Historical writing of men overcoming sin, gaining repentance, and revivals are helpful, a 'how to overcome this and that' book is not necessary. When I say 'we do need help,' I am not implying some self help book.

I am saying we do need help from above, and this help is often dispensed through the Christian community, and even at times through SOUND authors within that community.

There are a number of authors that I have found helpful and insightful that have been used of God to open my eyes to various scriptural truths.

E.M. Bounds, Watchman Nee, Andrew Murray, John Bunyan, Leonard Ravenhill, Deitrich Bonhoeffer, and so on have proven helpful to me.

You speak of a cottage industry on porn, and you are right in that observation. I will take it a step further in saying that if 'christendom' truely walked in the slightest victory there would much less publishing altogether, and the Family Christian Store, or Lifeway would be virtually empty.

The 'Christian' bookstore is the saddest place on earth. There are more self help books in these stores than any secular bookstore. People who are professedly indwelt with the Holy Spirit, who literally have the Lord living in them are in more need of self help than the rest of the world??? Nonsense, no wonder the world looks on and laughs.

If you are saved from birth to about 3 years old or so can you lose that salvation at the age of accountabilty? Hmmm.... doesn't sound like once saved always saved.

The 'say a prayer' salvation just amounts to another ritual or work. Preachers will get people all emotional so that they say a little prayer, and then they have some false assurance that they are His. They go on pretending like they have a relationship with Him and if they question their own standing the preacher just reminds them that they prayed the prayer so they have nothing to worry about.

Catholicsm is nonsense, but so is this cheap grace evangelicalism that is so rampant in america today.

Simply as a third party observer at this point I will say that Albert has looked foolish over the course of this discussion, and has been taken to the cleaners by the proponents of tounge speaking.

The only perceived edge he has is when he asks them to produce testimony and they do not. Even that is fallacy, scripture is what is being discussed, personal testimony is outside the realm of this discussion.

Option A: It is a Strong Gospel presentation
Option B,C,D,E: CS Lewis was dead wrong and everything about him and his movie is wrong.

Maybe it was a weak gospel presentation. Maybe it was just a fiction movie. Put some available answers that could lead to real dialogue.

However if we claim entire sanctification is POSSIBLE and say we are without sin, then we lie. The claim to be without sin is also antichrist.

The survey I posted itself may be entirely flawed because sanctified is not defined in the question.

If 'sanctified' means living in sinless perfection then entire sanctification is only approachable, or a direction in which the believer WILL move for their entire duration on earth, else he or she does not believe. When you drive down a highway you must make minor adjustments in steering or else you will be off the road. So it is in the Christian life. A true believer will make those adjustments, it is a continual state of repentance.

If 'sanctified' means being sinless and perfect before God, then all believers must be entirely sanctified to enter into the prescense of God. This entire sanctification occured at one moment 2000 years ago.

Maybe our discussion is too intellectual to be of any real value, I do not think so yet, but we may be heading in that direction.

The frustration I still have is that we ('american christendom') go to the opposite extreme of 'entire sanctification' and downplay sin as if it is just a part of our nature that we must deal with. That is nonsense. If you are Christian supernatural rebirth has occured, you loath sin, it breaks you into a million peices. We talk really strong about sin to the unconverted, and then speak lightly on it to those whom we believe to be saved.

One thing I can appericiate about the Wesleyans is that they are at least willing to preach holiness (at least in the past they have been).

I am simply seeking truth on this. I have been supernaturally reborn, and yet I still sin, yet sin is no longer my nature, and my lifestyle is no longer that of utter sinfulness. I would love to believe that entire sanctification is possible, and I would even more love to have God accomplish that in me. To no longer sin, what a thought. To be perfect, I long for that. I do have trouble discerning what the WHOLE of scripture teaches on this.