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Zig Ziglar, known worldwide for his folksy and often anecdotal motivational talks on success through serving others, died Wednesday (Nov. 28) at a Plano, Texas, hospital of complications from pneumonia. He was 86.
Ziglar's deep, soothing Mississippi drawl and speeches and books often sprinkled with mentions of his Christian faith endeared him to millions. Ziglar was arguably the best-known motivational speaker of his day, having conducted hundreds of corporate seminars and given motivational speeches to hundreds of thousands of people over a 42-year speaking career.
An active Southern Baptist layman and a member at Prestonwood Baptist Church in the Dallas suburb of Plano, Ziglar served as first vice president of the Southern Baptist Convention in 1984-85 during Atlanta pastor Charles Stanley's tenure as SBC president....
Unprofitable Servant wrote: I will throw in my mite... http://www.sg-audiotreasures.org/am_hell.htm...
Unprofitable Servant thank you very much for your link The Future of Impenitent Sinners Albert N. Martin. What I found on that page, including several links on that page, is most helpful in regard to somethings I have been considering doing.
I will have to see if I can make some auto starting CD's before Christmas. If not, there is always after Christmas if I am still on this planet:
James 4:14 KJV
Whereas ye know not what shall be on the morrow. For what is your life? It is even a vapour, that appeareth for a little time, and then vanisheth away.
I will throw in my mite. There is an excellent series of sermons on hell preached by one of the great expository preachers of our time, Albert N Martin. Although he has over 1,000 sermons on this site, alas his series can be found at another.
http://www.sg-audiotreasures.org/am_hell.htm
One of the things he pointed out was our Lord spoke of hell as a place where the worm died not and the fire is not quenched. The Jews in His day would have clearly understood what analogy He was making. In the local dump (Gehenna) they would also throw the dead bodies of the poor (they couldn't afford a burial) Their bodies would remain until consumed by fire or eaten of worms. When the body was consumed the worm died or the fire went out. Hell was thus pictured as eternal, because it was where the worm died not and the fire was not quenched.
Christopher000 wrote: Hi Mike, isn't it "death and Hades are cast into Hell", with Hades being the current holding place for all those destined for eternal damnation? forever...without ceasing. --- The vibe I'm getting is that I'm wrong and nobody really believes that Hell is a literal place, originally created for the devil and his angels, and that the lost won't suffer there forever. Aside from that, I do believe that God's light won't be present in Hell, but I don't believe that it will be total darkness as a result because a pit of brimstone and fire would burn brightly. Do you all believe that Hell is simply seperation from God, being in darkness, and being lonely forever?
As far as I know, no version says "cast into hell" in Rev. 20:14. They say cast into the lake of fire. Hell gets cast into the lake as well, per the verse. Hell here means the grave(hades)
The darkness thing? God is the source of all light, physical and spiritual. "the blackness of darkness for ever" (Jude 1:13) seems descriptive enough, and anything more in terms of what can be seen, seems speculative. imo, we can no more understand the details of eternal damnation, than we can understand the details of eternal life. "eternal," we understand.
Christopher000 wrote: ... I'm not trying to be flippant or anything but for some reason, everyone seems really uncomfortable about discussing Hell. Maybe the lost are so comfortable because a literal Hell has been comprimised in the pulpit and replaced with a state of mind where the Bible has been taken too literally?
Christopher you raise some very important points, concerning the effect of modern ecumenism and the widespread use of the modern Bibles.
Men like the evangelical John Stott who eventually drew away from his initial and orthodox belief in a literal and eternal hell where men are punished for their sins. It is always tempting to believe in annihilation, where death means the cessation of existence and an end of consciousness. However...
Revelation 21:8 KJV 8 But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.
How can death mean "end" if there is a "second death".
God's judgment is just and in accord with the crime, and hell is a place with no joy, no peace, no love, and no hope. And it is for ever.
... I'm not trying to be flippant or anything but for some reason, everyone seems really uncomfortable about discussing Hell. Maybe the lost are so comfortable because a literal Hell has been comprimised in the pulpit and replaced with a state of mind where the Bible has been taken too literally?
