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Breaking News Home | All | Religion | Society | Tech | Choice | SA News
FRONT PAGE  |  12/1/2015
Choice News MONDAY, MAY 16, 2005  |  189 comments
Billy Graham still preaches the Gospel of inclusion

Billy Graham

MONTREAT, N.C. — Every morning the world’s most famous evangelist walks slowly and carefully up the narrow road twisting behind his log cabin. He sits on an iron bench, set in a clearing amid the pines where a tiny stream plunges down the ridge to form an icy pool far below.

Here, Billy Graham, 86 and every day more frail, prays, “Help me, Lord.” Here, he practices his voice, a habit of 40 years, “like an opera singer does the scales. Yes. Yes. Yes. No. No. No.”

He’s warming up for his 417th crusade — three nights of Christian testimony and music in New York, culminating in his inimitable call to come forward to God. The event in late June will be his first appearance in the city since he packed Central Park in 1991.

Today, as many fundamentalists and “traditionalists” refuse to share podiums with people who don’t share their vision of salvation, Graham opens his events to people of every ...

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COMMENTS  locked  
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Page 1 | Page 8 ·  Found: 189 user comment(s)
News Item5/22/05 1:10 AM
Ed from the South  
Neil, are you saying that Jesus was not inspired by the Holy Spirit to know the mind and perceptions of those in His days of ministry? Or have you never read these things (Matt.16:7-8; 22:18;Mark 2:8; Luke 2:22) (Matt.21:45; Acts 4:13; Galatians 2:9; Heb.5:14; 1 Corinthians 2:14; 12:8-10). Now if you don't believe that the Holy Spirit reveals other people's thoughts and motives, then we have discovered the problem with you. And if He doesn't reveal these things, then how on earth are you sitting back with judgmental thoughts about Preacher Graham. Remember, you said that the Holy Spirit doesn't let a person in on such knowledge to make such judgments.

My brother, instead of getting mad and into your flesh, why don't you spend some time reading the above verses and then come back and holla at me, if ya know what I mean. I'll patiently wait.


News Item5/22/05 12:58 AM
Neil | Tucson  
Ed, you read my posts to others, so I did the same here. I was trying to understand your way of thinking.

I don't think rational discussion is possible with someone who claims the Holy Spirit tells him other people's thoughts.


News Item5/22/05 12:52 AM
Ed from the South  
Neil, I thank you for reading my earlier posts. Now as far as it being in my head - what are you saying? You are a little jet-lagged in your statement. No, those who spend true time with God don't have to read minds, because the Holy Spirit does it for them. Don't you believe in spiritual discernment? After all, the statement was not to you personally but to the one I addressed it to, though you are privy to reading and commenting on it. Not only that, but I have given you enough to be inquiring about than for you to jump into that message. Don't you think?

News Item5/22/05 12:42 AM
Neil | Tucson  
Ed, reading your other posts, you said,
"Now I know that you did not come right out and say this. But you have it in your head, and God knows it."

Are you a mind-reader?


News Item5/22/05 12:40 AM
Ed from the South  
Neil, even if you were correcting without proper clarity, why are you still masking the fact that you admit you have problems with Preacher Graham. I don't have to question your motives because you gave them to the world by stating your unrest with the man. As far as stating whether I am proud or not, I don't have a problem in apologizing if it were necessary. Why should I apologize for what I said when it brought out the fact of what I was saying all along? One should never apologize for the truth, only against it. Now if you can spell for us all clearly your stand on the whole issue without hiding and beating around the bush, then maybe an apology would be in line for you from me. And I would be delighted to do so, but only after you make very clear your true stand, which you have only vaguely done thus far. Be a man and unveil what you are camoflauging so relentlessly, especially since God already knows your heart on the matter. And by the way, I addressed two of you, not just you. Why take it all for yourself? Let the other brother take some of the lashing. Believe me, I said enough to go around.

News Item5/22/05 12:31 AM
Neil | Tucson  
Ed, I was attempting to correct John Y on an earlier stmt. of his, yet you intrude and read that as a criticism of Graham!

You question my motives w/o adequate grounds. Are you too proud to admit you made a hasty accusation?


News Item5/22/05 12:31 AM
Ed from the South  
Dan, why do you try and dig up vocal transcripts of what you and some say Graham and Schuller said? Why don't you pray to God and then listen to what you say is heritic teaching? Or are you afraid that God might show you the true intents of their so-called words of heresay? Only darkness is afraid to face the Father of Light through prayer. Also, what if God were to place an address on the words that you've said in the past so that others could criticize and condemn you? Or better yet, what if He were to publically announce a websight address that would unveil some of the acts that you committed in the last 24 hours? Would you want others to judge you by all the things you've said and did? Well, at the rate that you are going with Preachers Graham and Schuller, your mess will eventually be unveiled, because just as you have done it to others, you will have the same done unto you (Galatians 6:7; Luke 6:31,37). Brother, it is terrible that you would judge others by twelve minutes of their lives and trump out the other 60 to 70 years. You are treading upon shaky ground. You need to check yourself before the devil has a hayday wrecking yourself, because you are giving him the lisense to do just that.

