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Pope Benedict XVI named three new saints for the Catholic Church during Sunday Mass in St. Peter's Square that was disrupted by a man who climbed out onto the upper colonnade and burned a Bible.
The disruption came toward the end of the two-hour service Sunday to canonize three 19th-century founders of religious orders: Italian bishop and missionary Monsignor Guido Maria Conforti, Spanish nun Sister Bonifacia Rodriguez de Castro and an Italian priest who worked with the poor, the Rev. Luigi Guanella.
On hand in the crowd was William Glisson Jr., from the Philadelphia area in the U.S., whose cure from a 2002 head injury was declared the miracle needed to canonize Guanella....
Jim Lincoln wrote: Refus, we aren't a theocracy and I certainly don't support Theonomy. If the people of the U.S. think that the Constitution should be changed to prohibit abortion, all they have to do is to vote in the legislators to do it. It isn't for the judges to make law, though when it comes to death penalty, they are finding sneaky ways to stop it.
I am not advocating for theonomy or a theocracy. It was not the legislature that legalized the killing of children, it was the Supreme Court. Thus, if they wanted to (which they don't), the Supreme Court can undo what it has done to begin with. One then looks at the make-up of the court and sees 9 people who ascribe to antichrist religions, it stands to reason they would engage in antichrist behaviors.
Refus, we aren't a theocracy and I certainly don't support Theonomy. If the people of the U.S. think that the Constitution should be changed to prohibit abortion, all they have to do is to vote in the legislators to do it. It isn't for the judges to make law, though when it comes to death penalty, they are finding sneaky ways to stop it.
Jim Lincoln wrote: ... Refus, don't paint all Jews with the same brush, even what is probably a more liberal Jewish Community of Great Britain, has probably no problem with this comment from the BBC: "Judaism does not forbid abortion, but it does not permit abortion on demand. Abortion is only permitted for serious reasons. . . ." from, Judaism and abortion. Ah, Roman Catholic Tradition, Christians are against it!
I was speaking of 6 specific Roman Catholics and 3 specific Jews, Elena Kagan, Ruth Bader Ginsburg, and Stephen Breyer. If these Babylonian religions desired to have abortion ended, they have people in positions of sufficient power to do so.
JSI wrote: wouldn't it be best not to refer to Pope Benedict XVI as "His Unholiness" or other derogatory title?
But JSI The True Biblical Church, that is Protestant Church, has known for centuries that the incumbent pope is the papal antichrist, therefore is unholy. WCF(Dated 1648) Quote: 28/6. There is no other Head of the Church but the Lord Jesus Christ(a) nor can the Pope of Rome, in any sense be head thereof; but is that Antichrist, that man of sin and son of perdition, that exalteth himself in the Church against Christ, and all that is called God.(b)
a. Eph 1:22; Col 1:18. • b. Mat 23:8-10; 2 Thes 2:3-4, 8-9; Rev 13:6.
And don't forget: Ex 20.4 Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth: 5 Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them: for I the LORD thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate me;
Jim Lincoln wrote: His Unholiness can't name saints, and those he call saints are Catholic and can usually be considered as non-Christians. All Christians are Saints. Romans 1 7 to all who are beloved of God in Rome, called as saints: Grace to you and peace from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ.
Do you appreciate it when Tony or others refer to you as sinner, apostate, heretic or some other mean and nasty name? If you don't then wouldn't it be best not to refer to Pope Benedict XVI as "His Unholiness" or other derogatory title? Although I refer to myself as totally depraved from time-to-time, I wouldn't appreciate it if another were to refer to me this way.
If I mentioned your pastor, I'd refer to him as Pastor Rugh (if that's what he prefers to be called), not by some insulting title or name.
Although some Baptist congregations may assume that the Roman Catholic Church is not Christian, isn't this like Rhode Island seceding and claiming itself to be the only U.S. state? After a measure of time the other 49 American states would return the straying RI back to the fold.
His Unholiness can't name saints, and those he call saints are Catholic and can usually be considered as non-Christians. All Christians are Saints.
Romans 1 7 to all who are beloved of God in Rome, called as saints: Grace to you and peace from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ.---NASB etc.
The Roman Catholic Bible not only has the Book of Revelation, but of course extra material in both the Old and New Testament that God never had in there!
Refus, don't paint all Jews with the same brush, even what is probably a more liberal Jewish Community of Great Britain, has probably no problem with this comment from the BBC: "Judaism does not forbid abortion, but it does not permit abortion on demand. Abortion is only permitted for serious reasons. . . ." from, Judaism and abortion.
EWE wrote: Does the Roman Catholic Church turn a person into a saint or validate a saint who's already in Heaven, much like ministers do for the dead at virtually every Protestant funeral? _________ Rufus, The Protestant Reformation has progressed through these 500 years from a world war, to a cold war to today Evangelicals and Catholics working together to fight abortion, same-sex "marriage" and other oppression. As in the Civil War, whatever blood was spilled, was long ago, long since forgotten and, most importantly, long since forgiven by the Blood of Christ. Amen.
This evangelical does not work with Catholics to fight abortion. 6 Catholics and 3 Jews could end the abortion fight immediately if they were favorable towards doing so.
Neither blood spilled in the war against the states nor spilled by the Roman Catholic church has been forgotten by all, though perhaps has been forgotten by some.
Christ has not forgiven Rome for the shedding of the blood of saints past, present and future. He will judge her though...