Hi Mike, isn't it "death and Hades are cast into Hell", with Hades being the current holding place for all those destined for eternal damnation? I don't want to start any arguments here but I just don't understand why everyone shys away from the topic of Hell and the suffering there that the Bible clearly describes. Weeping and knashing of teeth, where the worm dieth not, where the smoke rises forever, where they are in torments, etc, etc, etc. I don't get it. The Bible clearly states that it is a literal place of eternal punishment and also provides some description of what the lost will suffer forever...without ceasing. The vibe I'm getting is that I'm wrong and nobody really believes that Hell is a literal place, originally created for the devil and his angels, and that the lost won't suffer there forever. Aside from that, I can't figure out why everyone ignores me when I bring up the subject. I do believe that God's light won't be present in Hell, but I don't believe that it will be total darkness as a result because a pit of brimstone and fire would burn brightly. Do you all believe that Hell is simply seperation from God, being in darkness, and being lonely forever? I'm not trying to be flippant or anything but for some reason, everyone seems really uncomfortable a
John UK wrote: Thanks for the spanner in the works bro! Let me rephrase: What is it like to suffer in "the lake of fire", and that, for eternity? Thank you.
I don't think it seemly to speculate about certain aspects of tortures, John. But I can say this:
1 John 1:5 "This then is the message which we have heard of him, and declare unto you, that God is light, and in him is no darkness at all."
Jude 1:13 "Raging waves of the sea, foaming out their own shame; wandering stars, to whom is reserved the blackness of darkness for ever."
Since God won't be there, there won't be any light there, it will be utter emptiness and blackness. Those who mockingly say they want to be where their friends are, are foolish, for they will not party with friends, but will be utterly alone in the dark. Not sure it could get any worse, but I don't know, and won't insist these thoughts must be so.
Mike wrote: No nibbles, bro? Ok, here goes: Revelation 20:13,14 "And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works. And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death." Here we have hell before judgment in one verse, and hell cast into the lake of fire in the other. Seems like it messes up traditional understanding of hell as the place of eternal punishment.
Thanks for the spanner in the works bro!
Let me rephrase: What is it like to suffer in "the lake of fire", and that, for eternity?
John UK wrote: --- Tell you what, why don't other folks post their thoughts on what it means to "suffer in hell fire", and that for eternity? That should be a rewarding study, and may even be a catalyst for reviving our lethargic hearts.
No nibbles, bro? Ok, here goes:
Revelation 20:13,14 "And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.
And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death."
Here we have hell before judgment in one verse, and hell cast into the lake of fire in the other. Seems like it messes up traditional understanding of hell as the place of eternal punishment.
Part of the reason I was reminded if it is because the couple of times I've kind of steered in the same direction in my posts, the thread seemed to go dead or my comments were passed over.
Christopher000 wrote: 1. Good morning, Kaptain Kippur, um, I mean John/UK...do you remember when I first came on, in reply to a news headline, I was describing someone destined for Hell, and using descriptors such as, screaming for all eternity, writhing in pain forever, etc, etc? 2. You replied that it wasn't right for me to be describing Hell like that. 3. Do you remember that? 4. Well, I never went back to that thread and am just wondering now why it was wrong for me to describe the horror that I think one would experience in Hell. 5. Just looking for some instruction because I remember not understanding because I thought I was describing it like it would really be.
1. Kipper he say, "I remember." 2. Correct. 3. Yes I remember it well. 4. There is nothing wrong with describing the horror which sinners experience in hell. 5. I think you have it wrong, because scripture does not teach that.
Tell you what, why don't other folks post their thoughts on what it means to "suffer in hell fire", and that for eternity? That should be a rewarding study, and may even be a catalyst for reviving our lethargic hearts.
Good morning, Kaptain Kippur, um, I mean John/UK...do you remember when I first came on, in reply to a news headline, I was describing someone destined for Hell, and using descriptors such as, screaming for all eternity, writhing in pain forever, etc, etc? You replied that it wasn't right for me to be describing Hell like that. Do you remember that? Well, I never went back to that thread and am just wondering now why it was wrong for me to describe the horror that I think one would experience in Hell.
Just looking for some instruction because I remember not understanding because I thought I was describing it like it would really be.
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Craig Musselman | 7/6/2009
COMMENTS | 
thank you very much for your link 
frank: "musings!
scripture teaches that in god’s mind i was chosen and saved..."
