Norway Bombing, Shooting: Anders Behring Breivik Reveals Hatred of Modern Church in Blogs
Breivik’s blogs reveal a lot about his thoughts and views:
1) On the “Church” he blogged:
"Today's Protestant church is a joke. Priests in jeans who march for Palestine and churches that look like minimalist shopping centres. I am a supporter of an indirect collective conversion of the Protestant church back to the Catholic."
When you question an RC on "works vs grace", he'll tell you that he doesn't practice works and quote you scripture why his works is actually "grace" and his idolatry is actually "not" idolatry - using scripture and spurious examples. Speaking of which-
Mike wrote: "Jacob" said "faith is the gift of God, otherwise sinners could save themselves." This is not true for 2 reasons: sinners cannot save themselves, and, faith is not a work. Trusting in something gains no credit to the one who trusts. When you plop down in your easy chair, you trust that it will hold you up and not dump you on your head. That your chair holds you up is solely a function of the chair. It doesn't hold you up because you have faith that it will. That would make trust in the chair as the cause of it being able to hold you up.
Your salvation "chair" REQUIRES your faith otherwise it will NOT hold you up!! It would be nice if you'd just plop down in Gods arms. Instead, you have to ADD your works which is the cause of yor salvatn.
FAITH is not works, but your faith IS!! because it comes from you, not GOD!
All "will worshipers" will tell us a syrupy story of how it was Gods grace that saved them - then go on to describe how it was actually THEIR faith that saved them!!!!
Mike wrote: Your view appears to make faith a work, which it isn't. Then from this erroneous start, conclude it must be the gift of God in Eph 2:8, because the gift is not of works. But faith is not a work in the first place. Again the contrast is between salvation by grace, and salvation by works.
Faith is the gift of God - And for THIS reason it is NOT a work, ie NOT a faculty which may be used by the mortal, to come to Christ.
When you remove faith from its divine providential source (a gift) - Then you imply only one other source ie man - thus making it a human effort, or human work!
Eph 2:9 teaches human effort does not work! This in opposition to V8 which in turn reveals only ONE possible ability which could be construed as mortal - namely 'faith.'
Consequently salvation (the word v8 "save") very obviously cannot be interpreted as human, because only God can save.
Thus "FAITH" is the gift of God unto salvation.
WCF 14. "1. The grace of faith, whereby the elect are enabled to believe to the saving of their souls, is the work of the Spirit of Christ in their hearts" [Heb 10:39. Eph 1:17-19; 2:8; 2 Cor 4:13.]
meagain wrote: There you are again Mike, emphasizing the faculties of man. "drowning man"? Nope - "Dead" in sin! "man grabs hold"? Nope - Spiritual discernment is not available to natural man. The Lord does not require assistance from dead men who cannot discern. From the outset saving is in divine hands and remains there.
"Jacob" said "faith is the gift of God, otherwise sinners could save themselves." This is not true for 2 reasons: sinners cannot save themselves, and, faith is not a work. Trusting in something gains no credit to the one who trusts. When you plop down in your easy chair, you trust that it will hold you up and not dump you on your head. That your chair holds you up is solely a function of the chair. It doesn't hold you up because you have faith that it will. That would make trust in the chair as the cause of it being able to hold you up.
Your view appears to make faith a work, which it isn't. Then from this erroneous start, conclude it must be the gift of God in Eph 2:8, because the gift is not of works. But faith is not a work in the first place. Again the contrast is between salvation by grace, and salvation by works.
Mike wrote: Jake, that's like saying if Jake tosses one end of a rope to a drowning man, and the man grabs hold of it, that he must therefore be saving himself.
There you are again Mike, emphasizing the faculties of man.
"drowning man"? Nope - "Dead" in sin!
"man grabs hold"? Nope - Spiritual discernment is not available to natural man.
The Lord does not require assistance from dead men who cannot discern. From the outset saving is in divine hands and remains there.
Mike wrote: ..that's like saying if Jake tosses one end of a rope to a drowning man..
I've heard that analogy repeatedly. It sounds good but is it really an appropriate representation?
"But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die."Gen2:17
But man tells us, "Ye shall not surely die"Gen3:4. For, "Did God really say that?"Gen3:1 For we are not soo dead that we cannot choose, says man.
If you must seek after an analogy Mike, how much of your help did God use when you were born? "Ye must be born again", and it's all Gods doing this time also.
