A month or so ago we had a prolonged disussion about whether there was any scriptural proof that The Rich Young Ruler finally came to Christ. I believe that I have the answer but it will not fit into 1200 words. If anyone would like the evidence just email me at firstname.lastname@example.org and I will reply with my scrpture proofs.
Mike wrote: Now now, rogerant, you know quite well there are Reformed here who post under various alias's. Must be there is a difference between the light of Reformed pots and the darkness of "Arminian" kettles.
Dear Mike: As usual you have read my message out of context. It was directed to "Arminians who under dark alias's who claim to be real Calvinists and then missrepresent Calvin's teaching" An example of such would be CU.
It was not a braodbased attack upon all of our Arminian bretheran.
Calvinism and Evangelism wrote: Spoken like one who is not a true Calvinist. We have already seen on these forums how bogus your claim is to being a Calvinist.
Perhaps you can post some of DJC49's posts that would prove his claim as adhering to Reformed teaching to be bogus.
And perhaps you can post some scripture and quotes from Calvin that would support your view (cough)that evangelism is not important.
And tell me why, you Arminians who claim to be "in the light" sneak around in the dark, under dark alias's pretending to be someone you are not, in order to ridicule those who are not of your ilk? There is always a element of dishonest darkness in your modus operandi.
"If we say that we have fellowship with Him, and walk in the darkness, we lie and do not the truth; But if we walk in the light, we have fellowship on with another" 1 John 6:6
2 Cor 5:17 Therefore, if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation; old things have passed away; behold, all things have become new. Now all things ARE OF GOD, who has reconciled US TO Himself through Jesus Christ, and has given us the ministry of reconciliation, that is, that God was in Christ reconciling the world to Himself, not imputing their trespasses to them, and has committed to us the word of reconciliation.
To be reconciled to God IS TO BE SAVED! Christ has reconciled US to HIMSELF. He has removed the barriers between US and God, NOT IMPUTING THEIR TRESPASSES to US.
The rest world are having their trespasses imputed to them. If God has reconciled everyone to Himself, He has saved everyone. He has not only removed His anger towards the elect and placed it upon His Son, He has also removed our anger towards HIM! He has removed our shame. All things are of HIM!
Really wrote: Really? The apostle says the word of reconciliation was committed to him, which we know in the great commission was to be preached to every creature. So what did he preach to every creature? Let's see shall we? "Through his name whosoever believeth in his name shall receive remission of sins" Act 10:43 "Be it known unto you.. through this man is preached unto you the forgiveness of sins, and by him all that believe are justified.." Acts 13:38 "Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house" Acts 16:31 "And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent" Acts 17:30 Now how do you suppose the apostle could declare these words of reconciliation indiscriminately to so many if he had no certainty that the words of reconciliation applied to them? Do you suppose he had special knowledge as the Hyper-Calvs declare?
And if He has reconciled everyone to Himself as the HYPER Arminians declare, then everyone must be saved, including Pharoah!
DJC49 wrote: *Mike* | New York -- Do you deny that penal substitution is the very essense and heart of the Atonement? The very PURPOSE of Christ's death? Bonus Question: Did Christ taste death for Pharoah, Goliath, and Judas?
And if He died for them, then how can they come under judgement? For:
"And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgement. So Christ was once offered to bear the sins of many; and unto THEM that look for him shall he appear the second time without sin unto salvation." Heb 9:27
Therefore, if He died for Pharoah, how can Pharoah come unto judgement?
theologicallythin wrote: http://www.freepres.org/daily.asp BTW it is outsidethecamp who should be in the hall of shame http://www.outsidethecamp.org/heterodoxyhall.htm
Yes, If all these saints are heretics, who can be saved?
If they are outside of the camp, then so is the Lord. I will go meet Him outside the camp with Moses.
Exodus 33:7 Moses took his tent and pitched it outside the camp, far from the camp, and called it the tabernacle of meeting. And it came to pass that everyone who sought the Lord went out to the tabernacle of meeting which was outside the camp.
John 10:1 "Most assuredly, I say to you, he who does not enter the sheepfold by the door, but climbs up some other way, the same is a thief and a robber. But he who enters by the door is the shepherd of the sheep. To him the doorkeeper opens, and the sheep hear his voice; and he calls his own sheep by name and leads them OUT.
If Christ on His cross intended to save every man, then He intended to save those who were lost before he died. If the doctrine be true, that He died for all men, then He died for some who were in hell before He came into this world, for doubtless there were even then myriads there who had been cast away because of their sins. Once again, if it was Christ's intention to save all men, how deplorably has He been disappointed, for we have His own testimony that there is a lake which burneth with fire and brimstone, and into that pit of woe have been cast some of the very person who, according to the theory of universal redemption, were bought with His blood. That seems to me a conception a thousand times more repulsive than any of those consequences which are said to be associated with the calvinistic and Christian doctrine of special and particular redemption. To think that my Saviour died for men who were or are in hell, seems a supposition too horrible for me to entertain. To imagine for a moment that He was the substitute for all the sons of men, and that God, having first punished the Substitute, afterwards punished the sinners themselves, seems to conflict with all my ideas of Divine justice.
