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Leaders representing the Roman Catholic Church and some American Protestant denominations have signed an agreement in Texas to recognize each other's baptisms.
After about six years of dialogue, the United States Conference of Catholic Bishops, the Reformed Church in America, Presbyterian Church (U.S.A.), the Christian Reformed Church in North America, and the United Church of Christ signed a document recognizing each other's liturgical rites of baptism.
The five denominations signed the "Common Agreement on Mutual Recognition of Baptism," affirming the baptism agreement on Tuesday evening at a prayer service held at St. Mary's Cathedral in Austin....
Regardless of what these fellows say, they are at a minimum defending a false gospel instead of exposing it. Your comments are very good! I just wish I had your patience.
15] He that justifieth the wicked, and he that condemneth the just, even they both [are] abomination to the LORD. (Pro 17:15 KJV)
[44] Ye are of [your] father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it. (Jhn 8:44 KJV)
[6] I marvel that ye are so soon removed from him that called you into the grace of Christ unto another gospel: [7] Which is not another; but there be some that trouble you, and would pervert the gospel of Christ. [8] But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed. [9] As we said before, so say I now again, If any [man] preach any other gospel unto you than that ye have received, let him be accursed. (Gal 1:6-9 KJV)
SteveR wrote: Im quite surprised this vain attack on God's People continues. If you are truely saved, you should have no fear of what the RCC thinks of your status. Romans 8:1 There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit. Maybe some of you should study Scripture instead of pursuing this fleshy narcissistic excercise on who YOU think is worthy of being a real Christian and who is not. You have demonstrated that you dont know. And Mike, aside from his doctrinal mistakes and the flagrant idolatry hanging from his neck, please let that young man know 1 Corinthians 11:14 Doth not even nature itself teach you, that, if a man have long hair, it is a shame unto him?
John for Jesus 1 Timothy 6:12 Fight the good fight of faith, lay hold on eternal life, whereunto thou art also called, and hast professed a good profession before many witnesses.
SteveR Those newly saved and young/immature in their walk with the Lord indeed have all sorts of learning and growing to do.
That said, this young man's response to a sermon by Paris Reidhead is SIGNFICANTLY better than what a lot of Modern Baptists can say of their devotion to Christ.
SteveR wrote: If you are truely saved, you should have no fear of what the RCC thinks of your status.
Spot on Steve!
The antichrist church has no notion of what it means to be a Christian, vainly thinking that sprinkled water, attendance upon magic shows, confessing to a man called Father Blah Blah, praying to Mary etc. brings them salvation. So why should anyone listen to anything they say?
Maybe JFJ should not listen to anything they say either. Ah, but he just loves those antichrist devils. Can you not assist him out of the pit he's fallen into. I take it you believe it is right to help people who are deceived?
Im quite surprised this vain attack on God's People continues. If you are truely saved, you should have no fear of what the RCC thinks of your status.
Romans 8:1 There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.
Maybe some of you should study Scripture instead of pursuing this fleshy narcissistic excercise on who YOU think is worthy of being a real Christian and who is not. You have demonstrated that you dont know.
And Mike, aside from his doctrinal mistakes and the flagrant idolatry hanging from his neck, please let that young man know
1 Corinthians 11:14 Doth not even nature itself teach you, that, if a man have long hair, it is a shame unto him?
Michael Hranek wrote: Or find fellowship with Baptists who ought to be able to genuinely say things like this brief clip on YouTube: Why I'm a Christian
John for Jesus 1 Timothy 6:12 Fight the good fight of faith, lay hold on eternal life, whereunto thou art also called, and hast professed a good profession before many witnesses.
John for JESUS wrote: I guess what I am saying is I don't like to be labeled?
John for I read you attend a Baptist Church. It kind of breaks my heart to think you would be in a Mega Church and might never hear anything there like this brief clip:
by Paris Reidhead who is famous for his message: Ten Shekels and a Shirt downloaded some 53,340 times here on SermonAudio.
Or find fellowship with Baptists who ought to be able to genuinely say things like this brief clip on YouTube: Why I'm a Christian
AND being Baptist ought to know the difference between being a born again child of God and a Roman Catholic such as Richard Bennett makes clear in his salvtion testimony here on SermonAudio: From Catholicism to Christ
John for JESUS wrote: I am not defending or trying to attack the Catholic Church. I only believe it could have been a Christian church sometime prior to the Reformation and that it could be a Christian church now that holds to false beliefs.
