Pope Benedict XVI convened a special meeting of cardinals Saturday for advice on how to deal with the Vatican's leaked documents scandal - another sign of the damage the leaks have done to trust in the Holy See's governance.
Benedict was already scheduled to attend a regular meeting of the heads of Vatican offices Saturday morning. The Vatican press office said he added a second meeting later in the day with other cardinals in a bid to try to "restore a climate of serenity and trust" in the church.
The Vatican said over the coming days he will meet with still more cardinals gathering in Rome for a church feast day on Friday to "continue the dialogue with the people who share the responsibility of the church's governance with him."...
John Yurich USA wrote: No I have never owned a pet parrot. Why?
Good morning John. I just wondered if you had been influenced by a parrot close at hand. Parrots are notorious for repeating exactly the same thing over and over again, sometimes for years and years. That's all.
Proving ground wrote: You sound like a Roman Catholic theologian. Salvation is a function of works. What is your training?
Proving Ground I don't think you read my post(s) to JY closely enough. So let me 'dialogue' a bit with you.
What does Jesus Christ save people from? and what does He save them to?
That's it from their sins and the fallen nature that loves sin and hates obedience to God's authority.
He does this in the new birth, in regeneration (something that does NOT happen when RCs sprinkle babies either), God writing on our hearts and minds His law, pouring out His love in our hearts by the Holy Spirit (btw This is the love of God that we keep His commandments ) God Himself working in the life of His redeemed both to will and to act according to His good purpose, NOT giving them a license to sin and live lawlessly against Him.
Please do understand Salvation is far more than Forgiveness and going into literal Holy Presence of God when we die, it is a changed life, a life changed by God and for God, a life in which God Himself dwells and obedience is NOT a matter of earning or meriting eternal life, but a matter of JOY in those who know forgiveness of sin and new birth
Michael Hranek wrote: No! John, you've gotten it quite wrong (again) I believe Salvation has much to do with obedience to Jesus Christ, and that eternal damnation has much to do with willful unrepentant disobedience to Him. Scripture tells me "fools" (nabals, those in wicked rebellion against God and His authority, if I remember the word correctly) hate wisdom and instruction.
You sound like a Roman Catholic theologian. Salvation is a function of works. What is your training?
John Yurich USA wrote: The Bible nowhere states that church membership in any church and that includes Evangelical/Fundamentalist Protestant Churches has anything to do with salvation. But you seem to believe that church membership in an Evangelical/Fundamentalist Protestant Church is required for salvation because you keep stating that when one becomes Born Again that they have to leave the Catholic Church, Eastern Orthodox Church and Mainline Protestant Churches and unite with an Evangelical/Fundamentalist Protestant Church or else they are not really saved. I do not have my own religion like you seem to imply.
No! John, you've gotten it quite wrong (again) I believe Salvation has much to do with obedience to Jesus Christ,
and that eternal damnation has much to do with willful unrepentant disobedience to Him.
Scripture tells me "fools" (nabals, those in wicked rebellion against God and His authority, if I remember the word correctly) hate wisdom and instruction.
John Yurich USA wrote: It is still a fact that church membership in any church and that includes Evangelical/Fundamentalist Protestant Churches is not required for salvation as nowhere in the Bible is church membership mentioned as being required for salvation.
Dr. Mengle wrote: As many are aware I am a devout Roman Catholic. My Roman Catholic credentials are outstanding. John Yurich USA why don't you come on over to this thread and we can testify together of glories of the Roman Catholic Church? World's 1st GM babies born--Are you coming John? Your friend Dr. Mengle
Mengele was evil. I doubt that Mengele attended Mass regularly while engaging in homicidal activities. It is still a fact that church membership in any church and that includes Evangelical/Fundamentalist Protestant Churches is not required for salvation as nowhere in the Bible is church membership mentioned as being required for salvation.
Wikipedia wrote: Power tends to corrupt, and absolute power corrupts absolutely.
This is commonly referred to as Lord Acton's dictum. But it is the third phrase in this quote that might be the most important, if little-known:
Great men are almost always bad men.
Most people who quote Lord Acton's Dictum are unaware that it refers to Papal power and was made by a Catholic, albeit not an unquestioning one.
from, Lord Acton it's more rational to take John Y.'s views, he's trying to cover all his bets, but not of course he'll loose everything, Is the One True Church Roman Catholic? So, like we have at many times invited John to become a Christian we would also invite you to try out a good Christian Church one viewpoint being, What to Look for in a Church.
John Yurich USA wrote: But as important as attending church is it is still not required for salvation. The only thing that is required for salvation is that one embrace Jesus as ones Personal Lord and Savior according to the Bible.
