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RELIGION, CURRENT EVENTS, TECHNOLOGY Subscribe to the breaking newsWhat is RSS?
FRONT PAGE  |  10/2/2014
MONDAY, AUG 25, 2014  |  330 comments
Michael Brown confessed Jesus as his Saviour in weeks before his death, pastor says
The family of Michael Brown have revealed that in the weeks before his death, the slain teenager had a premonition about his killing, and accepted Jesus Christ as his Saviour.

Pastor Charles Ewing is Brown's uncle, and shared the intimate details with reporters on Tuesday.

Ewing told the Associated Press that his nephew accepted the Lord about two weeks before he was killed, and then had an eerie dream. Brown allegedly dreamt of a body covered by a white sheet, and told his family that the entire world would one day know his name. ...


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· Page 1 ·  Found: 330 user comment(s)
News Item10/2/14 12:01 AM
Lurker  Protected NameFind all comments by Lurker
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Never enough room.

OK, bro James. Don't let these counterpoints be a distraction to your presentation. I'd only ask we keep them open, as opposed to settled, and if we agree on the larger picture these points will most likely become clear at that time.

God bless, James. Looking forward to your next installment..... at your convenience, of course.

330

News Item10/1/14 9:40 PM
Lurker  Protected NameFind all comments by Lurker
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No hurry here either. Understanding and discussing the prophets has been my hearts burning desire since God called me.

"Your people - Who is this? All Israel."

To me, 'your people' refers to the Jews who were about to be redeemed from captivity but not the house of Israel. The reason I say that is because one of the 6 items which was revealed and would remain until the last day is 'seal up the vision and prophecy'. Of course, this assumes the vision and prophecy refers to the book of life which is opened at the 7th trump and at the great white throne judgment.

"To seal both vision and prophecy - 1 Peter 1:10-12"

I don't see the connection to the text. I believe the book of life is simply another of many figures of the covenant of grace aka Zion and all who dwell therein. (See Psalm 132:13-18). The Jews were confined in unbelief (Sinai Covenant, circumcision) when God turned His mercy to the Gentiles and were commanded to remain in the state of circumcision they were called in (1 Cor 7:17-24). Doesn't mean they are not in Christ... just not the covenant of grace. They are to remain in that state till the mystery of God is finished (Rev 10:7) when the veil is destroyed and death is swallowed up in victory (Is 25:7-8).

Neither point presents an impasse.

329

News Item10/1/14 4:50 PM
James Thomas | Florida  Find all comments by James Thomas
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Thank you Lurker....
In summation the big 6 are already accomplished to God but we are yet to "fully" realize them. Hence the already, not yet view for us in the present. For Him, It is finished.

Will check back in a few hours...

Blessings to you!

One other thing to consider...
Daniel was thinking on the seventy years of Babylon captivity.
So God introduces the seventy sevens or seventy time seven as to distinguish the difference between what he was asking and what God was revealing was that much more a greater work.

Kind of Like this....
Then Peter came up and said to him, “Lord, how often will my brother sin against me, and I forgive him? As many as seven times?” Jesus said to him, “I do not say to you seven times, but seventy-seven times.
(Matthew 18:21-22 ESV)

You asked for freedom from Babylon...
I give you a more glorious freedom from Satan.

328

News Item10/1/14 4:39 PM
Lurker  Protected NameFind all comments by Lurker
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Hello James, I just popped in for a few minutes but must be about again till this evening.

Quickly scanning your last post, I believe I'll have a few points which we will need to talk through before going much further.

I'll be back in a few hours. God bless.

327

News Item10/1/14 4:25 PM
James Thomas | Florida  Find all comments by James Thomas
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Lurker,
Thank you for your replies as they do assist me in knowing you are understanding me. I also appreciate the patience to work through this at a pace to be able to stop and work out thoughts if necessary. I am in no hurry to rush through as I am enjoying this quite a bit.

Looking at verse 24, there are 6 items that are listed beyond the two Daniel prayed about.
Your people - Who is this? All Israel.
Your city - Jerusalem

God reveals more...with the scope of view changed to the "big picture"

To finish the transgression - Man's transgression against God.
Started:
1 Timothy 2:14 and Adam was not deceived, but the woman was deceived and became a transgressor.
Ended “It is finished,” John 19:28-30

To put an end to sin -
But as it is, he has appeared once for all at the end of the ages to put away sin by the sacrifice of himself.
Heb 9:26

atone for iniquity - 2 Corinthians 5:21

to bring in righteousness-
romans 8:10(Already)
2 Peter 3:13 (Not Yet)

To seal both vision and prophecy -
1 Peter 1:10-12

To anoint a most Holy One -
Acts 4:27-28

Notice the 6 are all collateral actions from the single most important event that has ever taken place. The propitiation of sins.

Has this prophecy happened? Yes. Already but not yet.

