to being finalized on our end, but we need to submit it to a brotherhood for insurance for them to be able to review it and to say yay or nay. So that's where we're at with that policy, but things we are looking at into having in the future regarding this is we're looking at having training curriculum for everybody who gets screened in our church. It's not just a background check we're submitting, we're gonna be following up on references as well, and we are looking at opportunities to be able to have training available, what to look for. So the burden of responsibility to make sure the curriculum's up to date is not on us, it's on wherever resource we're going to, but it's important for us to be aware of what to be looking for. Something else we're looking at doing as well is we're entertaining the idea of maybe having a copy of the children's policy presented at membership. I'm not sure if we did or not, but I think it'd be a good idea to make that very public, not just our statement of faith, but where we stand with the protection of our children for anybody who would consider joining this local body. And the reason why is because we want to make it the priority. We're sending the message to the community and anybody who visits that we value our children, and we are protecting what God has blessed us with. So that is where we're at, and it's not probably too much detail. Hopefully we can answer more of your questions in Q&A, but that's where we're at with the policy piece. And at this time, I'll invite Steve to come up and give us an update on where the deacons are at. All right, so yeah, I'm Steve Moeller. So I coordinate the deacon ministry. And so like Pastor Nathan was saying, this fall, four of us went to a church security conference in Longview. So that included Sterling, Jesse, Eldon also went, and myself. And so it was a full-day conference, so if you're interested in hearing any more about that, you can see any of the four of us about what we did there. So after that, we had a deacons and elders meeting, so this would be after the elders had their annual get-together and we had this conference, and we discussed all the what we'll call short-term action items, things that we could do right now that we could at least facilitate while we're working on the policy. So the three things that we're in the process of working on right now is we're surveying the property along the north side over here. And by doing that, we'll be able to put a fence along that whole line there, because that's just an area that kids can wander off into, and it's really difficult to figure out what to do in that area. So we're going to get that fenced in. One of the things that the insurance guy recognized was the ed building, the security, the doors needed an upgrade. So we're looking into upgrading the doors to make it more secure. And then I think everybody's noticed, especially in the wintertime, the outdoor lighting, especially in the parking lots, are in need of upgrades. So we've got several things happening here in the next few weeks that we're working on there. So with that, that was just pretty much to get us started. If Sterling and Jesse want to come up front, we'll address any questions. And what we'll do is, if you have a question, I'll repeat the question so that Everybody else can hear what it hear what they said and then Jesse or sterling will or our pastor Nathan will address address that Anybody want to throw a question at be the first one out of the gate. Yeah, I So yeah, so the question was, you know, Sunday night if you weren't aware, is it three-year-old Ethan Sauer? He was a runaway, so he left the church, and so we were all in the mode of finding him. And so Jesse's gonna address, or Sterling, you are? Okay, here we go. So something you may have noticed, we have started creating emergency policies for earthquakes and those kind of things. And it was just a start for us. And part of this is, yes, that was a new experience for us. And it might have not been the most wonderful thing to go through. Everybody got very excited at the same time, and it wasn't very organized so we have already had one deep debrief meeting This coming Thursday the Deacons will be sitting down to have another one to come up with a policy on How we can better respond to those kind of things? So yes that will be being addressed here very shortly And as part of that, we would like to communicate to the congregation at large kind of how we would like you guys to be involved in that as well. It's not just something that the deacons or, you know, a select group of people is going to do. Obviously, on last Sunday night, everybody got involved right away, which is awesome. It just was super chaotic and not very effective. Going forward, as we have better plans in place and better systems in place, we'll update you guys on a little bit more of how that's going to work as well. And also, just to touch on that, when we went to the security conference, that was something that we did learn about. So there is processes to put in place for that when that happens. So anyway, so there'll be more to follow on that. So yeah, so the question was occupancy limits both for the sanctuary and especially the fellowship hall, because once we move over there, there's a ton of kids. So Pastor Nathan, do you have, do you know? Okay, so is anybody? Dave, Dave is the one that had, Dave. But we've written that question down so we will follow up on that Molly so Yeah, yeah go ahead Audrey So the main concern from the insurance with the front doors in the ed building is to be able to lock them, they don't have crash bars. You can't exit when they're locked. So part of that is just keeping them locked when Sunday school is in session. So you can't have just anybody wander in. But the downside is right now, if you lock them, not anybody can get out either. So that's just one of the things we're looking at upgrading. Jim? All right, so the question is about the, I think the offices, the Ed building as far as, since it's so accessible to the road especially, is there panic buttons and that kind of stuff? No, there's not. Yeah, so I mean, obviously there's not, but that's the reason that we saw the short term thing is first getting the proper doors there so that you can lock them and be able to still get out. Yeah, Pat. As far as