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RELIGION, CURRENT EVENTS, TECHNOLOGY Subscribe to the breaking newsWhat is RSS?
FRONT PAGE  |  12/19/2014
SUNDAY, DEC 2, 2012  |  171 comments  |  1 commentary
Rick Warren Uncertain if Homosexual Behavior is Sinful, Says ‘Gays’ Go to Heaven
Controversy is stirring over recent comments made by Rick Warren, author of the best-selling book The Purpose-Driven Life and megachurch leader of Saddleback Church in California, who stated that homosexual behavior “might be” sinful, and that he believes homosexuals go to Heaven.

During an interview this week with the Huffington Post, Warren was asked by Marc Lamont Hill if having romantic feelings for a member of the same sex is a sin. Leading up to the question, Warren was explaining that he does not hate homosexuals, and that people should disagree politely on the subject of homosexuality.

“I have many, many gay friends, and have worked around the world with them in gay organizations to try to stop AIDS,” he said. “We’re doing ‘World AIDS Day’ this weekend at Saddleback Church. My wife and I have given millions of dollars to help people with HIV/AIDS and have worked with gay organizations on ...


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Page 1 | Page 3 ·  Found: 171 user comment(s)
News Item12/8/12 1:35 PM
Frank  Contact via emailFind all comments by Frank
John UK wrote:
1. Frank, my apologies. Let's see now, you prefer to interact with living people, because then there is the opportunity for them to tell you when you have it wrong!
2. That's not the first time you've brought up about a "language barrier". Is English not your first language?
Well said brother. I accept your apology and forgive you for distorting what I said regarding gifted men. The only reason I wanted the record straight was because of others who might have read that post would then would have wondered whether it was true or not.

No the only reason I brought up the language thing was to be cute since you speak an English English and I do the American English; just trying to be cute. We have done that sort of exchange before and you seemed to understand it then. But, to answer your question is English my natural language; yes it is, although my German is fair. You will notice I ended that comment with "or ...". That was probably the most important thing.

131

News Item12/8/12 1:27 PM
John UK | Wales  Find all comments by John UK
Dopey wrote:
John my dear brother, multitudes during Torrey's lifetime on this planet found Torrey to be "pretty sharp", sharp as "iron".
Proverbs 27:17
Iron sharpeneth iron; so a man sharpeneth the countenance of his friend.
Because Torrey died in the 1920s, most existing audio versions of Torrey involve someone reading what Torrey wrote and I don't have a problem with that fact. I am going to listen to a couple of the audio versions you and I linked to including the particular one you gave. But the first one I am going to listen to is number 28 from the link I gave which features "Rare Recordings" of Torrey himself speaking.
Yes I would like to hear that myself.
130

News Item12/8/12 12:41 PM
Dopey  Find all comments by Dopey
John UK wrote:
That's it David. For example, HERE is a 7 minute sermon by Torrey on how to "pray in the Spirit", a sermonette which reiterates what I have already said on this subject when answering Christopher.
I guess Torrey is pretty sharp!
John my dear brother, multitudes during Torrey's lifetime on this planet found Torrey to be "pretty sharp", sharp as "iron".

Proverbs 27:17
Iron sharpeneth iron; so a man sharpeneth the countenance of his friend.

Because Torrey died in the 1920s, most existing audio versions of Torrey involve someone reading what Torrey wrote and I don't have a problem with that fact. I am going to listen to a couple of the audio versions you and I linked to including the particular one you gave. But the first one I am going to listen to is number 28 from the link I gave which features "Rare Recordings" of Torrey himself speaking.

129

News Item12/8/12 12:00 PM
John UK | Wales  Find all comments by John UK
Dopey wrote:
A "funamentalist"
That's it David. For example, HERE is a 7 minute sermon by Torrey on how to "pray in the Spirit", a sermonette which reiterates what I have already said on this subject when answering Christopher.

I guess Torrey is pretty sharp!

128

News Item12/8/12 11:43 AM
Dopey  Find all comments by Dopey
127

News Item12/8/12 10:54 AM
John UK | Wales  Find all comments by John UK
not science wrote:
Where's the word funamentalist in the Bible? Sounds like Baptists are engaged in the craft of eisegesis.
What a strange man you are. Have you found the word calvinist in the Bible yet?

What did you say you were?

