The Bible says that in the latter days people will not listen to sound teaching. This is why you left the RCC. Jesus commands his "True" Church: "Whose sins you shall FORGIVE, they are FORGIVEN, whose sins you shall RETAIN (not forgive), they are RETAINED (not forgiven). Don't give me this drivel about Catholicism not being Biblical. It is! You and your "confused" buddies are just incapable of understanding what you read!
Sorry folks, my post follows Jim's. Jim's post is the noise, not the scandal. But, try not to be too gleeful about the Law suits. Who knows, in a few years the shoe may be on the other "Protestant" foot...so to speak!
I believe: 1. This Scandal is a 'Black Mark' against the Catholic faith and each Catholic is tainted by the evil of it. 2. All Catholic's are required to watch for any such shameful activity and report the offenders, regardless of who they are, to the Authorities. 3. This Scandal is tragedy and was avoidable. 4. The Heirarchy is totally at fault. 5. Any priest/nun that is accused of child abuse (sexual or physical) is to be relieved of duty, and tried in a court of Law. 6. When and if they are found guilty they are to be jailed. 7. The names of those involved, including the Clergy, should not be revealed to the press until after the trial. 8. Only those found guilty can be identified in the media. 9. Any Archbishop or Bishop who is found responsible for 'knowingly' shipping the offender off to another parish, where the offender's background is not known, is also liable to the Courts. 10. The Catholic Seminaries should change the method used for screening prospective priests and nuns. 11. The discipline of 'Celebracy' does not cause pedaphilia, a perverted conscience does. Eliminate all such men from the priesthood. 12. Many Protestants are using this pestilence to advance their unholy War against the Church. Some of you have said as much...JUNE!!!
ATITF: You may be correct. But what of my statement, what if it's entirely correct? What if this scandal is evil, and tragic, but not 'endemic' of the entire Catholic Church? Wouldn't you say that accusing the majority of priests and nuns of perversion and sadism, when these people give their lives to their people and their Saviour, I say, wouldn't you term that as callous, insensitive, and unjust? My post merely makes the point that some priests and nuns ARE worthy of correction and incarceration, but the greater number of Catholic clergy are good and decent Christians. I refuse to be silent when bigotry disguises itself to accuse honest men and women, when this is really about the religious wars between the Denominations. Also, please don't threaten me.
June: The investigation continues; can you say "innocent till proven guilty"? Even a person like yourself, who is "fairness challenged" can understand that only a relatively small number of perpetrators are responsible for this. That priests sent to counseling may not be cured by the therapy, and silence not only protects the guilty, but the innocent families and innocent priests too. However, those who are truly guilty must be jailed and those who truly covered up their crime as well. But only a senseless 19th century "Know Nothing" throw-back of perverse bigotry would claim the Pope is guilty when clearly there is no proof that he is involved.
A noted Apostate once remaked, "apostasy...centers in externals. The style of music, the style of worship..."
Hmmm, how wise. Who knew that apostacy centered on the exterior of faith and not the heart.
Stringfellow: There are not two camps of Catholicism, neither are there two camps of Christianity. Just those who belong to the Church that Christ founded (The RCC) and those who found a less likely path.
According to the lastest report from Ireland on the current scandal, there are about 2000 alleged victims over a period of 60 years. That works out to about 33 people per year. That many people get mugged in New York city in a week.
ATITF: Thanks for the concern, but I am unable to contribute much in the way of money, so I also give my time. My parish Church still needs to pay it's office people, it still needs to pay for electricity, water and to hold classes for religious ed. I doubt there is much left over to pay off victims of sex abuse. Especially since neither my Church nor my Diocese of Galvestion-Houston has seen much in the way of abuse. Nationally, less than 4% of priests have been accused of abuse over a period of 60 years, and not all of those are guilty.
Those Catholic clergy who are legally and truthfully found to be guilty should be defrocked, and jailed. Any Bishop (including the Pope) should be held accountable for any documented attempt to hide evidence, or to transfer known abusers who have demonstrated that they are not cured of their sexual dysfunction. Under no circumstances should this scandal be utilized by unconscienced and unprincipled members of the non-catholic world to harrass or destroy the Catholic faith or the reputations of faithful Catholic clergy, especially the Pope in Rome. To do so is unjust and you will answer for it just as the pedophiles will answer for their many grevious sins. Now, you also have been warned.
Well folks, the good news from my point of view is that it's not as bad as y'all insist that it is. You say, "that the entire Catholic Church is bad". I say, "Some of it is bad, but not all, not everybody". God in his good time will kull the bad guys out from the good. What is called for is patience and to refrain from painting the innocent as dark as the guilty. Surely they teach waiting to pull the good shoots up with the weeds until Harvest time...even in Protestantism? In the mean while, ask yourself this question: "Are your sins any less worthly of judgement?" Then perhaps you should do as Jesus suggests and "Judge not!"
BB: Your link is excellent proof for anyone acustomed to rules of Law from 2-bit dictators and Kangaroo courts. Your "clear pattern" is not clear to people who require real proof and not 500 years of hatred and revenge. There are problems that need to be solved. But what you offer is a later day Prot "Inquistion". The Old Days of "Father knows best" are dead. The Catholic Laity will not take any foolishness from its clergy and any infraction will bring the 'House down', not to mention the cops, on any priest who gets randy with someones child. You can help by dropping the self-righteous 'tude.
This is NOT how the Catholic Church behaves world-wide. Most Catholic clergy are fine Christians and upstanding folk. In any organization of people there are a minority of imposters and criminals that have to be found out and removed. EVEN IN PROTESTANT CHURCHES. There is no actual proof that BXVI, JPII, JPI, PaulVI, or JohnXXIII had anything to do with this disgusting infection of the Church body, except where you are willing to manufacture it with lies for your own evil purposes. Good men and women and good Govt will find the guilty and punish them in good time. God will have the final say. To trot thru a motley crew of ex-priests and ex-monks with 'God only knows what' grievences against the Church is indicative of 'Kangaroo Courts' of the Banana Republics; or Protestant websites. You can barely restrain your glee at this shame. This says much about your moral deficiencies and your bigotry. "Let he who is without sin cast the first stone" and may the guilty be judged and the innocent go free. You would do well to learn humility and to examine your own clergy for similar crimes.
Well Jim, I think I heard somewhere that Mormons are people and the men put their pants on, one leg at a time. Other than that, I have more in common with your bunch of wing-wangs than I do the Mormons. Unless you are refering to the persecution that Mormons and Catholics must tolerate in this most Protestant of countries.
Guiness: Sorry, but I'm not following you. Many good Catholics do believe that "Ex ecclesiam nulla salus" means that anyone outside the RCC is doomed to Hell. This is NOT Catholic teaching. The real story is more complex. We can think of at least two kinds of unbelievers, those who are raised by their belief system to hold a contrary belief and those who with militant intent and with FULL UNDERSTANDING of all the nuances of the Catholic sytem, who still insist on rejection of Catholic teaching. Most Protestants are of the former group. These folk are not the target of the Doctrine of "Ex Ecclesiam...". The latter more militant and blatently anti-catholic group are the target. In other words Luther, Knox, Calvin have more to fear because they understood the truth and rejected it, while millions who came after them are not really aware of the differences and are not doomed to Hell.
"Killer" Obama will certainly be welcomed by those CINO's (Catholics in name only). True Catholics will hold him responsible for his actions and his sin against the unborn. May the Lord show more mercy to America than she has shown her children. Over 50 million dead...and the blood still flows.