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Breaking News Home | All | Religion | Society | Tech | Choice | SA News
FRONT PAGE  |  2/11/2016
MONDAY, SEP 17, 2012  |  14 comments
Chinese multiplication

For each of the past 20 years, Freddie Sun and his wife Dorothy have traveled more than 25,000 miles within China to help start and support 155 Bible schools in every province. On Aug. 22, Sun, 76, director of the China Division of Christian Aid Mission, died of brain tumors.

Through Sun's work, Bible school graduates are leading thousands of house churches in China. Those churches, most unregistered with China's communist government, face varying degrees of persecution: In some provinces government officials turn a blind eye to them, while in others they crack down, detaining pastors and confiscating property. Leaders can disappear in prison or "re-education through labor" camps.

And as the house church movement - and the size of house churches - has grown, so has enforcement. Earlier this year, authorities ordered closed a 1,500-member house church in Sichuan province. In the past month, ...


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How to serve God in China?
  START  
  Recommended sermons | more..
•  How to serve God in China?Larry Pan | 7/4/2009
•  China House Church MovementE. A. Johnston | 10/6/2012

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· Page 1 ·  Found: 14 user comment(s)
News Item9/20/12 7:45 PM
Mike | New York  Find all comments by Mike
planned justification wrote:
Jesus didn't say he "has a wonderful plan" for your life. He did say to follow him with a large, rugged cross, though. The "wonderful plan" is to haul that monster up the hill just like he did. The grace is his alone, enabling you to do it. His plan. His grace. Not yours.
It sounds most like you may have a problem with the word "wonderful." Not comfortable with it? Pick another more to your liking. Is God's plan for your life poor, fair, good, excellent? I like wonderful, as surely it is just that. But feel free to use another descriptive of his plan. His plan. His grace. Not yours.
14

News Item9/19/12 7:14 PM
jpw  Find all comments by jpw
Mike of New York--

my guess, seeing the trend of the state church in China v the homechurch.

and same patterns sort of forming now.

is that:

Christians probably turned in other Christians for not following the state.

And others probably denied their faith out of shock, fear, and confusion and regretted it.

Perhaps they felt they could have protected each other better if they had a network or community to help one another such as we see with Corrie helping Jewish people.

Some of the hardest people to deal with are those both filled with denial and fear and falsely apply scripture to remain there-- the church becomes a stumbling block at that point.

How could they pray for one another in persecution while teaching that it wouldn't occur and hiding from this reality?

Denial neuters the Christian.

13

News Item9/19/12 7:07 PM
planned justification  Find all comments by planned justification
Mike wrote:
Evening, bro.
If he doesn't have a plan for your life, then it must be up to you. Sounds like the will plays a part to me. Where then sovereignty as defined by those who say it doesn't? I've heard it said whatever we do is ordained of him. If that isn't a plan for you coming together, what is? If he doesn't have a plan for your life, what then of election, which is a plan for your life from eternity past? I only ask these because of the contradiction between the denial of God having a plan for your life, and Gods plans for your life.
Jesus didn't say he "has a wonderful plan" for your life. He did say to follow him with a large, rugged cross, though. The "wonderful plan" is to haul that monster up the hill just like he did. The grace is his alone, enabling you to do it. His plan. His grace. Not yours.
12

News Item9/19/12 6:28 PM
Mike | New York  Find all comments by Mike
John UK wrote:
It's a good point, and the former is clearly a false gospel. It's doing the rounds through false teaching like The Alpha Course and, as you said, many modern "evangelists". No wonder there is so little commitment to the cause of Christ nowadays.
Evening, bro.
If he doesn't have a plan for your life, then it must be up to you. Sounds like the will plays a part to me. Where then sovereignty as defined by those who say it doesn't? I've heard it said whatever we do is ordained of him. If that isn't a plan for you coming together, what is? If he doesn't have a plan for your life, what then of election, which is a plan for your life from eternity past? I only ask these because of the contradiction between the denial of God having a plan for your life, and Gods plans for your life.
11

News Item9/19/12 6:01 PM
John UK | Wales  Find all comments by John UK
baffle with bs wrote:
The modern evangelist frequently shares that "God loves you and has a wonderful plan for your life" whereas Jesus said that we are to "take up our cross and follow Me [Him]."
Wonder if these vastly different levels of, putting it very crassly, "buy-in" would have a profoundly different impact on an individual who later encounters massive trails and tribulation.
It's a good point, and the former is clearly a false gospel. It's doing the rounds through false teaching like The Alpha Course and, as you said, many modern "evangelists". No wonder there is so little commitment to the cause of Christ nowadays.
10

News Item9/19/12 5:47 PM
baffle with bs  Find all comments by baffle with bs
The modern evangelist frequently shares that "God loves you and has a wonderful plan for your life" whereas Jesus said that we are to "take up our cross and follow Me [Him]."