Jim's question? Oh. The children are much more important than the pastors here at WCC. Let's give the next question to Isaac. All right, so Candy's question was getting cameras, surveillance cameras, you know, based on the different areas. So it has been a consideration. We've discussed security cameras. The issue with having security cameras is somebody needs to be watching them and reviewing them on a regular basis. And we'd, like, first we'd need to have a setup to do that. So we have not seen it as the most. Efficient use of time or money at this point. It's something that we'll probably revisit and consider to look at as we go forward with security because As security goes we'll start. We're definitely starting with children Sunday school But we'll probably continue to progress throughout the church. I So the general question is, what about having security cameras so that we could, like on last Sunday's incident, we could go back and look at them and at least see which direction he traveled. So that is something that we have discussed and that is on the agenda. We don't know where we're at exactly at the moment on it, but it is definitely on the agenda. Yeah, Tony. to look at, but it's also, if you have cameras up, people think twice about doing something. So it really is coming from a large church, but when they have cameras, I cannot tell you how many times those cameras actually help in situations. So I would really encourage families to look at not only So the comment, just to summarize that, was the ability to have cameras can also be a deterrent, and it's just definitely something that we will be looking at, the elders and deacons will be looking at that. Right. Right. Yeah. Yeah, so Ken, he's just reemphasizing all the value that cameras do give to us as far as being able to review and monitor. So, yep. So if I understand the question, because right now our policy is really anybody who is working directly with children, but you're saying anybody public facing, leading music, have a background check done as well. We don't have anything like that, but we can take it into consideration. And it was discussed at the Shepherds watch and in our deacon means was extending background checks to all deacons anybody that's going to be concerned in helping with safety issues and Yep, anybody that's in any way involved with the Sunday school so we expect not only the depth of those background checks to change but also the breadth of them and Yeah, to be clear, last Sunday was not Ben and Marilyn's fault. That wasn't necessarily anybody's fault. That just, it's something that happens. And I appreciate the fact that they do a great job, in my opinion, of trying to keep an eye on their kids. And that, yeah, this was not meant to be a criticism of them in any way. We just like to learn from things that happen. A lot of times in church or organizational policy, we like to say that policies have a name on them. Somebody did something, so then we had to have a policy. We don't want to just be reactive. We want to be proactive and try to try to be good stewards of what we have and who we have without having to just react to a situation. So, this has been in the works long before last weekend and it was in no way a criticism to the Sowers. So, the question was on will the policy change the way that the kids are dismissed from Sunday school? Yes, there's been a discussion. And it's a big logistical thing to get over. Because right now, we have 15 minutes between Sunday school getting out and everybody showing up and hearing me already. So checking into Sunday school for kids is we do keep a roster of all the kids that are in there So we know who's present but the process of checking kids out to specific parents and double checking is a process that we don't have like everybody comes here and parents show up and kind of claim the kids that older ones are released and And so it's a matter of parents would then have to go to the Sunday school get their kids and return so we'd have to change the timeframes of our services and Get into how that process is gonna happen so it is a discussion at some point I expect it will be in place, but it's I'm gonna take a little change for all of us to get there and Tag on that piece. So for those of you who've been coming to this church for a long time and you have your kids, you're thinking, what in the world? Why would we even consider something like that? That's just a big hassle. But we also have to be forward thinking. The people that we're gonna be ministering to come from broken homes, and we don't know who has rights to what kid when mom drops off, if dad shows up. We're responsible for that. So that's why we have the policy or that we're working toward that because again, we're trying to protect the children and be on the same page with what's expected of us. So just to tag that little piece on if it seems like a lot, that's where we're trying to go with it. Was also going to mention with respect to that question we have been adjusting Howard dismissing children from Sunday school May have noticed that my class is now coming out here and waiting for us to identify a parent or someone related to that child That we know that child should be with to let them go which is different than what we had been doing in the past we're also releasing children to come back through the back of the building and out this way and So yeah, we've already started changing how we're doing it. We're still a work in progress. We haven't quite come up to what it's going to be in the end, but it's changing it, so. Yeah. So the question was about VBS and will the policies that are put in place also address the VBS? What were the specifics on VBS? Who had the question? Lee? Just how much would be the background checks with the records as well? Is that something that would be applied with VBS as well? Because obviously a number of people know VBS. So how does that all inform their separate little tangent, so to speak, policy that we do things a little different for that because we're dealing with different people It'd be consistent what we've done in times past, whether they're a member here or somebody else, we would do a background check on them, just because it's not our kids, neighbor's kids coming in, and they're dealing directly with kids, and it's been the policy