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RELIGION, CURRENT EVENTS, TECHNOLOGY Subscribe to the breaking newsWhat is RSS?
FRONT PAGE  |  10/24/2014
TUESDAY, APR 22, 2008  |  19 comments
'Expelled' Explodes into Top 10 Box Office

“Expelled: No Intelligence Allowed,” the pro-intelligent design documentary featuring actor Ben Stein, made history this weekend as it propelled full speed into the top 10 box office. It opened as the widest and one of the most commercially successful releases for any documentary film.

In an impressive opening weekend, the film debuted at No. 9 at the box office, earning a respectable $3.2 million while only appearing on 1,052 screens.

“Leatherheads,” the story of a struggling football team based in Duluth, Minnesota, and written and directed by George Clooney, trailed the new documentary film, placing at only No. 10 its third week at the box office, despite showing at over twice as many screens. ...


CLICK HERE to Read Entire Article
www.christianpost.com

Was Darwin Right? Part 1
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· Page 1 ·  Found: 19 user comment(s)
News Item12/17/08 8:59 PM
Neil | Tucson  Find all comments by Neil
John of SJ,

Concerning Wikipedia's credibility, I haven't paid much attention to its Christian theological articles, since these can be found elsewhere in greater depth anyway. As we've seen here, Reformed theology rarely gets a fair representation from "mainstream" Christians, so Wikipedia bias is unsurprising.

I think it's all right on less controversial subjects.

19

News Item4/26/08 10:53 PM
brother Michael  Find all comments by brother Michael
Believing the Scriptures Michael and studying the matter out before I answer it as being folly. If you take the time you will find things are not so clear cut as the disciples of Copernicus would have you believe.

Likewise I'm believing in the historic Christian faith which held to the literal interpretation of verses such as the one below (until modern science told us the Bible was in error in this area). A faith and understanding that all held to until one more doctrine of the Bible was "proven" to be false just the same way creation of man was by Darwin, the origins of the universe by Dawkins/Hawkings/Sagan, etc., the nature of man and sin by Freud, et al. It all comes down to whose knee do we bend to - modern science or the Word.

"And the sun stood still, and the moon stayed, until the people had avenged themselves upon their enemies. Is not this written in the book of Jasher? So the sun stood still in the midst of heaven, and hasted not to go down about a whole day." (Joshua 10:13)

Your brother in Christ -

18

News Item4/26/08 10:04 AM
Michael Hranek | Endicott, New York  Protected NameFind all comments by Michael Hranek
brother Michael wrote:
A challenge I present for all to consider is geocentricism. Insanity, right?
Oh! Brother Michael where art thou? Respectfully.
17

News Item4/26/08 9:54 AM
brother Michael  Find all comments by brother Michael
A challenge I present for all to consider is geocentricism. Insanity, right? Most would say so as myriad, having never studied it, dismiss it outright just as our brainwashing has taught us to do.

I write this as many rightfully fight for the literal interpretation of the Biblical creation model even though it is mocked and scored by scientists, educational institutes and liberal theologians. Yet many of these same persons will deny what the Bible teaches about the earth and sun. This done as most Christians accept without question the words from the same pro-evolution scientists who hate God and have "proven" that the earth revolves around the sun.

Yet if you start to study it you will find quite the contrary as there is no proof that the earth revolves around the sun but merely theories to support a anti-Biblical world view. And actually there is much empirical evidence that proves the Biblical model of the sun truly rising and setting.

Right now I studying the materials in "Galileo was Wrong' by Robert Sungenis. The author being a staunch RC apologist where you will have to wade through fawning accolades for the popes, yet even so there is a wealth of great scientific material that will open your eyes to a world many never considered.

16

News Item4/25/08 2:04 PM
Michael Hranek | Endicott, New York  Protected NameFind all comments by Michael Hranek
fuzzy logic wrote:
I will be off tomorrow (that means no lab work on my own time) so more than likely I will watch the movie.
fuzzy logic
Thanks for the post back. I hope you enjoy the movie and more than that for every Christian who sees it may if remind us of how infinitely great our God is to where we cannot help but worship Him!

I am ignorant of Jacques Ellul and Fromm but I can grasp that as God gives us, His children born again of the Holy Ghost, understanding of the unsearchable GREATNESS of Jesus Christ the Son of the Living God our CREATOR and that we were Created by Him and for Him and the enormity of His shed blood given for us for our salvation and that we have been called into fellowship with Him we find our Joy in belonging to Him and in living our lives for Him who is so much greater than we are.