David offered sacrifice and gave thanks, but he realized that he gave back to God what came from HIM in the first place. "14But who am I, and what is my people, that we should be able to offer so willingly after this sort? for all things come of thee, and of thine own have we given thee."1Chr29:14
There's room for this kind of thanks, not one where we wretch the power out of Gods hands and become "ye shall be as gods"Gen3:5, having power to decide for eternity.
Jacob Arminius wrote: --- Thats why Mike will tell you - [I've been teaching him] - That faith is the gift of God, otherwise sinners could save themselves. ---
Jake, that's like saying if Jake tosses one end of a rope to a drowning man, and the man grabs hold of it, that he must therefore be saving himself.
Innocent Bystander wrote: Can anyone (especially an Armenian) help?
Why is it that some folks seem to be convinced that the people of Armenia, (which borders with eastern Turkey) are into DIY salvation like the Roman Catholics are???
Next we will have somebody calling them a bunch of Arminians. __________
PS God does not require human help to save people. He saves/quickens sinners who are mortals who are dead in sin.
Eph 2:1 And you hath he quickened, who were dead in trespasses and sins;
Eph 2:5 Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved)
And anyway... John 6:63 It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life. AND 1Cor 2:14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.
Thats why Mike will tell you - [I've been teaching him] - That faith is the gift of God, otherwise sinners could save themselves.
PS Matt 19:16ff - Jesus provides the ONLY solution in verse 26! "With men this is impossible; but with God all things are possible."
Innocent Bystander wrote: All someone needs to do is cite a verse where the Bible teaches that Christ requires human help.. Can anyone (especially an Armenian) help?
Innocent Bystander wrote: Christ requires human help.. Can anyone (especially an Armenian) help?
Innocent Bystander wrote: ..Christ requires..
Innocent Bystander wrote: ..REQUIRES..
REQUIRES??.. HUMAN HELP?? The serpent was right, we are gods!
My Lord requires NOTHING!! Can anyone (especially a three headed alien) twist scripture? Sure! There's enough of you around here. That's what you all do anyways. One of you even tried that on Christ in the desert.
"And, behold, one came and said unto him, Good Master, what good thing shall I do, that I may have eternal life?
"And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.
"He saith unto him, Which? Jesus said, Thou shalt do no murder, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness,
"Honour thy father and thy mother: and, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself."
Innocent Bystander wrote: All someone needs to do is cite a verse where the Bible teaches that Christ requires human help and Bibliophile is correct, right? Can anyone (especially an Armenian) help?
Don't know about Armenians, maybe there's a Russian about?
Bibliophile wrote: Isn't salvation a work of the will by the grace of Christ alone to have faith in and obedience to Him both today and everyday until He calls us home?
Look Biblio, the Bible teaches Christ can save without human help...
Acts 4:12 Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.
1Tim 2:5 For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;
Jn 14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.
Jn 10:9 I am the door: by me if any man enter in, he shall be saved, and shall go in and out, and find pasture.
Jn 11:25 Jesus said unto her, I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live:
Jn 6:51 I am the living bread which came down from heaven: if any man eat of this bread, he shall live for ever: and the bread that I will give is my flesh, which I will give for the life of the world.
1Jn 4:14 14 And we have seen and do testify that the Father sent the Son to be the Saviour of the world.
And many more confirm Jesus does not need YOUR help to save you!
*Luther Should've Known That TRUE BIBLICAL SAVING "FAITH" PRODUCES TRUE BIBLICAL GOOD-"WORKS" & THAT JAMES IS INDEED HOLY WRIT FROM GOD !
The Norwegian Terrorist NEVER Attended A TRUE Historic Protestant Church Like IAN PAISLEY'S In Northern Ireland !
In Another Thread I Wrote The Following, Attempting To Explain That ALMIGHTY GOD'S BIBLICAL BASED ETERNAL SPIRITUAL SALVATION Is Not Based On Any "Works", "Faith" &-Or Even The "Will" Of HIS "Foreordained", "Foreknowledged", "Foreknown", "Forecalled", "Predestinated", "Elect" & "Chosen" Saints:
'And HE (JESUS CHRIST) Said, Therefore Said I Unto You, That NO MAN Can Come Unto ME, EXCEPT IT WERE GIVEN UNTO HIM OF MY FATHER.' John 6:65
'FOR BY GRACE ARE YE SAVED THROUGH FAITH; AND THAT NOT OF YOURSELVES: IT IS THE GIFT OF GOD: NOT OF WORKS, LEST ANY MAN SHOULD BOAST.' EPHESIANS 2:8-9
I DARE Say EVEN The 'FAITH' Of Ephesians 2:8-9 Is ALSO GIVEN To GOD'S ELECT-CHOSEN-PREDESTINATED SAINTS, To Effectually WORK GOD-THE-HOLY-SPIRIT'S WORK OF ETERNAL SALVATION: SO AS TO TOTALLY RENDER THE FOREORDAINED ELECT-CHOSEN-PREDESTINATED SAINT INCAPABLE OF EVER EVEN DESIRING TO 'BOAST' OF HIS OWN SO-CALLED SPIRITUAL, PSYCHOLOGICAL &-OR PHYSICAL FAITH (IF SUCH EXISTS)... !
