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RELIGION, CURRENT EVENTS, TECHNOLOGY Subscribe to the breaking newsWhat is RSS?
FRONT PAGE  |  10/20/2014
WEDNESDAY, JUL 23, 2014  |  247 comments  |  1 commentary
Patheos: Calvinism = Wahhabism?

.Analogies between the European Reformation and contemporary Islamism are much closer than many Protestants would like to admit.

Noyes compares Calvin closely to Ibn Abd al-Wahhab, the founder of the Wahhabi movement that so often features, unflatteringly, in our headlines. Al-Wahhab (1703-92) was also a near-exact contemporary of John Wesley (1703-91), a fact that cries out for a comparative dual biography!

Like Calvinism, Wahhabi Islam urged the destruction of everything that could be seen as a later accretion to the core of the religion, as well as all manifestations of paganism or idolatry. Since the 1920s, this version of the faith has been the official creed of Saudi Arabia, and variants of it are found among Islam’s violent and extreme movements. ...

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COMMENTS | show all | add new  
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Page 1 | Page 11 ·  Found: 247 user comment(s)
News Item7/24/14 7:29 PM
General  Find all comments by General
I guess the wcf is like the other book that some use with the Bible, kinda like the Mormons do

News Item7/24/14 7:24 PM
BibleSays...  Find all comments by BibleSays...
Part 2: The Scripture.

Here are the verses that support these statements:

God ordained whatsoever comes to pass:

Ephesians 1:11, Hebrews 6:17, Romans 9:15, and Jeremiah 10:23

God is not the author of sin:

James 1:13, 17, and 1 John 1:5

Contingencies of second causes are established:

Acts 2:23, Matthew 17:12, Acts 4:27, 28, John 19:11, Proverbs 16:33


News Item7/24/14 7:12 PM
BibleSays...  Find all comments by BibleSays...
Part 1: The Statement.

Here's how WCF 3/1 reads:

"God from all eternity, did, by the most wise and holy counsel of His own will, freely, and unchangeably ordain whatsoever comes to pass; yet so, as thereby neither is God the author of sin, nor is violence offered to the will of the creatures; nor is the liberty or contingency of second causes taken away, but rather established."


News Item7/24/14 7:06 PM
BibleSays...  Find all comments by BibleSays...

Are you arrogant enough to believe you know better than a large counsel of ministers who spent every day of their lives in studying scripture? I will start in this post by laying out the WCF and go through and provide the verses that back up each statement.


News Item7/24/14 7:01 PM
General  Find all comments by General
Somebody please explain what the wcf have to do with the Bible? Preferably the KJV

News Item7/24/14 6:43 PM
PursuitofTruth  Find all comments by PursuitofTruth

None of these verses are quotes from The Westminster Confetion of Faith. Now why don't we see if you can answer with something from scripture that supports the contrary: that God doesn't reign soveriegn over all of His creation. I'd love to see you try to do it.


News Item7/24/14 6:36 PM
PursuitofTruth  Find all comments by PursuitofTruth
John 5:17 But Jesus answered them, My Father worketh hitherto, and I work.

Excerpt from Gill's Commentary:

my Father worketh hitherto: he who is my Father, not by creation, or adoption, but by nature, though he ended all his work on the seventh day, and rested from what he had done; yet he did not cease from working at all, but has continued to work ever since, on sabbath days, as well as on other days; in upholding and governing the world, in continuing the species of beings, and all creatures in their being; in providing for them, and in dispensing the bounties of his providence to them; in causing his sun to shine, and showers of rain to descend on the earth; and in taking care of, and protecting even the meanest of his creatures: and much more men; and still more his own people.


News Item7/24/14 6:28 PM
PursuitofTruth  Find all comments by PursuitofTruth
Dear UPS,

The Bible clearly states that God is soveriegn in everything we do.

Job 33:29 Lo, all these things worketh God oftentimes with man,

Jeremiah 10:23 O LORD I know that the way of man is not in himself: it is not in man that walketh to direct his steps.

And we also know that God is not responsible for sin.

Rom 9:14 What shall we say then? Is there unrighteousness with God? God forbid.

1Co 6:15 Know ye not that your bodies are the members of Christ? shall I then take the members of Christ, and make them the members of an harlot? God forbid.

Both of these statements are 100% true, and only when fallen men try to reason through this with their fallen minds does this become a "problem". Can you even wrap your mind around the fact that God has always existed? There are many things that we as humans cannot fully comprehend. Our minds are fallen just like we are, and thus we cannot hope to understand this with fallen reason.