326

News Item10/1/14 12:09 AM
Lurker  Protected NameFind all comments by Lurker
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James Thomas wrote:
verse 24-
Seventy sevens are decreed about your people and your holy city
He is answering Daniel about Verse 17 (make your face to shine upon your sanctuary, which is desolate.)
Your people - Daniel's people he was praying about....All Israel.
your holy city - Jerusalem
These Daniel was praying for specifically.
Then God reveals His purpose for eternity on what He is going to do.
to finish the transgressin -
to put an end to sin -
and to atone for iniquity -
to bring in everlasting righteousness-
to seal both vision and profit -
and to anoint a most Holy one. -
Will continue tomorrow Lord willing.
Good so far. Continuing tomorrow will be fine although I may not be able to interact post at a time. But continue anyway, as time permits, and I'll catch up if need be.

I should mention that Ezekiel 37-39 is a concurrent prophecy with the 70 weeks. I don't know if you've considered it but if not you may want to review the text noting that there is a gathering of all Israel, a period of relative peace, another scattering of Israel into captivity and finally the destruction of Gog and everlasting peace.

Good night, James. It's been a pleasure.

325

News Item9/30/14 11:41 PM
James Thomas | Florida  Find all comments by James Thomas
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verse 24-
Seventy sevens are decreed about your people and your holy city
He is answering Daniel about Verse 17 (make your face to shine upon your sanctuary, which is desolate.)
Your people - Daniel's people he was praying about....All Israel.
your holy city - Jerusalem
These Daniel was praying for specifically.

Then God reveals His purpose for eternity on what He is going to do.
to finish the transgressin -
to put an end to sin -
and to atone for iniquity -
to bring in everlasting righteousness-
to seal both vision and profit -
and to anoint a most Holy one. -

Will continue tomorrow Lord willing.

324

News Item9/30/14 11:34 PM
Lurker  Protected NameFind all comments by Lurker
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James Thomas wrote:
This is not Daniel speaking here. We are in effect standing by Daniel listening too, as we read these words.
No real objections have appeared as of yet into what you have presented from what I can see.
....24-27 next.
Agreed. Still with you.
323

News Item9/30/14 11:18 PM
James Thomas | Florida  Find all comments by James Thomas
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Verse 23-
At the beginning of your pleas for mercy - Daniel's prayer

a word went out - God Spoke and gave it to Gabriel

and I have come to tell it to you - Gabriel the messenger from God.

for you are greatly loved - WOW!

Therefore - ( a word that discerns the effect of what has just been said.....meaning "the cause" preceeds) consider the word and understand the vision.
Consider The word and the vision - The Seventy sevens or the Seventy weeks in which Gabriel is the speaker and Daniel is a listener.
He asks Daniel to consider the word.....not to decide on if he believes but to meditate on the truth about to be revealed to you.

We have a spiritual being "Gabriel" presenting a Holy decree from The Holy God who is Spirit to a human being who's spirit has been quickened but yet it must be explained to Daniel. Hence the verse 22 "He made me understand."

This must be put into our thinking before going to 24-27. This is not Daniel speaking here. We are in effect standing by Daniel listening too, as we read these words.

No real objections have appeared as of yet into what you have presented from what I can see.

....24-27 next.

322

News Item9/30/14 11:05 PM
Lurker  Protected NameFind all comments by Lurker
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You've summed up well God's mind through v23. And yes, Gabriel was sent to answer Daniel's prayers and more which he didn't appeal for.... a peak at what was in store for his people until the end of days.

Continue as time permits. I'm with you, brother.

321

News Item9/30/14 10:39 PM
James Thomas | Florida  Find all comments by James Thomas
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I have no problem being open minded...
Verse 3-19 Daniel goes to the Lord God in prayer and confession for the current situation that Israel is in. Daniel details the sin of Israel and the greatness of God and His righteous judgment.
Asks for mercy for The Lord God's own sake...not his own. Humbleness presented in a clear fashion.
Daniel is praying about what has happened and what is happening and why it has happened and simply asking for mercy.
This is a cresendo of humble prayer leading to the focal point of the object of what is the desire on his heart.
"Now therefore".....Daniels prayer being the presentation of facts of the current situation.....I will ask the following........."make your face to shine upon your sanctuary, which is desolate."

Verse 20-23 The Lord God answers Daniel through Gabriel.
Therefore consider the word and understand the vision. So Daniel is provided with what He has asked about......
........."make your face to shine upon your sanctuary, which is desolate."

....and possibly more? Can you hear God saying "You only asked for this much.....but im going to reveal to you what you did not ask......Like in the case of Solomon.
Please forgive the brevity on such a wonderful prayer that it in itself can be discussed at length.