Stephen Hamilton wrote: You obviously can't read well either my friend. Do not selectively quote the great man. Luther had lots of faults, but was still a giant compared to today's pygmies who criticise him. We owe men like Luther an incalculable debt. Those who want to make him (or his writings)responsible for the ravings or actions of a murderous lunatic are beneath contempt.
Agreed, Luther's good outweighs his bad. It is remarkable that he was able to see through the clouds of false teaching as much as he was able, considering his background as an RC monk. Had he lived longer, he might even have come to accept the book of James as biblical.
Evidently, This So-Called "Christian" & "Darwinian" Terrorist Never Attended A TRUE Historic "Protestant" Church Like Ian Paisley's Martyrs Memorial Free Presbyterian Church Of Belfast, Northern Ireland (Ulster) !
In Another Thread I Wrote The Following, Attempting To Explain That ALMIGHTY GOD'S BIBLICAL BASED ETERNAL SPIRITUAL SALVATION Is Not Based On Any "Works", "Faith" &-Or Even The "Will" Of HIS "Foreordained", "Foreknowledged", "Foreknown", "Forecalled", "Predestinated", "Elect" & "Chosen" Saints:
'And HE (JESUS CHRIST) Said, Therefore Said I Unto You, That NO MAN Can Come Unto ME, EXCEPT IT WERE GIVEN UNTO HIM OF MY FATHER.' John 6:65
'FOR BY GRACE ARE YE SAVED THROUGH FAITH; AND THAT NOT OF YOURSELVES: IT IS THE GIFT OF GOD:
NOT OF WORKS, LEST ANY MAN SHOULD BOAST.' EPHESIANS 2:8-9
I DARE Say EVEN The 'FAITH' Of Ephesians 2:8-9 Is ALSO GIVEN To GOD'S ELECT-CHOSEN-PREDESTINATED SAINTS, To Effectually WORK GOD-THE-HOLY-SPIRIT'S WORK OF ETERNAL SALVATION: SO AS TO TOTALLY RENDER THE FOREORDAINED ELECT-CHOSEN-PREDESTINATED SAINT INCAPABLE OF EVER EVEN DESIRING TO 'BOAST' OF HIS OWN SO-CALLED SPIRITUAL, PSYCHOLOGICAL &-OR PHYSICAL (IF SUCH EXISTS) HUMAN FAITH", WILL, VOLITION & EFFORT !
Bibliophile wrote: Isn't salvation a work of the will...?
If I were to complete a membership card, put it in the plate and sit in the pew on Sundays at a local SBC (like I did years ago), how would this help me?
What's missing is the work of the Holy Spirit and the true saving knowledge of our Lord. It's a small wonder that someone playing "religion" without the power of God found a home in the Godless religion of RC.
No wonder you ask, "Isn't salvation a work of the will?" Yes, your will!! God has given you over to yourself. So save yourself!
Isn't salvation a work of the will by the grace of Christ alone to have faith in and obedience to Him both today and everyday until He calls us home?
If I were to complete a membership card, put it in the plate and sit in the pew on Sundays at a local SBC (like I did years ago), how would this help me?
Also, if a real Islamic threat ever did materialize (which is very unlikely), how would being a member of the SBC, for example, help ward off the threat?
it saddens me to see yet more people buying into tv hysteria, blaming whole groups of people for the crimes of a few. how long will the nations fall for such rubbish?
As the mainstream media tries to tie the mass murderer with "Christian" and "fundamentalist", when he was obviously neither, the question I have yet to be answered is this. Was he on prescription physco drugs? Many times this turns out to be the case. from what I understand these commonly prescribed drugs are hallucinatory and cause people to lose all sense of reality. So mix that with a fallen nature (that all unregenerate men have)and it is a combination ripe for disaster.
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