of the church, so nothing really changed in that regard, so we'd still continue to make sure that those are up to date, or give those to those who haven't had one done yet. Yeah, Jim. So the question is for new members or new people coming in as far as is there a time period that between the time they ask to volunteer? Yes, so great question, and especially for people transferring, maybe they're experienced in ministry. What we have in writing, what we're asking for is six months of regular attendance so we get to know them as well, and if it happens to be a ministry involving children, they would need, at this point, required to have a background check. It's something we would also cover in membership meeting as well, being able to serve. Good question. Yeah, Audrey. Question is, how often are background checks redone after they've been approved? Insurance is recommended, talking to Jeff, anywhere between two to three years. But we would like to kind of get everybody on the same cadence of when background checks are done or due. So we're looking right now, sticking with maybe two years for background checks. But with the process, because it's kind of a hassle. Some of you guys get calls from us at random asking for information so we can plug it in into the portal and send it. So part of the process of what we're looking at doing is making it seamless and electronic where you get a notification not from us or a phone call from us. So you're able to actually fill out the application yourself if a new background check is required. So. So since Pastor Scott always picks on Dave, Isaac did a background check on Dave last night, so just to let you know that. Yes, for those of you that don't know, I volunteer as a sheriff's deputy and I was on patrol last night and happened to see Dave's car, not knowing it was his, so. He did pass. Under his current name, he informed me this morning. Oh, yeah, Jim. I just want to show the exact roof as the children's area. I don't necessarily want someone moving around in the rest of the building while they're trying to get legitimate counsel. That's a good question. So yes, we would be very careful during those times of ministry, especially if they had any kind of restrictions, parole officer and such, we would always be in communication if that would be the circumstance. We're looking, part of the policy change we're looking at is having very clear guidelines how to do that. Our heart is to do it, but we are not compromising or being irresponsible with how we minister to people. So we want to make sure that what we have in place in our policy is something that we can legally work with and something that insurance can also approve. Good question, thank you. Okay, so you want to close? Dave, did you have a question? So the question is, we are a reporting church, so as I understand Washington state law, there are some, help me with the verbiage on this one, where ministers non-mandated reporters, but I don't have the reference in front of me, but if we have a policy that states that we report under certain conditions, that we're not to be negligent in letting the authorities know, letting our insurance know, We have to stick with what the policy is. So the policy gives us guidelines. The current one does, and I don't have the current one in front of me. I have notes from the first, the one we're looking at. But reporting is under certain conditions, and we're not the experts on investigating whether or not it's a legitimate claim or not. But the policy gives us guidelines of when it would be appropriate to notify the authorities. So now that's probably a very vague answer. Okay, so the reporting church is that we would notify the authorities if there's any cases of sexual abuse, sexual misconduct, criminal activity. Thank you. So we would be reporting that. We would consult the policy as far as what the best course of action is. We would not... What's that? I wish I had the notes in front of me, Dave. The question is, would we report a young man came to us, Yes, that a young man shared with us that he touches his sister in an appropriate way, would we turn him in? We would have to look at the policy to see what it says. And if that's what's dictated, we would work with the parents. But what it does not mean is that we would cut all ties to the family because we would still be ministering to the family. But if that's what's reported, what's required of us in the policy, we would follow through with it. Right. We do, I can pull up, look for the old policy, pull up to see what the guidelines are, but like I said, what I have in front of me is what we're proposing, and it's not been approved yet by our insurance. So part of what we have, the policy, this is some excerpts from the existing policy. It says, WCC reports incidents of child abuse or neglect to the proper authorities. This includes participants in temporary church programs or ministries. Do not treat suspicious activities as frivolous. Notify the child's parents, guardian. Notify someone in leadership immediately so that an investigation can commence. Leadership will suspend the accused person from duties. Involving children until the investigation has been completed, leadership will cooperate fully with law enforcement officials. The leadership will inform the victim's family of the steps being taken and continue to keep them advised of the status of the investigation. If child abuse is confirmed, leadership will ask the victim's family what actions they would like to take and cooperate to address the requests within the bounds of the law. In an instance where a child abuse is confirmed, the church will immediately dismiss the worker from his or her position, remove him from WCC. So in this case, it would be circumstantial based upon, did it happen on the church grounds? But if it was something that happened in somebody else's home, we don't have anything fleshed out in the policy for that. But we would want to make sure that we are complicit with the law if it requires us. So what we have written down, just to be clear, what I read to you is something specific. If it happened on church grounds during a ministry, It was a worker of the ministry, whether it be a volunteer or an employee. These are the steps that we would be taking. Does that help answer the question, Dave? What's that? Not