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RELIGION, CURRENT EVENTS, TECHNOLOGY Subscribe to the breaking newsWhat is RSS?
FRONT PAGE  |  9/23/2014
FRIDAY, APR 12, 2013  |  345 comments
John 3:16 Conference addresses Calvinism

While stressing that the discussion between Calvinists and non-Calvinists in the Southern Baptist Convention is a family matter, speakers at the 2013 John 3:16 Conference outlined the differences between the two views and what they believe to be the issues hindering unity among Southern Baptists.

Frank Cox, pastor of North Metro Baptist Church in Lawrenceville, Ga., which hosted the conference on March 21-22, told attendees that the event would help them "engage in the conversation going on across the nation and the Southern Baptist Convention."

Jerry Vines, pastor emeritus of First Baptist Church in Jacksonville, Fla., opened the conference by saying it was not about anger or fighting anyone over these issues. ...


CLICK HERE to Read Entire Article
www.bpnews.net

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Page 1 | Page 3 ·  Found: 345 user comment(s)
News Item4/18/13 12:32 PM
jpw  Find all comments by jpw
David Preston wrote:
Be easy on the unbelieving Jews.
Attempt #3 (or is it #4, I've lost track)

Here, I'll make it easier for you. Pick a letter:

a: Jesus Christ is the suffering servant of Isaiah 53

b: we should follow your unbelieving Jewish teachers who tell us that Jesus Christ is not the Messiah of Isaiah 53 and that the Messiah hasn't come yet

305

News Item4/18/13 12:22 PM
John UK | Wales  Find all comments by John UK
David Preston wrote:
JPW- you don't get my point. Tulip is not found anywhere Pre Calvary. It doesn't come on view until Augustine. Be easy on the unbelieving Jews. They were the keepers of the Old Testament Hebrew bibles that we all benefit from.
JohnUK and US- this verse should help you in regards to being born again and the Holy Ghost.
John 7 37 In the last day, that great [day] of the feast, Jesus stood and cried, saying, If any man thirst, let him come unto me, and drink.
38 He that believeth on me, as the scripture hath said, out of his belly shall flow rivers of living water.
39 (But this spake he of the Spirit, which they that believe on him should receive: for the Holy Ghost was not yet [given]; because that Jesus was not yet glorified.)
David, you said: "Tulip is not found anywhere Pre Calvary"

Think about it. Does the state of a natural man suddenly change between the covenants?

Regarding the Spirit, why ignore my point about John Baptist?

Regarding the Spirit, do you think it possible for any man to enter heaven without being born again?

Was Simeon filled with the Spirit?

Was Anna filled with the Spirit?

You need to rethink.

304

News Item4/18/13 12:19 PM
David Preston | Centreville, VA  Contact via emailFind all comments by David Preston
Eph. 1- the "us" is "in him." You did not get " in him" until you did something and that was call upon Jesus Christ.
By the way you break Gods will everyday when you sin myself included.
303

News Item4/18/13 11:33 AM
Eph.1  Find all comments by Eph.1
David Preston wrote:
Here is a better way to look at Eph. 1:4
The key is "in him." Who did God choose? Those who are "in him."
And v5 teaches "having predestinated 'US'"

Why "predestinate" if all GOD was doing before the foundation of the world was chosing a method rather than a person?? A method which apparently you want to come from a NON-discerning sinner???

God does NOT predestinate a vague human possibility to come to Christ.

God does not predestinate a choice within the erroneous notion of human free will which doesn't exist.

God does NOT predestinate a competition with sin in the mortal - with sin as a possible winner - And God as a loser.

God does NOT predestinate man saving himself per the Roman Catholic/Arminian salvation by self help method.

God does not predestinate defeat of those whom HE can foreknow - "For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son" Ro 8:29.