John UK wrote: You've all got big enough mouths, haven't you? Well, BELLOW it out, and I will listen. I will have a look in later on...
A Extreme Hyper Calvinist on LIMITED ATONEMENT.
"Now, beloved, when you hear any one laughing or jeering at a limited atonement, you may tell him this. General atonement is like a great wide bridge with only half an arch; it does not go across the stream: it only professes to go half way; it does not secure the salvation of anybody. Now, I had rather put my foot upon a bridge as narrow as Hungerford, which went all the way across, than on a bridge that was as wide as the world, if it did not go all the way across the stream."
Without blasphemy it is not possible to conceive that Christ has failed in his purpose. "It is quite certain, that the death of Christ must have been effectual for the removal of those sins which were laid upon him." We cannot conceive that Christ has died in vain. "He was appointed of God to bear the sin of many," and it is "not possible that he should be defeated or disappointed of his purpose. Not in one jot or tittle will the intent of Christ's death be frustrated. Jesus shall see of the travail of his soul and be satisfied.
John UK wrote: Charles UK If, as you say, you've only been a believer for two years, then all that gobbledygook from Joe T the extreme calvinist will not benefit you at all, but muddle your mind with unnecessary theological and mind boggling phrases.
"MUDDLE YOUR MIND WITH UNNECESSARY THEOLOGICAL AND MIND BOGGLING PHASES
If there is anyone here with a muddled theology John, it would be you. YOu are more inconsistent than anyone else on this board.
PS: ALIAS DOUBLE AGENT ALERT
HONESTY/demanded has picked up the attack machine against DJC49 where Bible Alone and Calvinist Understanding left off.
Forget about fingerprint evidence. We have DNA samples!
If we say that we have fellowhip with Him, and walk in darkness, we lie, and do not the truth. But if we walk in the light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus Christ cleanseth us from all sin 1 John 1:5
charles m wrote: Thanks michael tho i take it brother that you wouldnt describe yourself as a 'calvinist' ? i find that tho i do believe that a sovreign God would indeed avenge Himself upon His enemies which would be the entire human race were it not for the mystery of election i feel i have to be consistent with the treatment of the term 'world' and the idea odf the debt of sion is my way of doing this but how correct is this ? is there some theological error here ?
But can you use the word "world" consistently in the same manner every time. I recommend that everyone here watch this three part series on the word "world" in John 3:16 here.
Honesty wrote: Nice try 7xseven, but you have evaded the words of the text. It is not written denying the Lord that bought "YOU". It specifically states, denying the Lord that bought "THEM". The rest of your post presupposes your system and conjectures about the justice of God.
Before you continue to use that verse out of context, I recommend that you listen to this excellent sermon on the topic.
Don Fortners Universal Redemption 01-What About This Verse? 2 Peter 1:20
A.W.Tozer wrote: "God will not hold us responsible to understand the mysteries of election, predestination, and the divine sovereignty. The best and safest way to deal with these truths is to raise our eyes to God and in deepest reverence say, 'O Lord, thou knowest'. Those things belong to the deep and mysterious profound of God's omniscience. Prying into them may make theologians, but it will never make saints'. From 'The Pursuit of God'
And thus why the Alliance Church today has gone to a works righteousness ethical message rather than a proclamation of law and gospel and a the proper focus on the atonement.
pew view wrote: Mike. Touch`e Now that you've got this far - Go to a good Calvinist Church and hear the Word preached.
Even as a Calvinist myself pew view, I wish it was just as easy as going to a Reformed Church and hear the Word preached. But finding a GOOD Calvinist church is few and far between around here.
And that is why a blanket condemnation of any one type of church or doctrine that realtes to "Which issue do you think most confronts the Church of today doen't really work. When a Reformed church falls away from sound preaching, it becomes either liberal or hyper. In either case, it becomes works based. Equivalent to the semi pelagian decisional regenation preaching of the dispensensational evangelical Baptist churches in the U.S. today.
Bible only wrote: I have you PEGGED! Your Rogerant alias nearly had me fooled! You parade around SA as DJC49, pagan understanding, Rogerant, pew view, RR, FTGOG and ? and post to yourself So much for your disingenous claim that you were not identifying me with C.U! The cat is out of the bag now, eh liar?!
No, wrong. Just to set some obvious facts straight that proves that DJC and myself are not the same person.
DJC and myself do not try to hide our identities. We do not have a problem with being exposed by the light. We do not have to hide ourselves by darkness. Both of our monikers identify our email addresses. One of my addresses is managed by our Crown run servers (sasktel.net) that is only available in my home province. My other address is on our company intranet that is located in Calgary Alberta (graham.CA) CA is localized in Canada. DJC lives in FLORIDA! If that isn't sufficient, I can send you email pictures of myself fishing in my ice shack (it is currently -34 C here right now) I doubt if DJC would be able to produce such a picture.
Other pertinent info I can share. The only other alias's I have ever used are: Pagan Understanding, Guess Who and Someone Else from Somewhere Else.