320

News Item9/30/14 10:13 PM
Lurker  Protected NameFind all comments by Lurker
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James Thomas wrote:
Lurker,
I have followed your words and read the texts and have seen how the pattern fits. I can see the flaw of having simply a historical view of Scripture as well. In short, I see your view and would say it is one I could agree with.
Perfect, James. All I hope for is an open mind.
James Thomas wrote:
But please allow me to express some possible questions by going through Daniel 9.
So in trying to understand the verses in Daniel 9:24-27..im going to start at 9:1 with a focus on identifying what "we know" then work to what we don't. Please call me out on anything that you see differently.
Verse 1-2 Daniel speaks on reading Jeremiah and perceiving a time defined as seventy years before the end of the desolations of Jerusalem.
The subject being the end of the desolations. The time being 70 years. It happened with the end of captivity so this was not "The end" to desolations in all of eternity but in the current one.
So far so good?
verse 3-19 in next post.
Good so far. The desolations was specific to Jerusalem during the captivity and would end when captivity was led captive.
319

News Item9/30/14 9:55 PM
James Thomas | Florida  Find all comments by James Thomas
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Brothers,
I appreciate all of the comments the past few days. I really am thankful to you brothers for having the gifts that you all have and I have benefited greatly from reading your posts.
Lurker, when you said,
"Not everyone has the same convictions..." You summed it up well.

Lurker,
I have followed your words and read the texts and have seen how the pattern fits. I can see the flaw of having simply a historical view of Scripture as well. In short, I see your view and would say it is one I could agree with.

But please allow me to express some possible questions by going through Daniel 9.
So in trying to understand the verses in Daniel 9:24-27..im going to start at 9:1 with a focus on identifying what "we know" then work to what we don't. Please call me out on anything that you see differently.
Verse 1-2 Daniel speaks on reading Jeremiah and perceiving a time defined as seventy years before the end of the desolations of Jerusalem.
The subject being the end of the desolations. The time being 70 years. It happened with the end of captivity so this was not "The end" to desolations in all of eternity but in the current one.
So far so good?

verse 3-19 in next post.

318

News Item9/28/14 10:33 PM
Lurker  Protected NameFind all comments by Lurker
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Rodney K. wrote:
Unless you are still alive at our LORD's return. "Even so..."
Thank you all for this discussion. I haven't followed very closely because I have been waiting until yall were finished. God bless.
Thanks, Rodney. Welcome to the SA board.
317

News Item9/28/14 8:02 PM
Rodney K. | Tennessee  Contact via emailFind all comments by Rodney K.
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Lurker wrote:
...I suppose I'll go to my grave without ever fully quenching my thirst but God knows what He's doing.
God bless.
Unless you are still alive at our LORD's return. "Even so..."

Thank you all for this discussion. I haven't followed very closely because I have been waiting until yall were finished. God bless.

316

News Item9/28/14 7:03 PM
Lurker  Protected NameFind all comments by Lurker
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John UK wrote:
Bro, and fellow pilgrim,
I may not be able to take part in this discussion through lack of knowledge, but know that I read the interaction and hope to gain some edification from it. I just wanted to let you know that, lest you felt it was fruitless, and I guess some others will feel the same.
I appreciate you saying that, bro, and I understand. Not everyone has the same convictions in their service to God and I believe He ordained it to be so. Just like building a house requires many different disciplines, so does building God's house require many different passions and abilities.

It's interesting when God first set it my heart to read the bible, I started at the beginning like reading a book. After a while I became intrigued by the creation account phrase "evening and the morning" and did a phrase search which led me to....

Daniel 8:26 And the vision of the "evening and the morning" which was told is true: wherefore shut thou up the vision; for it shall be for many days.

From that moment on I was hooked. I had to understand the prophets and how they interlace with the Revelation and NT citations and events. I suppose I'll go to my grave without ever fully quenching my thirst but God knows what He's doing.

God bless.

315

News Item9/28/14 5:24 PM
John UK | Wales  Find all comments by John UK
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Lurker wrote:
Thanks John.
Bro, and fellow pilgrim,

I may not be able to take part in this discussion through lack of knowledge, but know that I read the interaction and hope to gain some edification from it. I just wanted to let you know that, lest you felt it was fruitless, and I guess some others will feel the same.

314

News Item9/28/14 2:41 PM
Lurker  Protected NameFind all comments by Lurker
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James Thomas wrote:
Lurker
On a little vacation now so my time is short for the next few days. Thank you for your response and I would see our Lord working through a design, not haphazardly. I desire to read the scriptures and think on what you have presented in the next few days.
Blessings to you
Enjoy your time off, James. I've set a lot on your plate to consider and it will take some time to absorb and no doubt you'll have questions, objections or criticisms. Let me know, I'll be here.

. . .

Thanks John.

313

News Item9/28/14 9:30 AM
John UK | Wales  Find all comments by John UK
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James Thomas wrote:
Lurker
On a little vacation now so my time is short for the next few days. Thank you for your response and I would see our Lord working through a design, not haphazardly. I desire to read the scriptures and think on what you have presented in the next few days.
Blessings to you
Thanks to both brothers for your exchange!

Have a nice break, James.

312

News Item9/28/14 12:11 AM
James Thomas  Find all comments by James Thomas
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Lurker

On a little vacation now so my time is short for the next few days. Thank you for your response and I would see our Lord working through a design, not haphazardly. I desire to read the scriptures and think on what you have presented in the next few days.
Blessings to you

311
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