Sinner's Prayer Can Lead to Salvation, Say Southern Baptist Traditionalists
How did you become saved? Did you admit you were a sinner, repent of your sins, believe Jesus Christ died for your sins, and call on the Lord and pray to accept Jesus into your life?
The recent decision by delegates to the Southern Baptist Convention to affirm the use of the "sinner's prayer" â known as a prayer of repentance and "inviting Jesus into your heart" â has undermined Calvinism in the denomination and placed a renewed emphasis on traditional Baptist soteriology: if you repent, call on the Lord and believe in Christ for mercy, you are saved....
For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing: for to will is present with me; but [how] to perform that which is good I find not.
That is Paul the Apostle I quoted. Do you think it is any different for you if you are saved and born again?
Since that evil thing dwells in the saved and born again you don't seriously believe that evil thing is not inside the unsaved or is any better do you?
________________________________________ In response to my telling John
1. Yes I do consider you a "dear old thing".
John responded Well done, that man.
John my dear brother, you don't miss much, if anything. No doubt you have noticed my email contact. So far the high light at my new email address consists of a Nigerian fraud artist trying to scam me.
I would prefer better email than that. So, if you care to and can, please contact me and provide an email address in return. Doing so provides us with the opportunity to contact each other when we want.
At the moment I am only extending the invitation to you, which doesn't mean I not interested in extending it to others but my work load is heavy at the moment and I simply don't have the time to handle a lot of email presently at plural email addresses.
1. Dopey you are a Demon - He/She calls me a Demon
2. IN THE NAME OF THE LORD JESUS CHRIST YOU ARE COMMANDED TO LEAVE THAT BODY! NOW! NEVER TO ENTER AGAIN! GO TO WHERE JESUS SENDS YOU! GO! - He/She attempts to perform an exorcism on me considering me possessed by an evil spirit. I have an evil spirit in me alright but he/she fails to mention that so does he/she and every one of my readers.
My defense attorney's (God Almighty's) rebuttal
1 Corinthians 10:32 KJV
Give none offence, neither to the Jews, nor to the Gentiles, nor to the church of God:
2a. Jeremiah 17:9 KJV
The heart [is] deceitful above all [things], and desperately wicked: who can know it?
The heart described in Jeremiah is in every person on earth saved and unsaved.
Dopey wrote: 1. Yes I do consider you a "dear old thing".
Well done, that man.
I picked up the expression many years ago, when I used to listen to the Test Match cricket on the radio, and one of the commentators was vaguely Christian and spoke very Queen's English, and often referred to people as "my dear old thing". His name was Henry Blofelt, a great character. So I was referring to you, and the Eh? referred to what you had posted.
And now you refuse to answer my question.
I looked at your texts in context and it didn't flow, man.
Now I'm sorry if you've been spending a lot of time reading books and listening to sermons spelling out all this, this, this....rather oddball belief structure, but I think you will need to analyse it more carefully.
If the Lord is coming back for his saints, they can't really have been raptured before the great tribulation, can they?
Maybe you'd better get building that large underground nuclear shelter, after all.
John UK wrote: My dear old thing. Eh? Matthew 24:29-31 KJV 29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:... 30 31 This is a sincere question, and I am always willing to learn. As you say, the answers are all in scripture, and the Holy Ghost can make them known unto us, as he wills.
1. Yes I do consider you a "dear old thing".
If you don't consider me the same way now is the time to declare it so that our readers won't be guessing as to what is going on between us.
John 21:25 KJV
And there are also many other things which Jesus did, the which, if they should be written every one, I suppose that even the world itself could not contain the books that should be written. Amen.
There is such a thing as a "Holy Spirit" supposition as John 21:25 plainly reveals. I made one myself in what you quote from me. One about you, I referred to you specifically. Did I suppose wrong (in which case it is still a Holy Spirit supposition). Did I suppose right? John now is the time for you to declare it. Do you know the Rapture is before the "great tribulation" or are you not sure?
Dopey wrote: No john, I won't be here for any nuclear war in the "great tribulation" of Matthew 24:21-24 KJV or you or many others who read these comments because God Almighty revealed it to us.
My dear old thing. Eh?
Matthew 24:29-31 KJV 29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken: 30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. 31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.
Why would the Lord be coming in the clouds unto the earth to gather together God's elect, if they were already with him because raptured before the tribulation?
This is a sincere question, and I am always willing to learn. As you say, the answers are all in scripture, and the Holy Ghost can make them known unto us, as he wills.
And he said, Unto you it is given to know the mysteries of the kingdom of God: but to others in parables; that seeing they might not see, and hearing they might not understand.
It is obvious to those with eyes to see and ears to hear that both the Book of Revelation and Luke 8:4-9 involve symbolism. Luke 8:10 reveals why that is so.
God wants to reveal to those that follow him closely "the mysteries of the kingdom of God" but to certain others who don't follow him closely, the jpw types, he wants to make sure through the symbolism that "they might not see" and "hearing they might not hear".
(Dont faint jpw or jpw types. God is quite willing to get you off the hook under certain conditions set forth by God in Scripture!!!)
P.S. dear reader
My dear brother John wrote to me:
"You're not building a nuclear shelter? "
No john, I won't be here for any nuclear war in the "great tribulation" of Matthew 24:21-24 KJV or you or many others who read these comments because God Almighty revealed it to us.