Eph 1:11 In whom also we have obtained an inheritance, being ***PREDESTINATED ACCORDING TO THE PURPOSE OF HIM*** who worketh all things after the counsel of HIS OWN WILL:

David. Apparently you believe God's "purpose and will," can only be achieved with the cooperation of sinners.

302

News Item4/18/13 11:27 AM
David Preston | Centreville, VA  Contact via emailFind all comments by David Preston
JPW- you don't get my point. Tulip is not found anywhere Pre Calvary. It doesn't come on view until Augustine. Be easy on the unbelieving Jews. They were the keepers of the Old Testament Hebrew bibles that we all benefit from.
JohnUK and US- this verse should help you in regards to being born again and the Holy Ghost.
John 7 37 In the last day, that great [day] of the feast, Jesus stood and cried, saying, If any man thirst, let him come unto me, and drink.
38 He that believeth on me, as the scripture hath said, out of his belly shall flow rivers of living water.
39 (But this spake he of the Spirit, which they that believe on him should receive: for the Holy Ghost was not yet [given]; because that Jesus was not yet glorified.)
301

News Item4/18/13 11:04 AM
jpw  Find all comments by jpw
David Preston wrote:
You would think if this was such a foundational doctrine that it would have been taught by unbelieving Jews after the cross and Jews before Calvary.
so what is it? Isaiah 53 is about Jesus Christ or do you follow your nonbelieving expositors and cut Christ out of the Old Testament?

you are here to get Christians to follow the teachings of unbelievers, rejecters of the Messiah, you have plainly said it.

300

News Item4/18/13 10:37 AM
Observer  Find all comments by Observer
Christopher000 wrote:
..if that's not the case, then God basically chose to save some and condemn most. (?) I would ask why but I assume the answer would be, "it's a mystery".
The starting point Chris is that if God had not done anything we were all heading for hell.

The Good News is that God out his so great love DID DO SOMETHING! Something really remarkable. He solved a divine conundrum; How could his justice be satisfied and yet he be merciful? How could he be just and yet justify the ungodly?

The answer was that Christ would be born of a woman, born under the very law that humanity had broken so that he could obey it in letter and spirit thus honoring that law, and though he was without sin he would take upon him the punishment of all those that the Father had given him so that they may be with him in glory. The Holy Spirit, the comforter is now present to ensure that the benefits of this salvation are secured to those that Christ died to save.

If Christ's death was meant for everyone, everyone would be saved. End of story.

But not everyone believes and so not everyone is saved.

So either Christ's death achieved its desired end or it did not.

What say ya? Does God achieve what he set out to accomplish or not?

299

News Item4/18/13 9:49 AM
John UK | Wales  Find all comments by John UK
SteveR wrote:
The honour should be awarded to JohnUK
I refer you to my post 8.52am.

US said: "David seems to be a student of the Word, so sometimes I wonder at his statements. If Nicodemus could not be born again, why did our Lord say to him, you must be born again?"

Excellent point US!

298

News Item4/18/13 9:43 AM
SteveR  Find all comments by SteveR
Unprofitable Servant wrote:
and finally, to SteveR, why take an infant shopping, he can't shop, why take an infant to the restaurant, he can't feed himself and probably won't eat anything from the menu, your question is superfluous
You are far too kind, but alas I can not accept credit. I satirized by essentially plagiarizing the question from another.

The honour should be awarded to JohnUK

297

News Item4/18/13 9:22 AM
Unprofitable Servant | Georgia  Find all comments by Unprofitable Servant
David Preston wrote:
Eph. 1 said -"But God does the electing without any merit in man.
...
David seems to be a student of the Word, so sometimes I wonder at his statements. If Nicodemus could not be born again, why did our Lord say to him, you must be born again?

Also, I know my comments don't rank up their with many of the learned brothers and sisters on this forum, but it seems like we covered this before. The direct object receives the action of the verb, the prepositional phrases serve as modifiers. In the two verses he quoted the one receiving the action of the verb chose is US. You don't think that effects our eternal destiny?