126

News Item12/8/12 10:17 AM
not science  Find all comments by not science
John UK wrote:
Yes Mike, I nearly put "in his 'native' fundamentalist Baptist".
He was certainly a man mightily used of God.
Where's the word funamentalist in the Bible? Sounds like Baptists are engaged in the craft of eisegesis.
125

News Item12/8/12 10:00 AM
John UK | Wales  Find all comments by John UK
Mike wrote:
R.A.Torrey was editor/compiler of the work called "The Fundamentals: A Testimony to the Truth" from which, I believe, we get the term fundamentalist.
Yes Mike, I nearly put "in his 'native' fundamentalist Baptist".

He was certainly a man mightily used of God.

124

News Item12/8/12 9:54 AM
Mike | New York  Find all comments by Mike
John UK wrote:
I believe that much of Torrey's studies would be of immense value and blessing to many in the Reformed Camp, as well as those in the fundamentalist Baptist. It is good to have good doctrine, but even better to have good obedience. Better still to have sound doctrine and obey the Lord perfectly.
R.A.Torrey was editor/compiler of the work called "The Fundamentals: A Testimony to the Truth" from which, I believe, we get the term fundamentalist.
123

News Item12/8/12 9:37 AM
John UK | Wales  Find all comments by John UK
Christopher000 wrote:
Hey, John/UK, I just noticed the link you posted up...thanks for that. RA Torrey, is he a good guy to read in general as far as his biblical views, etc.?
I believe that much of Torrey's studies would be of immense value and blessing to many in the Reformed Camp, as well as those in the fundamentalist Baptist. It is good to have good doctrine, but even better to have good obedience. Better still to have sound doctrine and obey the Lord perfectly.
122

News Item12/8/12 9:05 AM
Christopher000 | Rhode Island  Find all comments by Christopher000
Chris/NY: Here is a recent, short sermon concerning homosexuality and pornography by a preacher that I like (John MacArthur).

http://www.sermonaudio.com/sermoninfo.asp?m=t&s=112121847243

121

News Item12/8/12 8:28 AM
Christopher000 | Rhode Island  Find all comments by Christopher000
Hey, John/UK, I just noticed the link you posted up...thanks for that. RA Torrey, is he a good guy to read in general as far as his biblical views, etc.?
Chris (guest)/NY...good for you!!! I wish the best for you and hope that you will overcome. When you feel weak, aside from prayer, etc, of course, please always remember my post about our mortality. Any one of us can be taken at any time so I hope that you have already put that horrible lifestyle behind you and are now just learning to overcome the urges through prayer, etc. I checked out the website you mentioned...great find! Homosexuality and pornography are two of Satan's most productive tools to keep people hellbound. God will crush Satan's hold in your life if you just let Him get to work and do your part through prayer, applying the Bible to your life, and resisting the temptations when they arise.
120

News Item12/8/12 5:00 AM
John UK | Wales  Find all comments by John UK
Frank wrote:
1. I didn't say the above, so why did you accuse me of it.

2. Is this a result of a language barrier or ...

1. Frank, my apologies. Let's see now, you prefer to interact with living people, because then there is the opportunity for them to tell you when you have it wrong!

2. That's not the first time you've brought up about a "language barrier". Is English not your first language?

Mike wrote:
It wouldn't have mattered if Esau had Godly sorrow or not, the blessing could not be undone.
Mike, you raise an important point. So you also believe that it was Isaac's repentance that Esau was seeking with tears. How come it's never been mentioned before? It's no wonder that Isaac was very careful to ensure that the one he was about to bless was Esau, and even then he got it wrong because of Jacob's deception, although it was really Rebecca who organised the whole thing. It was her that deceived her husband, and stole the birthright away from her firstborn, that Jacob might have it.
119

News Item12/7/12 7:05 PM
Mike | New York  Find all comments by Mike
It wouldn't have mattered if Esau had Godly sorrow or not, the blessing could not be undone.
118

News Item12/7/12 6:41 PM
Frank  Contact via emailFind all comments by Frank
John UK wrote:
And unlike Frank, I do believe that God does gift some men specifically that they may bless the body of Christ with insights and understandings, even when they are long gone. Gotta turn in.
I didn't say the above, so why did you accuse me of it. In fact, this all started by me reading the article Dopey gave and I said "it was excellent". Now why would I say that if I didn't read and appreciate what was written by a dead person. I simply said I would rather have your opinion because I could argue with you and not them. I didn't say I don't read what they say or I didn't say they weren't gifted. You can read them and they argue their points? I will then read them and argue against their points.

Is this a result of a language barrier or ... You did pose your original question to a general audience.