Dopey wrote: Dear readers, did you ever wonder why people like jpw and others like jpw end up making a fool of themselves when it comes to explaining Scripture, especially prophetic parts of Scripture? The answer is plainly revealed in Scripture and I expect to shortly explain to you the reason, Lord willing. In the meantime I have more important things to do.
Dopey wrote: And as I have said several times recently in this thread as least two billion people will die in a short period of time during the "great tribulation" which is Satan's final and greatest attempt in the history of the world to destroy all jews on this planet.
So it will be in the middle east?
But you call it the "greatest attempt". Does that mean it will not be successful?
John UK wrote: Sure thing David. It will be a nuclear holocaust or...
Joel 2:30 KJV
And I will shew wonders in the heavens and in the earth, blood, and fire, and pillars of smoke
John, and everyone else have you ever seen a picture of nuclear detonation? There are many available on the internet. A large pillar of smoke rises and forms what is similar to a mushroom at it's top and is often called in relationship to the nuclear blast a "mushroom cloud". Of course "pillars of smoke" plural in relationship to to a nuclear blast would involve unspecified numbers of nuclear blasts with mushroom clouds at their top.
The context of the book of Joel, among other things, involves connection to the "great tribulation" of Matthew 24:21-24 KJV and the second coming to earth of the Lord Jesus Christ.
And as I have said several times recently in this thread as least two billion people will die in a short period of time during the "great tribulation" which is Satan's final and greatest attempt in the history of the world to destroy all jews on this planet.
Dopey wrote: In my last post in this thread I said this: "at least two billion people on this planet will die in a short period of time during that "great tribulation" as the result of various things going on at that time: Revelation 9:18 KJV By these three was the third part of men killed, by the fire, and by the smoke, and by the brimstone, which issued out of their mouths."
Sure thing David. It will be a nuclear holocaust or a direct act of God. If you are aware of which part of the world will suffer such tribulation, it behoves you as a loving man to tell everyone here, so that we can get in our coracles and let the wind blow us whither it will.
"at least two billion people on this planet will die in a short period of time during that "great tribulation" as the result of various things going on at that time:
Revelation 9:18 KJV
By these three was the third part of men killed, by the fire, and by the smoke, and by the brimstone, which issued out of their mouths."
There are a lot of people, including some calling themselves "Christians", who believe that what I said in my first paragraph in not true. They believe that the verse involves symbolism that means something else than what I said it means. If they are right then perhaps this is symbolism also:
Acts 16:29-31 KJV
29 Then he called for a light, and sprang in, and came trembling, and fell down before Paul and Silas, 30 And brought them out, and said, Sirs, what must I do to be saved? 31 And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house.
Perhaps the above three verses are symbolism that means one of the following things:
1. To be saved be a Roman Catholic and obey the RC's teachings.
2. To be saved be a Jehovah Witness and obey the JW's teachings.
3. To be saved be a Mormon and obey the M's teachings.
For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be. And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened.
I quoted the above scripture in my last post and have done so here to show the connection to some other scripture.
Things will be so bad on this planet during the attempt to destroy all jews by Satan ("great tribulation" of Matthew 24:21-24), which will be the greatest tribulation for the jews in the entire history of the word (doubt it? Reread Matthew 24:21-24 KJV again and may God grant that you believe it because He's not kidding) that at least two billion people on this planet will die in a short period of time during that "great tribulation" as the result of various things going on at that time:
Revelation 9:18 KJV
By these three was the third part of men killed, by the fire, and by the smoke, and by the brimstone, which issued out of their mouths.
Lurker wrote: John, ... What if faith expressed (Deut 6:5) is indeed the fulfillment of the second covenant given beginning at Deut 29 and ending at Deut 30:20, which it is, and together with the Sinai covenant God called them the everlasting covenant? What if "the righteousness of God without the law" (Rom 3:21-22) and "the law of faith" (Rom 3:27) was expounded by Moses as the second covenant (compare Rom 10:8 to Deut 30:14)? Mat 5:17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil. Jesus fulfilled all the law, both the law of faith as well as the law of works. (John 14:31 & 14:21) Why, then, do we not see faith as part of the Son's righteousness?
Thank you bro. I'm still not seeing what you mean, unless it be imputed faith, along with righteousness. And that would be a mystery to me.
David I also think it likely that we are close to some fierceness going on in the middle east, which could usher in another powerful work of God on behalf of his people. But I comprehend so little about these endtime scenarios that I am forever asking questions to find out more.
And now I am off to "church" to learn some more and have fellowship.
Lurker wrote: To be quickened is the same as regenerated and born again which aren't mentioned in Romans 8:30 either. But none of these are to be confused with justification which is a judicial act of God (Rom 8:33). The just shall live by faith. It is God who quickens. We are justified by faith. It is God who justifies. The only reasonable conclusion these facts will allow is that faith is part of Christ's righteousness; the other part being the fulfillment of the law of works (love one another). If you have specific question I'll try to help.
"For just as the Father raises the dead and gives them life, even so the Son also gives life to whom He wishes." (John 5:21)
It's my understanding that there is a physical quickening and a spiritual quickening. If Rms 8:30 is being specific to just what the Father does, then it would make sense that quickening isn't mentioned because nobody but Jesus has been ressurected yet. However, if it is an all inclusive list of what God does then I don't know why quickening isn't mentioned.