John, it seems to me that you do not even understand what a Christian is. You imagine a corrupt organisation can teach false beliefs and produce believers?
Maybe you would care to produce your evidence that the RCC has at any point in its existence steered sinners to a justifying righteousness through faith alone in Christ alone by God's grace alone. Without this, you may be assured that it has always preached a salvation by works, which salvation does not exist.
Now if you don't want to be labelled a troll, stop acting like one. You have been given access to a good article on church history which, if you will take the time to read it, will surely put you straight on all the lies you have been fed by various Catholic sources.
I personally will have NO TRUCK with the RCC, who regard me anathema for my beliefs. If you are a Christian, they also regard you as damned to hell. And there is no gainsaying THAT!
Frank wrote: Your comment is far off that I will discontinue this discussion. A troll is someone who is provocative for the sake of being provocative. You may not be a Catholic troll, but a troll you are.
[AUTHOR]Frank[AUTHOR]I guess what I am saying is I don't like to be labeled?
SC wrote: A number of points: 1. Your moniker is provocative to say the least. Are you trying to say that you ONLY are for Jesus and everyone else posting here is not? If this is not the case, then it would be wise to change the moniker 3. The corruption of the churches from their primitive purity was gradual and so your quest for a specific date is a little simplistic, although there are some key events that accelerated the decline e.g. during the time of Constantine. 4. To insist as you wrongly do that there was one cohesive organised church from its inception known as the "Catholic" church is nonsense and anyone with even a little knowledge of church history would not make that mistake.
1. I don't see anything wrong with this name. It doesn't mean that you are not for Jesus. It's a way to declare that I want to live for Him. 2. Agreed 3. So are you saying it may have been Christian before you believe it became corrupted? 4. I believe historically it was the most prominent and biggest of church organizations for 1500 years. It was the largest of churches in Europe. I don't think it's crazy to believe Christians joined that church because they believed it was Christian. I've only read Esibius and some of The Ante Nicene Fathers.
John for JESUS wrote: I am not defending or trying to attack the Catholic Church. I only believe it could have been a Christian church sometime prior to the Reformation and that it could be a Christian church now that holds to false beliefs.
Your comment is far off that I will discontinue this discussion. A troll is someone who is provocative for the sake of being provocative. You may not be a Catholic troll, but a troll you are.
Frank wrote: I will take your word for it. But your Roman/Protestant thoughts are certainly wrong and I just pray that you will read carefully what others are saying to you. Paul said those that profess a false gospel should be accursed; not defended. So why you are defending RC is certainly confusing at best. They are Satan's church, pure and simple. Why, because they have and are confusing the most people and they have killed 10s of thousands of true believers.
I am not defending or trying to attack the Catholic Church. I only believe it could have been a Christian church sometime prior to the Reformation and that it could be a Christian church now that holds to false beliefs.
John for JESUS wrote: .. We could all probably know our church history better, but that doesn't mean we cannot talk about it. Thanks for the link to "The Pilgrim Church".
A number of points:
1. Your moniker is provocative to say the least. Are you trying to say that you ONLY are for Jesus and everyone else posting here is not? If this is not the case, then it would be wise to change the moniker.
2. There is nothing wrong with the term "Catholic", if used correctly. In Protestant usuage it just means "universal".
3. The corruption of the churches from their primitive purity was gradual and so your quest for a specific date is a little simplistic, although there are some key events that accelerated the decline e.g. during the time of Constantine.
4. To insist as you wrongly do that there was one cohesive organised church from its inception known as the "Catholic" church is nonsense and anyone with even a little knowledge of church history would not make that mistake.
John for JESUS wrote: I am not a Catholic, I do not believe in praying to the saints, purgatory, or maintaining salvation through good works. I am a member of Woodstock Baptist Church. There is an app in the App Store if you would like to check it out.
I will take your word for it. But your Roman/Protestant thoughts are certainly wrong and I just pray that you will read carefully what others are saying to you. Paul said those that profess a false gospel should be accursed; not defended. So why you are defending RC is certainly confusing at best. They are Satan's church, pure and simple. Why, because they have and are confusing the most people and they have killed 10s of thousands of true believers.
Frank wrote: I also think John for Jesus is a Catholic troll that can't admit it because that is what trolls do.