How can you say that the things concerning the salvation of the soul are not spiritual? The natural man receives NOT the things of the Spirit of God, are you saying that the Spirit of God is not active in salvation?

and finally, to SteveR, why take an infant shopping, he can't shop, why take an infant to the restaurant, he can't feed himself and probably won't eat anything from the menu, your question is superfluous

296

News Item4/18/13 8:58 AM
Observer  Find all comments by Observer
Christopher000 wrote:
Very difficult reality to consider; God chose some but rejected most.
God rejects- see

Romans 9.16-20

...it is not of him that willeth, nor of him that runneth, but of God that sheweth mercy. For the scripture saith unto Pharaoh, Even for this same purpose have I raised thee up, that I might shew my power in thee, and that my name might be declared throughout all the earth. Therefore hath he mercy on whom he will have mercy, and whom he will he HARDENETH. Thou wilt say then unto me, Why doth he yet find fault? For who hath resisted his will? Nay but, O man, who art thou that repliest against God? Shall the thing formed say to him that formed it, Why hast thou made me thus?

And

Rom 11.5-8
Even so then at this present time also there is a remnant according to the election of grace. And if by grace, then is it no more of works: otherwise grace is no more grace. But if it be of works, then it is no more grace: otherwise work is no more work. What then? Israel hath not obtained that which he seeketh for; but the election hath obtained it, and THE REST WERE BLINDED. (According as it is written, God hath given them the spirit of slumber, eyes that they should not see, and ears that they should not hear) unto this day

295

News Item4/18/13 8:52 AM
John UK | Wales  Find all comments by John UK
Observer wrote:
Hey John
Good morning Bro!
Ha! The guy is just unbelievable. He made some obscure remark about Irenaeus and then when I asked him to elaborate he ignored it and now is claiming victory on the history front.
As I said before cognitive skills deficit
G'morning bro! Unbelievable is correct!

SteveR wrote:
Was it a more intelligent question than Johns "Why do you take your infants to Church if they cant understand the sermon?'
Ahem, if you are referring to me, I never said that. And if you are misquoting me, I should appreciate an apology, lest the Lord break out against you, and I desire that for no man - rather repentance.
__________

Christopher, just one small comment concerning your grappling with the issues.

I certainly believe that God has graciously chosen to save some folks. They needed saving because they were guilty before God for having sinned against him. Others, left in their sins, are equally guilty before God, and they are condemned, not because God had them chalked up for hell, but because they have sinned and incurred God's wrath, openly sinning without any compulsion from God.

294

News Item4/18/13 8:21 AM
Christopher000 | Rhode Island  Find all comments by Christopher000
Yeah, thanks...when you have some time in the near future, I'd like to read some of those verses.
Very difficult reality to consider; God chose some but rejected most.

When anyone has time: "For many are called, but few are chosen"

So, many are called, but not all. Even though many are called, few are chosen. How, if they were called, are they not chosen unless they rejected God's call? How does this fit with the idea that God chooses us without any action on our part; our accepting or rejecting His call?

Why would God call them unless He intended to also choose them, based upon their response to His call? I wonder why He would bother calling them when He already knew they wouldn't be chosen, based upon their rejection of Him (I thought).

Hmmm...no easy, short answers, I'm guessing.

293

News Item4/18/13 8:17 AM
Observer  Find all comments by Observer
SteveR wrote:
You did? Was it a more intelligent question than Johns "Why do you take your infants to Church if they cant understand the sermon?'
If not I gave it all the attention it derserved, zero
LLLOOOOOOOOOSSSSSSSEEEEERRRRRRRRRRRRR!
292

News Item4/18/13 8:05 AM
SteveR  Find all comments by SteveR
Observer wrote:
Hey John
Good morning Bro!
Ha! The guy is just unbelievable. He made some obscure remark about Irenaeus and then when I asked him to elaborate he ignored it and now is claiming victory on the history front.
As I said before cognitive skills deficit
Hey Chris,
Glad my posts helped clarify issues a little. When I have time, I will post up some scriptures that free willers might like to consider.
You did? Was it a more intelligent question than Johns "Why do you take your infants to Church if they cant understand the sermon?'

