Whether a public university can use taxpayer funds from the federal government for a website that overtly endorses the beliefs of some religious groups regarding evolution and creation – but not others – is the focus of a case that's being prepared for submission to the U.S. Supreme Court.
"This is a classic example of what the Founding Fathers did not want," Brad Dacus, of the Pacific Justice Institute, told WND.
His organization is working on the case that revolves around a University of California-Berkeley website that advocates for a single perspective in the arguments over evolution – and highlights a list of religious groups whose beliefs agree with that perspective....
I must agree with Neil's assessment here, Jessica Dawson. Whether enslaved, taxed, or merely obeying the ordinance of man for the Lord's sake; even those trials that fall outside of the imposition of men, we are to receive with alacrity... 'trying of our faith working patience'. Very foundational. Don't let yourself be led into debating details and dealing with sophistry.
"Joe Schmoe's cousin" posted ""Jessica Dawson wrote: "True, had Kent Hovind submitted to the ordinance of man he would not be in jail, and wouldn't have had to pay those taxes any way. But we are all learning and growing, many of us have had to learn the hard way."
Proverbs 8:13 The fear of the LORD is to hate evil: pride, and arrogancy, and the evil way, and the froward mouth, do I hate.""
Dear Lord please bless the person who calls themself "Joe Schmoe" and "Joe Schmoe's cousin"! Ah Mighty God You are great, mighty and when You shut a door no one can open it and when You open a door no one can shut it! Bless them Lord and bless them again by Your great wisdom, might and love! In Jesus name amen
I have head injuries, so I need constant studying to remember: When I look at back at the posts I have made, it's like looking back at bible study notes. This helps me!
Jessica, while you are interested in Biblical truth, other seem more interested in pulling rank, trying fallaciously to make *you* the issue instead of your opinions.
Ignore them, for I've seen nothing coherent from your critics so far.
BTW, there's no such thing as an "independent thinker." All thinking requires a starting point, an axiom, or else thinking could not proceed.
Joe Schmoe wrote: I am sorry Jessica, but your tone does seem inappropriate and out of line. If you desire to study and learn that is great. But upon reviewing some of your comments you are usually acting like a teacher.
Right on, look at this comment.
Jessica Dawson wrote: True, had Kent Hovind submitted to the ordinance of man he would not be in jail, and wouldn't have had to pay those taxes any way. But we are all learning and growing, many of us have had to learn the hard way.
Proverbs 8:13 The fear of the LORD is to hate evil: pride, and arrogancy, and the evil way, and the froward mouth, do I hate.
Mike wrote: What happens, Jessica, when We the People are Caesar?
If this be true Mike, then I pay taxes to myself. Or I can pay taxes to you and you to me.
I am sorry Jessica, but your tone does seem inappropriate and out of line. If you desire to study and learn that is great. But upon reviewing some of your comments you are usually acting like a teacher.
Independent Thinker wrote: If you care to discuss your teaching on taxes then you may do so in order for the public to understand more clearly. But to come on here with a know-it-all attitude is just plain wrong.
You may start by telling us who Caesar is in America. Thank you.
Perhaps you would be willing to abide by your own rules and be a shining example... or are you going to be yet another abusive poster hiding behind the anonymity of the internet with all of the questions and none of the answers?
Btw, your treatment of a dear sister in Christ is despicable. Get over yourself and show some respect for others.
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Great post John! You have a way of saying what needs to be said in a graceful manner.
I've been waiting to hear some words of wisdom from an independent thinker, but it seems you are worse than A-ac (let the reader understand), posting a lot of woffle but never posting your own position. If you've got something to say, then do please say it. And do not be afraid of being mocked if you post a load of rubbish, as I expect you will. IT's have always been mocked throughout history. I get it all the time coz I buck the trend.
However, I have the greatest of respect for the WCF fluffers because they will boldly declare themselves without fear of man. Even an anti-fluffer like Mike will unashamedly declare himself despite opposition. The secret rapturists are not ashamed, the lunatic dispy's are not ashamed. When he was on here Yam Yam was not ashamed, Cheryl was not ashamed, and a thousand others were not ashamed.
The fear of man bringeth a snare.
So come on, out with it, and let's have a right 'pick it to pieces session'.
It's getting a bit boring round here, and we could all do with a bit of a barny.
Besides which, I realise you're not a teacher but, who knows, I might just learn something. Whoever heard of learning anything from a blank page, except that thesis on biblical evidence for sprinkling.
Wow God bless! I use the threads as an opportunity to study the Bible and that perhaps with other people. I am a shut in and my big outing for the week, is going to get a form of chemo shot at the doctors office. No, I don't have cancer, but advanced rheumatoid arthritis. With the "mild" chemo-therapy, this keep the disease under control. Hallelujah! I don't have any teachings, I am studying the Bible and using the threads as a means to do so. This because I am so isolated and I am crippled. If it seems vague, I just don't know what to say. I am just reading the Bible and trying to learn myself what the Bible teaches about certain topics. So I use the sermon audio topics to learn and grow, hoping that others will "sharpen" me and I will "sharpen" them. Or rather the Word of God will sharpen us. Glory to God! His Word be praised! Perhaps you are new to the message boards, I have explained my situation to others here in the past. Some have accused me of teaching men, but I plainly post my name and men are free to skip my posts.