Wonder if these vastly different levels of, putting it very crassly, "buy-in" would have a profoundly different impact on an individual who later encounters massive trials and tribulation.

9

News Item9/19/12 5:10 PM
Mike | New York  Find all comments by Mike
jpw wrote:
"In China the Christians were told, 'Don't worry, before the tribulation comes you will be translated - raptured.' Then came a terrible persecution. Millions of Christians were tortured to death. Later I heard a Bishop from China say, sadly, 'We have failed. We should have made the people strong for persecution, rather than telling them Jesus would come first. Tell the people how to be strong in times of persecution, how to stand when the tribulation comes, - to stand and not faint.'"
-Corrie ten Boom
http://endtimepilgrim.org/corrie.htm
I would have like to have been able to ask that bishop this:

The Chinese Christians, not having been made strong for persecution, were tortured and killed. How would the outcome have differed had they been made strong for persecution?

8

News Item9/19/12 7:43 AM
KJV English speaking Onlyist  Find all comments by KJV English speaking Onlyist
Waynp if you had read the comment you would of saw a word that said "hard". In other word I meant whole-shale persecution of the church, not the small shale persecution. Real small shale persecution does started some revival, but only in the area.
7

News Item9/18/12 8:01 PM
jpw  Find all comments by jpw
"In China the Christians were told, 'Don't worry, before the tribulation comes you will be translated - raptured.' Then came a terrible persecution. Millions of Christians were tortured to death. Later I heard a Bishop from China say, sadly, 'We have failed. We should have made the people strong for persecution, rather than telling them Jesus would come first. Tell the people how to be strong in times of persecution, how to stand when the tribulation comes, - to stand and not faint.'"

-Corrie ten Boom

http://endtimepilgrim.org/corrie.htm

6

News Item9/18/12 3:04 PM
Jim Lincoln | Nebraska  Find all comments by Jim Lincoln
Nonsense, jpw, there were many Presbyterian and nominal Christians such as those of the Romish Church that were missionaries in China, and they most assuredly don't hold a correct view on the ESCHATOLOGY--Different Rapture Views. The The Unscriptural Theologies Of Amillennialism And Postmillennialism should be obvious. There is nothing in Why God's Purpose for the Tribulation excludes the Church--Thomas Ice, says the church won't suffer before the Rapture.

I would suggest if nothing else read the summary to the sermon, How the Church Relates to the Kingdom, but even better listen to the sermon itself.

5

News Item9/18/12 2:56 PM
Waynp  Find all comments by Waynp
KJV English speaking Onlyist wrote:
Is it strange that daily the Chinese churches is growing, and the churches in the West are dieing?
Maybe we need some hard persecution.
Why are you not persecuted?

Matt 5:10 Blessed are they which are persecuted for righteousness' sake: for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.
11 Blessed are ye, when men shall revile you, and persecute you, and shall say all manner of evil against you falsely, for my sake.
12 Rejoice, and be exceeding glad: for great is your reward in heaven: for so persecuted they the prophets which were before you.

4

News Item9/18/12 2:26 PM
jpw  Find all comments by jpw
they say that the Chinese Christians were taught rapture theology and so were not prepared to deal with the communist wave.

("Jesus will rapture me out before I will see tribulation" or a non charismatic form of the prosperity gospel)

I hardly see any difference with us.

Christ shines through the persecuted, as hard as that is to say.

And just as the state churches of China would turn in true brethren for meeting freely in a home, so I tend to think those who will go along with evil, may in the long run keep their big churches, and find those who worship Christ freely to be an offense.

The purpose driven churches have given me a slight taste of this. I have seen the elderly and the wise castigated from their churches because they stopped the progress of their coorporate agenda. This reflects much to the days we are in and what form of society we actually have, much more than our civics textbooks in jr high ever taught.

3

News Item9/18/12 7:36 AM
KJV English speaking Onlyist  Find all comments by KJV English speaking Onlyist
Is it strange that daily the Chinese churches is growing, and the churches in the West are dieing?
Maybe we need some hard persecution.
2

News Item9/17/12 3:00 PM
Word of God  Find all comments by Word of God
John 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

JOHN 3:1 有 一 个 法 利 赛 人 , 名 叫 尼 哥 底 母 , 是 犹 太 人 的 官 。
3:2 这 人 夜 里 来 见 耶 稣 , 说 , 拉 比 , 我 们 知 道 你 是 由 神 那 里 来 作 师 傅 的 。 因 为 你 所 行 的 神 迹 , 若 没 有 神 同 在 , 无 人 能 行 。
3:3 耶 稣 回 答 说 , 我 实 实 在 在 地 告 诉 你 , 人 若 不 重 生 , 就 不 能 见 神 的 国 。

3 Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.

3:4 尼 哥 底 母 #

1
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