If not I gave it all the attention it derserved, zero

291

News Item4/18/13 8:00 AM
Observer  Find all comments by Observer
SteveR wrote:
In case you werent paying attention, your crew blew a Sola Scriptura draw by encouraging Yurich to repond with writings of the Church Fathers.
The affirmations of infant Baptism from the Church Fathers before the New Testament Canon tilted the debate towards the Reformed understanding of the sacrament. (My advice- as a Sola Scriptura Baptist, avoid history to maintain your draw)
Its not easy to blow a draw, but you were able to pull it off, Next, Im guessing with your debating prowess Michael will turn you & observer into dispensationalists
Hey John

Good morning Bro!

Ha! The guy is just unbelievable. He made some obscure remark about Irenaeus and then when I asked him to elaborate he ignored it and now is claiming victory on the history front.

As I said before cognitive skills deficit

Hey Chris,

Glad my posts helped clarify issues a little. When I have time, I will post up some scriptures that free willers might like to consider.

290

News Item4/18/13 7:51 AM
SteveR  Find all comments by SteveR
John UK wrote:
Which, being interpreted means, "No, I'm afraid I cannot answer those questions, so please give us a break."
Thats because you are still using a Pig Latin to Cockney Dialect translator. You lost in the original languages(which isnt easy to do)
289

News Item4/18/13 7:33 AM
John UK | Wales  Find all comments by John UK
SteveR wrote:
In case you werent paying attention, your crew blew a Sola Scriptura draw by encouraging Yurich to repond with writings of the Church Fathers.
The affirmations of infant Baptism from the Church Fathers before the New Testament Canon tilted the debate towards the Reformed understanding of the sacrament. (My advice- as a Sola Scriptura Baptist, avoid history to maintain your draw)
Its not easy to blow a draw, but you were able to pull it off, Next, Im guessing with your debating prowess Michael will turn you & observer into dispensationalists
Which, being interpreted means, "No, I'm afraid I cannot answer those questions, so please give us a break."
288

News Item4/18/13 7:28 AM
SteveR  Find all comments by SteveR
John UK wrote:
I surely did miss ya! And your Theo Logical points. There is still no sign of SteveR answering either question and, just like before, I think the towel has fallen in the font and gone down the plughole.
In case you werent paying attention, your crew blew a Sola Scriptura draw by encouraging Yurich to repond with writings of the Church Fathers.

The affirmations of infant Baptism from the Church Fathers before the New Testament Canon tilted the debate towards the Reformed understanding of the sacrament. (My advice- as a Sola Scriptura Baptist, avoid history to maintain your draw)

Its not easy to blow a draw, but you were able to pull it off, Next, Im guessing with your debating prowess Michael will turn you & observer into dispensationalists

287

News Item4/18/13 7:02 AM
Christopher000 | Rhode Island  Find all comments by Christopher000
Observer...no, no, no...you have it all wrong...you all do.

Just kidding...that'll be the day I tell anyone here that they're wrong...ha-ha.
Anyway, just what I needed, a simple simon explanation. I understand the point about what makes the difference from person to person...does one have a stronger spiritual appetite? If God spreads out His grace the same to all, why don't all accept Him?, and so on.
I guess you all would have called me Arminian (?) because I believed that we choose Him because He chose us, or, He chose us because He knew that we would choose Him. This is a very difficult thing to break away from mentally, so I wouldn't be to hard on those wrapped up in this. I am still trying to get it all to sink in without having to think about it too hard when trying to comprehend the idea.
I guess what always had me sold on us choosing Him because He chose us, is that if that's not the case, then God basically chose to save some and condemn most. (?) I would ask why but I assume the answer would be, "it's a mystery".

286
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