Jessica, if I put words in your mouth then please explain and clarify your teaching. You have publicly taught that all Christians in every country must pay taxes. Yet your teaching according to scripture remains unclear and very vague. Extracting verses from various places without explaining them and then expecting the public to accept your teaching that those verses mean that "Christians must pay all taxes" is foolish and abusive to God's word. Furthermore, you don't even know the laws of all the countries, and you certainly you don't have any understanding of the IRS. If you do, then a lot of folks would be interested in what you know, including the IRS agents themselves, since even they can not make sense of their own chaotic codes.
I admonished you to "learn more about this and refrain from teaching until you come to a better understanding" which you have rejected. Please put a rest to your Joyce Meyer/Jack Van Impe preaching and gather some wisdom and knowledge.
If you care to discuss your teaching on taxes then you may do so in order for the public to understand more clearly. But to come on here with a know-it-all attitude is just plain wrong.
You may start by telling us who Caesar is in America. Thank you.
Jessica Dawson wrote: "Therefore submit yourselves to every ordinance of man for the Lord’s sake" Submitting to the ordinance of man is not for Caesar's sake, man's sake, your own sake, it is for The Lord's sake. Taxation is just one ordinance of man, and it is to be submitted to for The Lord's sake. Being a law abiding citizen is an excellent witness. 1 Peter 2:12-14 having your conduct honorable among the Gentiles, that when they speak against you as evildoers, they may, by your good works which they observe, glorify God in the day of visitation. Therefore submit yourselves to every ordinance of man for the Lord’s sake, whether to the king as supreme, or to governors, as to those who are sent by him for the punishment of evildoers and for the praise of those who do good. Luke 2:1-3 Luke 2:4-5 And Joseph also went up from Galilee, out of the city of Nazareth, into Judaea, unto the city of David, which is called Bethlehem; (because he was of the house and lineage of David: ) To be taxed with Mary his espoused wife, being great with child.
What happens, Jessica, when We the People are Caesar?
"Therefore submit yourselves to every ordinance of man for the Lord’s sake"
Submitting to the ordinance of man is not for Caesar's sake, man's sake, your own sake, it is for The Lord's sake. Taxation is just one ordinance of man, and it is to be submitted to for The Lord's sake. Being a law abiding citizen is an excellent witness.
1 Peter 2:12-14 having your conduct honorable among the Gentiles, that when they speak against you as evildoers, they may, by your good works which they observe, glorify God in the day of visitation. Therefore submit yourselves to every ordinance of man for the Lord’s sake, whether to the king as supreme, or to governors, as to those who are sent by him for the punishment of evildoers and for the praise of those who do good.
Luke 2:1-3 Luke 2:4-5 And Joseph also went up from Galilee, out of the city of Nazareth, into Judaea, unto the city of David, which is called Bethlehem; (because he was of the house and lineage of David: ) To be taxed with Mary his espoused wife, being great with child.
I wonder whether Caesar has proper authority to claim quintuple tithing? Perhaps those government employees who erroneously see themselves as Caesar think so.
Jessica Dawson wrote: 1 Peter 2:12-14 having your conduct honorable among the Gentiles, that when they speak against you as evildoers, they may, by your good works which they observe, glorify God in the day of visitation. Therefore submit yourselves to every ordinance of man for the Lord’s sake, whether to the king as supreme, or to governors, as to those who are sent by him for the punishment of evildoers and for the praise of those who do good.
Neil wrote: And can Christians use their "own form" of money? Sure, if it is acceptable as payment to the other party in the transaction.
When I lived in Somerset county, England, it was very refreshing to witness first hand how, for many of the farming community, it was possible to support one another in various jobs, without any money exchanging hands. Someone who helped out with rounding up sheep might expect some lamb chops, one who helped with welding some farm machinery might get his plumbing fixed, and so on. I rather liked this bartering system, which goes back centuries. The bartering I witnessed was not a philosophy, or anti-guv scenario, just a way of life amongst the farmers.
1 Peter 2:12-14 having your conduct honorable among the Gentiles, that when they speak against you as evildoers, they may, by your good works which they observe, glorify God in the day of visitation. Therefore submit yourselves to every ordinance of man for the Lord’s sake, whether to the king as supreme, or to governors, as to those who are sent by him for the punishment of evildoers and for the praise of those who do good.
I hope that others on this message board, are able to see that "words are being put in my mouth" that are not there.
Jessica, how your dad feels is not relevant. You are teaching that Jesus answered yes to the trick question, that Christians are to pay any tax that the minds of men can think of, and that the tax (es) can amount to 100% or more of one's wages. According to your teaching there are no exceptions. Your teaching applies to global taxes as well.
However, your teaching is not all that simple. Much has been written on the subject, and we can't discuss the entire matter successfully here. I suggest you learn more about this and refrain from teaching until you come to a better understanding, if you should be publicly teaching at all.
It is pertinent to know who Caesar is today if Christians are to give money to him. It is also important to understand that the images on the federal reserve notes feature various dead people. What do you think about that?
"Are you also teaching that Christians should pay 100% of their wages in taxes if demanded?"
This is simply another way of asking, can Christians be slaves, since they receive no wages? Answer: yes; see Eph. 6:5-8. Obviously, freedom is preferable if available. N.B., this is not an endorsement of unbiblical antebellum negro slavery.
And can Christians use their "own form" of money? Sure, if it is acceptable as payment to the other party in the transaction.
Jason Lisle | 6/1/2005
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Get over yourself and show some respect for others.
May God's blessing be upon you all!