News Item5/22/05 12:26 AM
Dan | Tennessee  

Mat 7:21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
Mat 7:22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
Mat 7:23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.


News Item5/22/05 12:20 AM
Ed from the South  
Dan, Dan! Please. How can you believe that you are doing God a service by downright blasting one of His greatest workers to HELL. Now I know that you did not come right out and say this. But you have it in your head, and God knows it. Why must we condemn others to Hell in order that our message might prevail? Do you not understand that Jesus went to the lower parts of the earth, implying Hell, in order that people as Billy Graham and myself would not go, and especially not for eternity. When did you see Jesus say the things that you are saying? Sure, He corrected the Pharisees about their outright rejection of Him, but where is Preacher Graham doing this? Even Jesus said that no one who speaks good of Him can easily curse or deny Him. Jesus also said that we should leave such people alone (Mark 9:38-40). Jesus said that people such as yourself would feel as though they are doing God service by making others an outcast of their cultish beliefs and synogogues (John 16:1-3), which means that you are still in the Bible, brother. Also, if Jesus didn't preach an INCLUSIVE Gospel, then there is only one other gospel possibility, exclusive. So are you saying that the One who came to save the WORLD, and did, was preacing a so-called gospel of exclusion, such as yourself?

News Item5/22/05 12:19 AM
Dan | Tennessee  
Here is an example of what Chris M is talking about, y'all (I'm from the south, too).

Mat 19:23 Then said Jesus unto his disciples, Verily I say unto you, That a rich man shall hardly enter into the kingdom of heaven.
Mat 19:24 And again I say unto you, It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God.

And by the way, since it has gotten pushed to the previous page of comments, here is that URL for the sermonaudio page where you can listen to Schuller being interviewed followed by Schuller with Billy as they discuss their heresy openly. Just listen to the first 12 minutes to hear the narrow Way being turned into a multi-lane interstate highway.


News Item5/22/05 12:03 AM
Ed from the South  
Chris! Please cease from your state of ignorance. How can you believe that the time we are living in has no greater revelation concerning the Gospel and its truths than that of former times? Why did you not take my advice, or rather the instruction of the Word where it says that we should study to prove ourselves worthy to make rhetorical statements? If you know anything significant about the Bible, you would have to agree with what I am saying. Do you not know that the people who gave the accounts of Jesus in the Gospels were not the ones who wrote those accounts? At least not all of them. The writers were just that, writers of what was being passed on to them. Do you not know how those writings, which were orginally in Greek, came to be what we know today as the Bible? Well this Bible was surely not put together by the original eye witnesses of Jesus' Ministry. The men who put the Bible together were just that - men, who by the way had their own flaws as humans, even though God definitely used them inspite of. But their work of putting the Bible together was definitely not without flaws. Just look up Kingdom of God and Kingdom of Heaven in your dictionary, especially in the Holman Bible Dictionary. You'll be back to truly apologize. Don't let pride win you.

News Item5/22/05 12:02 AM
Dan | Tennessee  
Mat 7:15 Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.
Mat 7:16 Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles?
Mat 7:17 Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit.

The evil fruit of Billy Graham is the sending of those who come forward saying they have a Roman Catholic background back to the mother of harlots for follow-up instead of kindly warning them to shun that evil institution.


News Item5/22/05 12:02 AM
Dan | Tennessee  
It IS loving to warn someone that the life prolonging medicine they are receiving from their trusted doctor (which looks like the real thing) is actually a placebo. You have analyzed it and know this to be true. Even though they love this trusted doctor and 'know in their hearts' that he would never give them false medicine it would still be unloving if you kept silent in order to preserve the friendship. Though it might anger them, their blood is on your hands if you don't persist in warning them.

Mat 7:13 Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat:
Mat 7:14 Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.

We need to warn those who are listening to and believing this inclusive 'gospel' that Jesus is THE only way to eternal life. He is the straight gate and many (the majority) are NOT finding Him - are not going to find Him - and are eternally damned.


News Item5/21/05 11:42 PM
Chris M | Australia  
"there are alot of things the writers of the Gospel did not understand...."