117

News Item12/7/12 6:34 PM
John UK | Wales  Find all comments by John UK
Dopey wrote:
Hebrews 11:4
By faith Abel offered unto God a more excellent sacrifice than Cain, by which he obtained witness that he was righteous, God testifying of his gifts: and by it he being dead yet speaketh.
John and Frank when I woke up this morning I didn't think I would be working in collaboration with 4 other people on things like the will of God and Esau trying to repent and two of the four
"being dead yet speaketh" (Reuben Torrey and Harry Ironside). God is full of surprises!
David, my dear old bro, you are absolutely correct in saying that God is full of surprises. And unlike Frank, I do believe that God does gift some men specifically that they may bless the body of Christ with insights and understandings, even when they are long gone. I have seen gospel tracts before by Torrey, but never any of his teaching ministry. If I get time I will certainly have another look at the archive and read some more. And I may have another look at e-sword and see if they have added any more like Ironside.

You've both been a blessing to me today, so I want you to know that. Let brotherly love continue and iron sharpen iron.

Gotta turn in.

116

News Item12/7/12 6:24 PM
Frank  Contact via emailFind all comments by Frank
Dopey wrote:
Hebrews 11:4
By faith Abel offered unto God a more excellent sacrifice than Cain, by which he obtained witness that he was righteous, God testifying of his gifts: and by it he being dead yet speaketh.
John and Frank when I woke up this morning I didn't think I would be working in collaboration with 4 other people on things like the will of God and Esau trying to repent and two of the four
"being dead yet speaketh" (Reuben Torrey and Harry Ironside). God is full of surprises!
But to be very honest, I care more about what you and John say then the dead folks or the other live ones. You may not be use to me, but I really mean that. I can't argue with them and I can argue with you and John.
115

News Item12/7/12 6:17 PM
Dopey  Find all comments by Dopey
Hebrews 11:4

By faith Abel offered unto God a more excellent sacrifice than Cain, by which he obtained witness that he was righteous, God testifying of his gifts: and by it he being dead yet speaketh.

John and Frank when I woke up this morning I didn't think I would be working in collaboration with 4 other people on things like the will of God and Esau trying to repent and two of the four
"being dead yet speaketh" (Reuben Torrey and Harry Ironside). God is full of surprises!

114

News Item12/7/12 6:06 PM
John UK | Wales  Find all comments by John UK
Frank wrote:
Okay, I will reword it because of our language barrier. Before I became saved, I sometimes was sorry because of things I was doing. But, that sorrow did not lead me to confess and turn from those things because they were offensive to my heavenly Father; it was a worldly sorrow. Now, in order to repent (turn from in a godly way), someone has to be sorry for what they are doing, but if they are simply sorry in a worldly sense, then it wouldn't be repentance. If they are sorry in a godly sense, then that will lead to genuine repentance. 1 Corinthians 7:9,10.
Esau was sorry, but it was in a worldly way, like was noted in 7:9,10.
I just read your post to Dopey after the above, so we do agree after all? See, I know how to amend my post. I see where the confusion came from though. You didn't notice that the verses I gave used the word sorrow and repentance.
Yes we sure agree. But I was only focussing on what "repentance" Esau was "seeking". Jacob had deceived his father and received the blessing due unto Esau. Jacob's mother even helped him in this. And so both of "them" ought to have been repentant. But when Esau and Isaac found them out, Esau requested his father to change his mind and give "him" the blessing.
113

News Item12/7/12 5:57 PM
Frank  Contact via emailFind all comments by Frank
John UK wrote:
Ah, you are thinking that he was seeking his own repentance.
Now that doesn't make much sense, eh?
Men either repent or they are impenitent.
Okay, I will reword it because of our language barrier. Before I became saved, I sometimes was sorry because of things I was doing. But, that sorrow did not lead me to confess and turn from those things because they were offensive to my heavenly Father; it was a worldly sorrow. Now, in order to repent (turn from in a godly way), someone has to be sorry for what they are doing, but if they are simply sorry in a worldly sense, then it wouldn't be repentance. If they are sorry in a godly sense, then that will lead to genuine repentance. 1 Corinthians 7:9,10.

Esau was sorry, but it was in a worldly way, like was noted in 7:9,10.

I just read your post to Dopey after the above, so we do agree after all? See, I know how to amend my post. I see where the confusion came from though. You didn't notice that the verses I gave used the word sorrow and repentance.

Oops, now I read the entire thing and we do disagree. Sorry for the confusion, I am currently being distracted and can't stop and read everything carefully.

112
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