As many are aware I am a devout Roman Catholic. My Roman Catholic credentials are outstanding. John Yurich USA why don't you come on over to this thread and we can testify together of glories of the Roman Catholic Church?
Sofa Church rocks wrote: *Don't forget to include millions in sofa and internet churches of every description throughout the world. Does one now need to leave his sofa or computer chair (house) church and join a free-standing brick-and-mortar Evangelical/Fundamentalist Protestant Church to be saved? What verse requires this?
Attending and belonging to a church in a free-standing brick-and-mortar is important because the Bible states do not forsake assembling together for worship. But as important as attending church is it is still not required for salvation. The only thing that is required for salvation is that one embrace Jesus as ones Personal Lord and Savior according to the Bible.
John Yurich USA wrote: The Bible nowhere states that church membership in any church and that includes Evangelical/Fundamentalist Protestant Churches has anything to do with salvation. But you seem to believe that church membership in an Evangelical/Fundamentalist Protestant Church is required for salvation because you keep stating that when one becomes Born Again that they have to leave the Catholic Church, Eastern Orthodox Church and Mainline Protestant Churches* and unite with an Evangelical/Fundamentalist Protestant Church or else they are not really saved. I do not have my own religion like you seem to imply.
*Don't forget to include millions in sofa and internet churches of every description throughout the world. Does one now need to leave his sofa or computer chair (house) church and join a free-standing brick-and-mortar Evangelical/Fundamentalist Protestant Church to be saved?
Michael Hranek wrote: Ahhhhhh John, But isn't that the point, for years you have told us how you have absolutely NOT embraced Jesus Christ as Lord of your life, refusing obedience to His word, telling us how in your "religion" you are the one who reigns and is in charge, even denigrating OBEDIENCE TO CHRIST in this case what church you attend or not as somehow "totally superfluous". But hey if your version of 'the sinner's prayer' has made you sovereign over the revealed will of God in His word, the Bible, that has got to be some humdinger of an non-denominational religious incantation.
The Bible nowhere states that church membership in any church and that includes Evangelical/Fundamentalist Protestant Churches has anything to do with salvation. But you seem to believe that church membership in an Evangelical/Fundamentalist Protestant Church is required for salvation because you keep stating that when one becomes Born Again that they have to leave the Catholic Church, Eastern Orthodox Church and Mainline Protestant Churches and unite with an Evangelical/Fundamentalist Protestant Church or else they are not really saved. I do not have my own religion like you seem to imply.
John Yurich USA wrote: Either what the Bible states about the only requirement for salvation being that one embraces Jesus as their Lord and Savior is true or it is not true.
Ahhhhhh John, But isn't that the point, for years you have told us how you have absolutely NOT embraced Jesus Christ as Lord of your life, refusing obedience to His word, telling us how in your "religion" you are the one who reigns and is in charge, even denigrating OBEDIENCE TO CHRIST in this case what church you attend or not as somehow "totally superfluous".
But hey if your version of 'the sinner's prayer' has made you sovereign over the revealed will of God in His word, the Bible, that has got to be some humdinger of an non-denominational religious incantation.
Michael Hranek wrote: John Yurich, The evidence of being born again of the Holy Spirit is the obedience of faith, a life that is holy (faithful and loyal to Christ). This you cannot claim because you have made yourself the master, the one who calls the shots in your life, not the Lord Jesus Christ who died for your sins. Please do know this, one cannot rightfully say they are saved from the eternal punishment of hell, until they are first saved by God and for God from their sins, from their rebellion against is rightful authority in every part of our lives. But hey if a words of a sinner's prayer are a magic formual to give you license for sin go for it.
Either what the Bible states about the only requirement for salvation being that one embraces Jesus as their Lord and Savior is true or it is not true. If it is true then church membership in any church and that includes Evangelical Protestant Churches is totally supefluous then if someone who is Born Again attends the Catholic Church, Eastern Orthodox Church or Mainlline Protestant Churches instead of an Evangelical Protestant Church then they will enter Heaven when they pass away. But you believe that church membership in Evangelical Protestant Church is required for salvation.
John Yurich USA wrote: Just who do you think you are to state that I am not Born Again just because I have not united with an Evangelical Protestant Church? Church membership is totally superfluous to salvation. And when everybody stands before Jesus after they pass away He will not look at the church that someone attended to determine who will enter Heaven. He will only look at if they had embraced Him as their Personal Lord and Savior.
John my dear friend, I think you are the poster boy for this truth:
2 peter 1:10 KJV And if the righteous scarcely be saved, where shall the ungodly and the sinner appear?