"And there came one of the seven angels which had the seven vials, and talked with me, saying unto me, Come hither; I will shew unto thee the judgment of the great whore that sitteth upon many waters:" - Revelation 17:1
EWE wrote: Does the Roman Catholic Church turn a person into a saint or validate a saint who's already in Heaven, much like ministers do for the dead at virtually every Protestant funeral? ---
From the Catholic Encyclopedia:
"The formula used in the act of canonization has nothing more than this:
"In honour of . . . we decree and define that Blessed N. is a Saint, and we inscribe his name in the catalogue of saints, and order that his memory be devoutly and piously celebrated yearly on the . . . day of . . . his feast."
To decree someone a saint is a bit more than mere validation of a saint already in existence. In fact, as you can see, canonization is an order. "So and so is a saint...I have spoken."
EWE wrote: Also, please point us to a Roman Catholic Church Bible translation that omits the Book of Revelation (AKA Apocalypse). I've never seen one.
I didn't say "translation", I said greek text.
You'll find all the info you need about The Codex Vaticanus and its omission of the book of Revelation here.
As to the former, if you are serious about getting all your questions answered, please do a Bible verse search to the left and listen to one of the sermons on that subject.
John UK wrote: Quite correct Rufus. Little wonder that their favoured greek texts omit the book of Revelation. For there is the Catholic Abominable Antichrist portrayed in all its true crimson colours.
"And I saw the woman drunken with the blood of the saints, and with the blood of the martyrs of Jesus: and when I saw her, I wondered with great admiration." -Revelation 17:6
Is this verse referring to a distant time in the early Protestant Reformation or a time in the distant future? Who is this drunk woman and why would she desire the blood of the saints and martyrs? If she's a character in the past, what are the names of these saints and martyrs? Why would this narrator watch this woman's evil deeds "with great admiration"? Who is this narrator?
Also, please point us to a Roman Catholic Church Bible text that omits the Book of Revelation (AKA Apocalypse). I've never heard of such a tale.
Rufus wrote: "And I saw the woman drunken with the blood of the saints, and with the blood of the martyrs of Jesus: and when I saw her, I wondered with great admiration." - Revelation 17:6
Rather than being an authority on defining "saints", the papacy is instead responsible for spilling their blood.
Quite correct Rufus.
Little wonder that their favoured greek texts omit the book of Revelation. For there is the Catholic Abominable Antichrist portrayed in all its true crimson colours.
Mike wrote: Unfortunately for this approach, no man can make a saint of another. That's God's work in the heart of a sinner, and it is done in this life, not the afterlife, and it has little to do with doing good deeds. Unbelievers can do good deeds. For your edification, run a biblical word search on "saint." You'll see where the difference is.
Does the Roman Catholic Church turn a person into a saint or validate a saint who's already in Heaven, much like ministers do for the dead at virtually every Protestant funeral?
_________
Rufus,
The Protestant Reformation has progressed through these 500 years from a world war, to a cold war to today Evangelicals and Catholics working together to fight abortion, same-sex "marriage" and other oppression. As in the Civil War, whatever blood was spilled, was long ago, long since forgotten and, most importantly, long since forgiven by the Blood of Christ. Amen.
"Unto the church of God which is at Corinth, to them that are sanctified in Christ Jesus, called to be saints, with all that in every place call upon the name of Jesus Christ our Lord, both theirs and ours:" - 1 Corinthians 1:2
"Now therefore ye are no more strangers and foreigners, but fellowcitizens with the saints, and of the household of God;" - Ephesians 2:19
"And I saw the woman drunken with the blood of the saints, and with the blood of the martyrs of Jesus: and when I saw her, I wondered with great admiration." - Revelation 17:6
Rather than being an authority on defining "saints", the papacy is instead responsible for spilling their blood.
EWE wrote: The Church's mission is to make us all saints. How many funerals have you attended where the pastor said: "This Christian saint is now absent from the body but we're rejoicing because he's present with the Lord"? Although the Roman Catholic Church's process is more complex than this, both consider the Christian's ministry and life. "Ye shall know [the saints] by their fruit." Praise the Lord that there are three new saints in Heaven.
Unfortunately for this approach, no man can make a saint of another. That's God's work in the heart of a sinner, and it is done in this life, not the afterlife, and it has little to do with doing good deeds. Unbelievers can do good deeds. For your edification, run a biblical word search on "saint." You'll see where the difference is.
Michael Hranek wrote: somekind of lesser dieties men can worship (I know Catholics call it veneration)
Who are in "this great cloud of witnesses" of our lives? That is, who's watching our every move besides God? Who's listening to our every word besides the angels? The saints in heaven.
Can they be our advocate to Christ if we ask them? Certainly. May we pray directly to Christ? Definitely.
However, the standard process when you go to court is we take our advocate (knowledgeable attorney) to speak on our behalf. Likewise, when you approach the throne of grace to petition our Great High Judge, you can pray to Him directly or ask your advocate -- a saint -- to approach Him for you -- either way. But since a saint's already there, he knows better how to "approach the bench," so to speak.
EWE wrote: Praise the Lord that there are three new
EWE Please take this a gently as I might say it to you BUT right to the point you are seriously amiss.
Biblically saints, holy ones, the redeemed are those set apart by God and for God, His own special treasure NOT somekind of super spiritual achievers who attain by their own good works merit to become somekind of lesser dieties men can worship (I know Catholics call it veneration) and pray to.
How many funerals have you attended where the pastor said: "This Christian saint is now absent from the body but we're rejoicing because he's present with the Lord"?
Although the Roman Catholic Church's process is more complex than this, both consider the Christian's ministry and life.
"Ye shall know [the saints] by their fruit."
Praise the Lord that there are three new saints in Heaven.
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