DisplacedMaritimer (Bert) wrote: #2 Yes, I agree. We are saved by grace and we are required to have faith in Jesus plus perform good works.
DM Isn't there a little bit more to the RCC doctrine on this...
The RCC states that Christ made an atonement for sin, meriting the grace by which a person is justified, BUT - that the work of Christ is NOT the exclusive cause of an individualâ€™s justification and salvation
Also In accordance with RCC doctrine. Christ did NOT accomplish the finished and completed salvation in his work of atonement. His death on the cross did NOT deal with the full penalty of man's sin. All it merited was grace for man, - which is then channeled to the individual through the Roman Catholic CHURCH and its sacraments. This grace then enables man to do works to merit justification.
Thus DM; The question we have for you is; Can you say that justification is of Christ ALONE, and the RC Church and your works play no part in it whatsoever?
DisplacedMaritimer wrote: You should really consider the word "worship" more closely. If I worship something, I am not necessarily treating that something as a deity. To worship someone/something is to show that someone/something respect, nothing more. I am a Catholic and I happen to believe that the Shroud of Turin is authentic. That does [i]not[/i] make me an idol worshiper
"Maritimer" I've just found out what that means. Being an old "mariner" myself, I had thought you were heading in that/my old direction. But I see you mean that you have been removed from your old Province. Welcome to these "shores" nonetheless.
I see you are from the RCC. I am a Presbyterian Calvinist, from the Protestant church, which you'll remember from history, emerged when GOD brought about HIS Reformation, and removed HIS disciples from the heretical dogma of Rome.
But here you are asking GOD again to share your "worship" of whatever ilk, with old bones bits of cloth and other sad relics. Common sense should tell you otherwise. But the Bible has sufficient statements which teach you that graven images are really idolatry and iconolatry.
What you really need to do is displace yourself from the old bones and bits of cloth, and come to the REAL Church.
"Despite a new oversight panel, a new special inspector general, the existing Government Accountability Office and eight other inspectors general, those charged with minding the store say they don't have all the weapons they need"
Ha Ha Ha
Bureaucracy is an epidemic disease and spreads across local and national government like wildfire. Obama being a Liberal will love lots and lots of spread, to making the same decisions a thousand different times. The end result will be lost in all the confusion of epidemic departments.
"Habito, who calls himself a Zen Catholic, is one of the experts who say the search is a little like Dorothy and her ruby slippers. The quest for meaning ultimately leads some, like Dorothy, to their own backyards."
When your religious philosophy includes The Wizard of Oz and the yellow brick road - then you have really lost the plot.
And this little quote; "For many Christians cut off from the past, or alienated from the faith of their upbringing, Buddhism has served as the bridge to ancient wisdom." - has to be the stupidest statement of all.
These would be "Christians" who are NO MORE Christian than a plastic duck.
But there is a precedent here - the Archbishop of Canterbury became a druid just after his inauguration. But thats Anglicalism for you - NOT Christianity.
rob wrote: Chris makes a good point about the shroud & Jesus print, BUT, what if he was wrapped in it as he was taken from the cross & then the women added the head wrap at the tomb. I am not a shroud worshipper but i have often wondered if God would allow 21 cent men an aid to their fiath by showing the shroud or parts of Noah's ark, to help some modern people look toward the cross. I guess u will smash me but God has used things like the bronze serpent, etc in the past to build a bridge to the truth of Christ as Creator, Savior & Lord.
Scripture and the Holy Spirit are the only means by which God reveals Christ.
The RCC "worships" these foolish ancient relics and demonstrates itself to be idolatrous.
2Cor 6:16 "And what agreement hath the temple of God with idols? for ye are the temple of the living God; as God hath said, I will dwell in them, and walk in them; and I will be their God, and they shall be my people."
1John 5:21 "Little children, keep yourselves from idols. Amen."
Jer 7:16 Therefore pray not thou for this people, neither lift up cry nor prayer for them, neither make intercession to me: for I will not hear thee."
Jer 14:11 Then said the LORD unto me, Pray not for this people for their good."
Question. If, as here, the Lord would not listen to His Prophet Jeremiah, will He listen to Obama? If any sinner assumes that God will automatically listen to their prayers, then they do not know God. Only God may "grant" prayer!
"a robed "priest" used a hairdryer marked "reason" in an apparent bid to blow away the waters of baptism once and for all. Several dozen participants then fed on a "de-sacrament" (crackers with peanut butter)"
Is this a comedy sketch script?
I think this has to be one of the stupidest things I've ever heard. Or perhaps "deluded".... 2Thes 2:11 And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie
Max wrote: As for Anglicans and government money, a day doesn't pass in London without seeing a CofE church being renovated with a huge sign saying Lottery Heritage Fund on the hoardings. Even Canterbury Cathedral and St Paul's got that gambling money and they still have a cheek to charge admission! http://www.channel4.com/programmes/dispatches/4od#2918356
Nice one Max.
I guess the Devil pays for his own religious houses, so the Anglicans and the Muslims are on the same income source! Why is the C.of E. complaining?
Religion. "c.1200, "state of life bound by monastic vows," also "conduct indicating a belief in a divine power," from Anglo-Fr. religiun (11c.), from O.Fr. religion "religious community," from L. religionem (nom. religio) "respect for what is sacred, reverence for the gods," in L.L. "monastic life" (5c.); according to Cicero, derived from relegare "go through again, read again," from re- "again" + legere "read" (see lecture). However, popular etymology among the later ancients (and many modern writers) connects it with religare "to bind fast" (see rely), via notion of "place an obligation on," or "bond between humans and gods." Another possible origin is religiens "careful," opposite of negligens. Meaning "particular system of faith" is recorded from c.1300.
Modern sense of "recognition of, obedience to, and worship of a higher, unseen power" is from 1535. Religious is first recorded c.1225. Transfered sense of "scrupulous, exact" is recorded from 1599." (Etymology Dic)
Nope! Logically I can't imagine it. There is too much history involved.
"The neighbourhood beat manager, who has been an officer for the past seven years, is a heathen which means he worships Norse gods, including the hammer-wielding Thor, the one-eyed Odin and Freyr, the god of fertility."
The UK is going backwards into old delusions, fables and mythology.
A nation without God becomes satanic, blind, ignorant and foolish! Prov 1:7 The fear of the LORD is the beginning of knowledge: but fools despise wisdom and instruction"
Psalm 59:8 But thou, O LORD, shalt laugh at them; thou shalt have all the heathen in derision."
2Tim 4:3 For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears; 4 And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables.
Since the NEA represents public school teachers and other support personnel, faculty and staffers at colleges and universities, retired educators, and college students preparing to become teachers. It is no real surprise that they are behind the homosexual agenda. Really this reflects the nations indifference through ignorance of what is happening in western society today. Satan has scattered the sodomite seed very widely and it has taken over where the Bible has become irrelevant such as in the bureaucracy of the nations. Spiritual bankruptcy and moral decline is obvious in churches, therefore are we shocked that secular society is morally corrupt. Of course not. Come Lord Jesus, come soon. Amen!