at this time. You can get the mic. Yes, Molly. Yeah, so the question was, is there a scriptural mandate backing our decision to report to law enforcement? And yes, we would look to a passage like Romans 13, because the authorities are there in place for the protection to reward those who do good and punish those who do wrong. And we believe that God works through consequences. And so there is a tension that is there as far as what degree is our influence, especially being a church that operates within this country and this culture, we have laws that point out specific things that are criminal activity. And so our obligation to respond biblically would be found in Romans chapter 13 as an example. Do you want to follow that? I wanted to just invite you to consider a tension that exists for us as elders, so that I suppose I have two requests. You can be gracious toward us regarding whatever direction we take, and you can pray for us to have wisdom. And here's the tension. Let's consider the scenario that Dave Zumstein just shared, where a young man comes and shares with one of the elders sexual misconduct he engaged in. And then that young man is immediately turned into the police. What sort of ministry will we have to other families in the church? What families would then ever feel comfortable coming and allowing us to shepherd them through circumstances that take place in their families? I can't imagine another family wanting to come to us. That's one side. The other side is, I can understand if that young man was not turned in, and then he later re-offended with someone else in the church, and then families in the church said, you knew what this young man had done to his sister, and you didn't turn him in. So do you see the situation we're trying to deal with here and navigate through and just how difficult it is? And that's why we cover your prayers. The second thing while I'm up here, as I'm seeing the, Responsibility the church is taking for the protection of children one consequence negative one is parents perhaps feeling someone alleviated of their own responsibility to their children and So we want to be very diligent regarding protecting your children, but and I say this as a father of eight They are your children or they are my children whatever lengths we can take as a church is Your children are best protected by you. And so we all need to be aware of them and watching them. I watched a video, it was very alarming, of children being kidnapped and how quickly it took place. And many of the kidnappings took place in very public places like stores where there are video cameras, where there is security. It's shocking how quickly someone can pull up in a car, snatch a kid, and drive off before anyone notices anything. And that can happen right out there on the sidewalk. And so we all, and it was, you can decide whether you want to show those videos to your children to sober them up, because I know my children live in this nice little safe world where there's no bad people. And so we just want to make sure that no matter what steps the church has taken, we're all feeling very responsible for the safety and protection of our kids. So, as far as mandatory reporting goes, according to the RCW, which is the revised code of Washington, mandatory reporters do not have to In your example of a boy coming in and saying what he's done to his sister, if it is privileged communication, which is when we go to you for counseling to the pastors, it does not fall under mandatory reporting. So you have a little bit of leeway. If that same boy went to three or four people, that's where the mandatory reporting starts coming in. But as far as If you're going for counseling, it is not a mandatory immediate report. That's why pastors and counselors are given an exemption, essentially, under the mandatory reporting laws, because there has to be that ability to counsel people. I mean, if somebody comes in and the first thing he tells you is he has three dead bodies in the trunk, it's time to mandatory report. But if it's some of these other things, there is leeway built into the law for that. And this is why, when you ask lawyers and cops, what would you do in this exact circumstance, they always say, maybe. Yeah, Jim. So the question is the church directory, which is now, I believe, on Facebook. it's only in private groups that are moderated. The other people need to request access to join those groups and when people leave the church, and this has caused frustration for people who have left the church and then wanted to remain in some of these groups, like let's say WCC women or WCC men, and I'm sharing this so that if you were to hear someone who was frustrated that they left the church and then were removed from one of those groups, you could share that there are reasons for the removal and one of them is that the groups are only available for people who Attend this church and so the directory would then only be available to people that we have allowed into that group Yes So yeah, currently the church directory is probably three to four years old at this point. And so Audrey's got more current, but that's not on, it's not been published yet. Okay. Yep. Yeah. So yeah, we'll definitely, um, Audrey will follow up on that. But yeah, as far as the, the question was about the directory being on a Google doc or something like that, but we'll follow up with that in a different, different setting. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. All right. Pastor Nathan, you want to. Thank you guys, all of you, for sticking around and for participating and asking the questions. Clearly, we need lots of prayer. We need prayer and we need lots of wisdom from God as we move forward, keeping the focus of protecting our children, but also not losing sight of our calling as Christians while we're here. So with that, we'll close with a word of prayer. Heavenly Father, thank you for the time spent together, and I pray that it be fruitful, beneficial for things learned that our church would feel better equipped knowing where we're going, why we're doing what we're doing. I pray for continued wisdom as well for us as leaders to be able to make the right decisions that would honor you and protect our children, but also to honor you in reflecting upon your name. We ask these things in Jesus' name. Amen.