News Item7/24/14 5:54 PM
Unprofitable Servant | Georgia  Find all comments by Unprofitable Servant
Tel Gersene wrote:
WCF 3/1 "God from all eternity did, by the most wise and holy counsel of his own will, freely and unchangeably ordain whatsoever comes to pass"
WCF, definitely the final authority for faith and practice. In fact I am going put scenarios for you to answer. I say you can't answer me without some WCF quote but we will see.

Let us set the ground rules, not questioning God's sovereignty, heartily acknowledge Daniel 4:35 "And all the inhabitants of the earth are reputed as nothing: and he doeth according to his will in the army of heaven, and among the inhabitants of the earth: and none can stay his hand, or say unto him, What doest thou?"

However, if God ordains whatsoever comes to pass, then you make Him the author of sin.

The guy with the lustful look is only doing what God ordained Him to do. The verse that tells us to make no provision for the flesh to fulfill the lust thereof should be ripped out because we have no choice in the matter. The Christian who waste hours in front of the tv is just doing what God ordained him to do. There is no need to pursue holiness because if we do or don't isn't within the choices we make, it is just what is ordained by God to be done by us. Can think of many more but OOC.


News Item7/24/14 5:11 PM
PursuitofTruth  Find all comments by PursuitofTruth
What do you mean not necessarily his earlier post John for JESUS? Shouldn't you know whether you were referring to it or not?

News Item7/24/14 4:52 PM
John for JESUS | Atl  Find all comments by John for JESUS
scripture alone from UK...

I was referring to the article Calvinist = Wahhabism and not necessarily your earlier post.


News Item7/24/14 4:50 PM
PursuitofTruth  Find all comments by PursuitofTruth
Scripture alone from UK writes:

Jeremiah 10:23-24 O LORD I know that the way of man is not in himself: it is not in man that walketh to direct his steps. O LORD, correct me, but with judgment; not in thine anger, least thou bring me to nothing.

Amen brother! SteveR doesn't seem to understand these verses!


News Item7/24/14 3:34 PM
scripture alone | UK  Find all comments by scripture alone
John for JESUS wrote:
Yeah, Calvinism pretty much sucks! God made me say that, lol.
I only quoted scripture therefore you must think scripture sucks.
I said nothing about Calvinism you associated scripture with Calvinism not me.

News Item7/24/14 3:14 PM
Tel Gersene  Find all comments by Tel Gersene
SteveR wrote:
Only in dispensationalism is Hitler a man raised for a divine purpose. To authentic Christians, Hitler is just another example of fallen man
I am definitely NOT a Dispy.

Lets have a look at the intricate detail GOD observes :
Luke 12:6 Are not five sparrows sold for two farthings, and not one of them is forgotten before God?
Luke 12:7 But even the very hairs of your head are all numbered. Fear not therefore: ye are of more value than many sparrows.

So if the tiny sparrow is considered by GOD then all mankind individually has a part to play in GOD's purpose and design.

Hitler was not allowed by GOD to be completely independent of Omniscience and omnipotence any more than SteveR is.

Your personal image of GOD appears to be human and insignificant as if you don't know HIM that well. HE is the creator of the universe and every detail within it. What happens on earth is either allowed by GOD or ordained by GOD.

WCF 3/1 "God from all eternity did, by the most wise and holy counsel of his own will, freely and unchangeably ordain whatsoever comes to pass"

Rom 9:18 Therefore hath he mercy on whom he will have mercy, and whom he will he hardeneth."


News Item7/24/14 2:30 PM
Jim Lincoln | Nebraska  Find all comments by Jim Lincoln

News Item7/24/14 2:26 PM
John for JESUS | Atl  Find all comments by John for JESUS
Yeah, Calvinism pretty much sucks! God made me say that, lol.

News Item7/24/14 2:20 PM
Scripture alone | UK  Find all comments by Scripture alone
Jeremiah 10:23-24 O LORD I know that the way of man is not in himself: it is not in man that walketh to direct his steps.
O LORD, correct me, but with judgment; not in thine anger, least thou bring me to nothing.

News Item7/24/14 1:33 PM
BibleSays...  Find all comments by BibleSays...
If God controls who were born to, what we look like, whether we are saved or not, then it stands to reason (and is supported by scripture) that God controls the things we do.

News Item7/24/14 1:29 PM
PursuitofTruth  Find all comments by PursuitofTruth
Yes General, kind of. We do not in and of ourselves control our actions. The only reason I'm typing right now is because God willed it. We are who we are, but everything we do is by God's willing it. However, God is not responsible for our sin.

News Item7/24/14 12:51 PM
General  Find all comments by General
First, God controls everything that we do.

So, I guess what your tryi g to say on other words is, we're not really who we think we are, that I'm not the one controlling me to type this comment, GODS doing it?

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