John Yurich USA wrote: What do you mean it is just words that I accept the Evangelical Protestant doctrine that salvation comes only through embracing Jesus as ones Personal Lord and Savior? Just who do you think you are to state that I am not Born Again just because I have not united with an Evangelical Protestant Church? Church membership is totally superfluous to salvation. And when everybody stands before Jesus after they pass away He will not look at the church that someone attended to determine who will enter Heaven. He will only look at if they had embraced Him as their Personal Lord and Savior.
John Yurich, The evidence of being born again of the Holy Spirit is the obedience of faith, a life that is holy (faithful and loyal to Christ).
This you cannot claim because you have made yourself the master, the one who calls the shots in your life, not the Lord Jesus Christ who died for your sins.
Please do know this, one cannot rightfully say they are saved from the eternal punishment of hell, until they are first saved by God and for God from their sins, from their rebellion against is rightful authority in every part of our lives.
But hey if a words of a sinner's prayer are a magic formual to give you license for sin go for it.
Michael Hranek wrote: John Yurich, Words, just words.
What do you mean it is just words that I accept the Evangelical Protestant doctrine that salvation comes only through embracing Jesus as ones Personal Lord and Savior? Just who do you think you are to state that I am not Born Again just because I have not united with an Evangelical Protestant Church? Church membership is totally superfluous to salvation. And when everybody stands before Jesus after they pass away He will not look at the church that someone attended to determine who will enter Heaven. He will only look at if they had embraced Him as their Personal Lord and Savior.
John Yurich USA wrote: I accept the Evangelical Protestant doctrine that salvation comes only through embracing Jesus as ones Personal Lord and Savior. I also accept the Lutheran doctrine of Holy Communion. I am not supporting idolatry since I do not bow down to or pray to Crucifixes, pictures and statues of Jesus, the Virgin Mary and the Saints. And I do not pray to the Virgin Mary and the Saints.
Just because I have not left the Catholic Church
and have not united with an Evangelical Protestant Church does not mean that I am not saved. Nowhere in the Bible is church membership in any church mentioned as a requirement for salvation. When everybody stands before Jesus He will not look at the church that one attended. He will only look at if one had embraced Him as their Personal Lord and Savior who will enter Heaven.
Yardstick wrote: JY In the 16th century there was a group called the Nicodemites, who were people who pretended to accept the doctrines of the Reformation - But continued to attend the antichrist Roman catholic church. It seems John, you are a Nicodemite. "The Nicodemites viewed idolatry less seriously than Calvin did. "Look at all the social ills — violence, sexual immorality, drunkenness and the like. Remember John that you are supporting idolatry.
I accept the Evangelical Protestant doctrine that salvation comes only through embracing Jesus as ones Personal Lord and Savior. I also accept the Lutheran doctrine of Holy Communion. I am not supporting idolatry since I do not bow down to or pray to Crucifixes, pictures and statues of Jesus, the Virgin Mary and the Saints. And I do not pray to the Virgin Mary and the Saints. Just because I have not left the Catholic Church and have not united with an Evangelical Protestant Church does not mean that I am not saved. Nowhere in the Bible is church membership in any church mentioned as a requirement for salvation. When everybody stands before Jesus He will not look at the church that one attended. He will only look at if one had embraced Him as their Personal Lord and Savior who will enter Heaven.
JY In the 16th century there was a group called the Nicodemites, who were people who pretended to accept the doctrines of the Reformation - But continued to attend the antichrist Roman catholic church.
It seems John, you are a Nicodemite.
"The Nicodemites viewed idolatry less seriously than Calvin did. "Look at all the social ills — violence, sexual immorality, drunkenness and the like. What is idolatry in comparison to these things?", they said. Calvin responds:
If one were to pass over them [other sins] lightly, in order to amuse oneself with this one sin of outward idolatry, this would be a bad way to do things. If I were to spare the whoremongers, drunkards, thieves and deceivers, liars and others; were I to pardon avarice, cover over rapine, pomp and pride, being utterly addicted to reprove this one vice of which I am presently speaking, that would be doing badly on my part. And then one might rightly reprove my poor judgment, as if I were leaving many wounds hidden in order to treat one. However, since that is not the case, who will hinder me from reproving each vice in its turn, not neglecting any of them? (p. 80). (John Calvin)
Remember John that you are supporting idolatry.
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Dr. Alan Cairns | 8/3/2009
COMMENTS | 
I don't think you read my post(s) to JY closely enough. So let me 'dialogue' a bit with you.
That's it from their sins and the fallen nature that loves sin and hates obedience to God's authority.
) God Himself working in the life of His redeemed both to will and to act according to His good purpose, NOT giving them a license to sin and live lawlessly against Him. 
john uk from wales: "
frank
juicing carrots! yuk.
this forum is somewhat..."