Rev 4
10 the twenty-four elders fall down before Him who sits on the throne and worship Him who lives forever and ever, and cast their crowns before the throne, saying:

11 “You are worthy, O Lord, To receive glory and honor and power;
For You created all things, And by Your will they £exist and were created.”

I would have to think that knowing Him, Our Father, as our Almighty Creator is great Reviving!!! medicine for the soul.

15

News Item4/25/08 10:30 AM
fuzzy logic | lab  Find all comments by fuzzy logic
I will be off tomorrow (that means no lab work on my own time) so more than likely I will watch the movie. In one of the 'free' newspaper publications, the movie "Expelled" was not even mentioned or reviewed. I considered writing a letter to the editor but I shall wait until AFTER I see the film.

Thanks, Michael for your earlier review. I hear in NY, theatres charge up to $14!

Regarding the idea of freedom, Jacques Ellul wrote "The Ethics of Freedom" and because it is so dense with protein, I put it off and began periphery studies via E. Fromm's "Escape from Freedom."

Keep in mind, freedom in Christ is NOT the same as freedom to represent Christ.

"The loss of the self has increased the necessity to conform for it results in a profound doubt of one's own identity. If I am nothing but what I believe I am supposed to be--who am I?" Fromm (253)

14

News Item4/25/08 8:36 AM
Michael Hranek | Endicott, New York  Protected NameFind all comments by Michael Hranek
I am (?) surprised that no one has posted back with any discussion.

Here is something to consider, Ken Ham, Answers in Genesis has made the case that the reason people in our society don't believe the Bible, don't give Christians credibility, see nothing wrong with homosexual marriage, abortion, witchcraft, etc. etc. is that they have bought into the lies of millions of years and evolution.

Ken Ham has done a masterful job explaining how we need to give the lost something better than 'I don't know' when a lost person asks us for example about Noah's flood and how did he get all the animals on the Ark and 'just believe in Jesus anyway.'

Ben Stein's movie Expelled has reignited my interest in Answers in Genesis and for that matter recalling the Gospel of John which was written so men might believe John begins with Jesus being God and being our Creator and so much flows out of that I don't have space to comment on other than I can see it as laying a foundation so that someone who is lost can believe in Jesus Christ as He truly is.

13

News Item4/24/08 6:42 PM
Michael Hranek | Endicott, New York  Protected NameFind all comments by Michael Hranek
Anyone by chance want to discuss the Movie? The opposition of it by anti-God evolutionists and the apparent apathy (cowardice?) among those professing themselves to be Christians?

How about the deeper issue of freedom, freedom of speach, the freedom to disagree (even if you are wrong) with those in power.

How about Satan is only out to destroy those under his power (relates to keeping people, especially those who profess to be Christians in fear and intimating them into silence) and only fights against those who oppose him? And the reason so many are only being destroyed by him and not attacked by him is that they aren't really doing anything that is a threat to him?

12

News Item4/24/08 4:21 PM
John | San Jose, CA  Find all comments by John
Neil wrote:
BTW, I hear some people bash Wikipedia, but most of the articles I've seen are of good quality.
Only problem I remember having with Wikipedia was bias.

A year ago or so I Googled the word Monergism, wanting to know
what it meant, having heard it mentioned in my Sunday school
class.

Wikipedia not only defined Monergism but took the liberty of
trying to point out 3 or 4 of its (perceived) flaws.

Curious, I then looked up Synergism, expecting Wikipedia to
be even-handed by pointing out ITS flaw, but NONE were listed;
prompting me to suspect that at least one of these definitions
was submitted by a free-willer.

11

News Item4/23/08 12:51 PM
By Your Standards, Not Elect | Oblivion  Find all comments by By Your Standards, Not Elect
Neil wrote:
John, yes I did, & By Your Stds, what I posted is distinct from objections to the Cosmological Argument, which I do not recall this film mentioning or implying. But I do believe this argument commits a similiar error by begging the question.
I read the TF .pdf on Clark's take on the argument. He has an interesting modernist take on it.

I must admit, I only trust wikipedia if I can cross check it with a known expert, especially when it comes to philosophical argumentation.

10

News Item4/23/08 11:58 AM
Neil | Tucson  Find all comments by Neil
John, yes I did, & By Your Stds, what I posted is distinct from objections to the Cosmological Argument, which I do not recall this film mentioning or implying. But I do believe this argument commits a similiar error by begging the question.

See
Hume's objections to the Design Argument
His 1st point, however, seems to beg the question. Not that I'm a philosophy major, but I do try to be at least somewhat familiar with these matters. Also listen to TF's Clark lectures on apologetics.