I am not a Catholic, I do not believe in praying to the saints, purgatory, or maintaining salvation through good works. I am a member of Woodstock Baptist Church. There is an app in the App Store if you would like to check it out.
Heh Michael; nice hearing from you. I think it is safe to say that you and I agree on these issues. I have often said there is absolutely nothing in RC that is doctrinally sound. When they use the same terms we use; they don't mean the same thing. They are the best cult at spinning things so most don't recognize what they are doing.
I also tend to agree with your thoughts about denominations and schools of theology (creeds). Although I don't object to others identifying themselves that way; I never do and that includes saying I am of the reformed movement. The only thing I might do is say that I am a fundamentalist; but I am even reluctant to do that since I don't agree with all aspects of fundamentalism as normally put forth. I guess what I am saying is I don't like to be labeled? I simply prefer to say I am a born again believer that has been saved by the grace of God for reasons that are known only to Him.
Frank I've encountered RC apologists as well and one of the things they do is point to a RC version of 'church history' to make the RCC seem credible.
But when all is said and done the RCC although it uses Biblical terms, it doesn't mean the same thing the context of Scripture means AND when anyone honestly examimes the god and the jesus of the RCC it is not the same as the Revelation that God gives of Himself and of Christ in Scripture AND the RC Mary is likewise quite different than the Mary of Scripture.
I have to think I am not telling you anything you don't already know, I am just mentioning it now as the issue of Truth goes far deeper and is far more important than the opinions men have about whatever denomination or school of theology they can in good conscience identify with.
Being convinced by Scripture and some understanding of the staggering sovereignty of God I hold to the belief that God has always had His remnant something Catholics and some Reformed have a hard time admitting because for Catholics it is like admitting they are wrong and for the Reformed that they have been wrong to bring along RC errors and teachings like infant baptism.
SC wrote: John for.. May I suggest that you study church history books before making dogmatic statements which are just plain wrong. One of the best books to read is E H Broadbent's "The Pilgrim Church". This is a thrilling read for anyone not familiar with church history. He does not go into great depth but makes a broad sweep. You can find an online version HERE I hope you will find this instructive and that it may lead you to read some of the other works cited.
I don't know that those statements were wrong. I only know I found new information that might better inform me. I don't remember you telling me when the first Catholic Church began or if the Catholic Church never held to Christian views then why we're there so many Christians that reformed from it. We could all probably know our church history better, but that doesn't mean we cannot talk about it. Thanks for the link to "The Pilgrim Church".
SC wrote: John for.. May I suggest that you study church history books before making dogmatic statements which are just plain wrong. One of the best books to read is E H Broadbent's "The Pilgrim Church". This is a thrilling read for anyone not familiar with church history. He does not go into great depth but makes a broad sweep. You can find an online version HERE I hope you will find this instructive and that it may lead you to read some of the other works cited.
Yes, thanks for the link; I will check it out also. John for Jesus' argument reminds me of the arguments presented by Catholic apologists, whom I have spent lots of time arguing with. If he is correct, then he would be saying that the RCC killed 10s of thousands of their own since no other church existed.
I also think John for Jesus is a Catholic troll that can't admit it because that is what trolls do.
John for JESUS wrote: JOHN UK... 1. Before the Reformation occurred all Christians outside of the eastern orthodox branch went to a Catholic church. 2. After the Reformation, a lot of Christians left the Catholic church and formed new churches. 3.So all those Christians who went to Reformed churches came out of the Catholic church, which was around for some 1500 years.
John, a right mishmash of disinformation.
1. Incorrect. 2. Why did they leave the Catholic church? 3. Incorrect.
The article (book) posted by SC is of great value, and will help you enormously. I also will be going through this, as it will help greatly my lack of knowledge of church history. Thanks to SC for posting the link!
John for JESUS wrote: JOHN UK...Before the Reformation occurred all Christians outside of the eastern orthodox branch went to a Catholic church. After the Reformation, a lot of Christians left the Catholic church and formed new churches. So all those Christians who went to Reformed churches came out of the Catholic church, which was around for some 1500 years.
John for..
May I suggest that you study church history books before making dogmatic statements which are just plain wrong.
One of the best books to read is E H Broadbent's "The Pilgrim Church". This is a thrilling read for anyone not familiar with church history. He does not go into great depth but makes a broad sweep.
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