Personally I would never think to claim a position of understanding the gospel more than the gospel writers themselves, but that is your matter of course. It is also apparent that you have created this imagined distinction in these kingdom expressions - which the gospel writers never made - only in order to support your antinomian position.


News Item5/21/05 11:35 PM
Ed of the South  
Mr. Neil:

Isn't it ironic that you do feel indifferent toward Billy Graham but you claim to not have said anything negative toward him in your earlier words? That's totally contradictory to the actual truth of your own quote:

"Yes, there may be saved people in false churches, but if they are "seeds on fertile ground," they won't remain long. And there are also unsaved persons in sound churches."

Although you did not mention Graham's name specifically, this is a continuous dialog on the subject of him, which is all about Billy Graham and his message -that many say does not jive with sound church doctrine. If this ongoing dialog were about some other subject, then maybe you could stand in the corner of innocence and state your claim to it. So, Neil, perhaps you need to check your own statements and motives out more clearly before defending that which you cannot. Or maybe you need to do a little better job at masking your true feelings about Preacher Graham, because it's obvious that you are indifferent toward him as I said and was able to pick up on. Spiritual discernment, along with good ol common sense and paying attention to detail makes a world of unveiling different when it comes to the unmasking of people's words and their subliminal messages. Doesn't it?


News Item5/21/05 9:51 PM
Neil | Tucson  
Ed, while I have problems with Billy G, I did not criticize him here.

Read my postings before taking me to task.


News Item5/21/05 9:23 PM
Ed | South  
What Is The Kingdom of God?
What did Jesus mean when he spoke of the kingdom of God? He meant, quite simply, the rule of God. The kingdom of God is the reign of God.
This is best understood if it is distinguished from what Jesus did not mean. He was not speaking of a geographical area such as the Holy Land or the Temple. He was not speaking of a political entity such as the nation of Israel or the Sanhedrin. He was not speaking of a group of people such as His disciples or the church.
Rather, the kingdom of God is God's ruling. It is the sovereign reign of God. This rule is independent of all geographical areas or political entities. It is true that the rule of God implies a people to be ruled, and Jesus called upon people to enter the kingdom. The kingdom itself should be distinguished from the people who enter it. ... So the kingdom of God was the rule of God which He extended over human lives through the ministry of Jesus; and it also is His rule which will be consummated or made complete in the future. (HOLMAN Bible Dictionary).

News Item5/21/05 8:59 PM
Ed Hardy  
Chris, there are alot of things the writers of the Gospel did not understand, and certainly not as we do today. And yes there are definite errors in man's manuscripting of the Bible, which is beyond our need to argue about, right? I assure you that if you were to again do your studies over in greater depths, you will discover this for yourself. Or is it that you're just talking from what you've heard and haphazardly read? Believe me, there is a distinct difference. Just think about it, if it is true that there is no distinction between the two then you must conclude that salvation of the WORLD is eternal, because whoever has the Kingdom of God in their heart also has the Kingdome of God in their eternal citizenship. Right? Which would mean that neither Billy, nor Catholics, nor anyone else who Christ has died for can go to hell eternally, which strengthens my argument even the more. Then the questions arise as to what comes first - Citizenship or The Heart? Or do the two come simultaneously? Or are the two the same in one as you say? If it is as you say, then you again make my argument even the more sure and correct. You choose, but of course not until you've done proper study. After all, the Word says that you are to study to show yourself approved.

News Item5/21/05 8:47 PM
Ed Hardy | South  
Mr. Neil & Mr. Jim:
Dear brothers, please hear yourselves. How can you see your brother Billy in so-called need and yet shut up your bowels of compassion? Do you not know that this is contrary to Scripture (1 John 3:17)? According to both your statements, he's in need of prayer, forgiveness, and most of all - LOVE, which is the true marking of a born-again EVANGELICAL. Right? Well, where are your markings? It's easier to disapprove of your lights when you have so much darkness illuminating from your words concerning your brother in the Lord. Why would you condemn who God is not condemning? Unless God has died and has left both of you in charge of the universe. If so, please let me know so that I can submit to your badgering of Billy.

To close, it is very possible for someone to be truly saved with the Truth, Christ, and yet remain in a state of ignorance, but yet have a sincere heart for truth. After all, both of you are proof of this. You're both saved, I hope, and yet both of you are spewing out depths of shere ignorance, thus degrading the wisdom of God. Isn't it awesome how God continues to use so-called unsaved people like Billy to do a greater work than saved people like the two of you? Now that's taking the foolish things to confound the wise.


News Item5/21/05 8:39 PM
Chris M | Australia  
"There is a distinct difference in the Kingdom of Heaven and the Kingdom of God."

Why didn't the Gospel writers understand this fact when they used these two terms interchangably I wonder?

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