BTW, I hear some people bash Wikipedia, but most of the articles I've seen are of good quality.

9

News Item4/23/08 11:51 AM
John | San Jose, CA  Find all comments by John
Neil wrote:
Discovery Institute's "Privileged Planet" is indeed nicely made & even encouraging, but in endorsing the Anthropic Principle as it does, it in effect repeats the untenable Teleological Argument for the existence of God. Even if one concedes that the universe has design & purpose, it does not logically follow that the Scriptural Trinity made it - perhaps Zeus or Voltaire's "committee of gods" did. Thomas Aquinas et al. couldn't avoid begging the question here. Apologetics has been hindered by use of this argument.
Now it may be acceptable if one uses it ad-hominem - assume your opponent's probablistic empirical principles for the sake of argument.
Even if you don't agree with this, it's best to be aware of objections *before* encountering a well-briefed atheist.
At least it's more robust than
the old "god-of-the-gaps" argument.

Did you once say that David Hume
more or less torpedoed the whole
Teleological Argument many decades
ago? I guess I could just google it,
and find out but sometimes it's easier
just to ask someone.

8

News Item4/23/08 12:45 AM
By Your Standards, Not Elect | Oblivion  Find all comments by By Your Standards, Not Elect
Neil wrote:
Discovery Institute's "Privileged Planet" is indeed nicely made & even encouraging, but in endorsing the Anthropic Principle as it does, it in effect repeats the untenable Teleological Argument for the existence of God. Even if one concedes that the universe has design & purpose, it does not logically follow that the Scriptural Trinity made it - perhaps Zeus or Voltaire's "committee of gods" did. Thomas Aquinas et al. couldn't avoid begging the question here. Apologetics has been hindered by use of this argument.
Now it may be acceptable if one uses it ad-hominem - assume your opponent's probablistic empirical principles for the sake of argument.
Even if you don't agree with this, it's best to be aware of objections *before* encountering a well-briefed atheist.
Out of curiosity, Neil, are you following Gordon Clark's rebuttal of the cosmological proof for God's existence? I believe you mentioned him a few years ago. I know you're talking about the teleological proof here, however.
7

News Item4/22/08 6:37 PM
Michael Hranek | Endicott, New York  Protected NameFind all comments by Michael Hranek
fuzzy logic wrote:
so John, did you actually see the film? Was it worth the $8+ ?
Fuzzy
Hi! This is Michael from Endicott. My daughter and I saw the movie Friday night and I was favorably impressed.

Ben Stein is of course Jewish so this is not a "Christian" movie and it actually deals much more with the issue of Freedom than just with the Evolution vs ID controversy.

I can understand some of why some in the anti-god evolutionistic community are so enraged by and hostile to this film as it dares disagree with their cherished believe in Darwinism on the basis of there is evidence for ID (btw I know who the Intelligent Designer and CREATOR is Jesus Christ ) and exposes their, can I say heartless and hypocritical persecution of those who dare disagree with them and how they seek to silence even abusing the courts to do so and impose their way on others.

If I can make a closing observation.

We need not only to stand up for the reality that it is God who Created the Universe and every living thing in it in 6 days just as He said in Genesis

But perhaps even more we need to stand up for FREEDOM as Satan and fallen men under his power don't really care one bit if we believe in God just so we are not free to tell anyone.

6

News Item4/22/08 4:33 PM
Neil | Tucson  Find all comments by Neil
Discovery Institute's "Privileged Planet" is indeed nicely made & even encouraging, but in endorsing the Anthropic Principle as it does, it in effect repeats the untenable Teleological Argument for the existence of God. Even if one concedes that the universe has design & purpose, it does not logically follow that the Scriptural Trinity made it - perhaps Zeus or Voltaire's "committee of gods" did. Thomas Aquinas et al. couldn't avoid begging the question here. Apologetics has been hindered by use of this argument.

Now it may be acceptable if one uses it ad-hominem - assume your opponent's probablistic empirical principles for the sake of argument.

Even if you don't agree with this, it's best to be aware of objections *before* encountering a well-briefed atheist.

5

News Item4/22/08 4:04 PM
fuzzy logic | lab  Find all comments by fuzzy logic
Thanks, John, for your response.

I have never heard of Privileged Planet. I'll go look it up.

I saw the 'extended trailer' for Expelled and it looks very good. Never really was a fan of Stein but I appreciate almost anything that is well written and executed--regardless if the writer/ producer/ actor is wrong or Catholic or anything else. A good argument is a good argument.

Like the saying goes, "You can learn a lot from your enemies."

4

News Item4/22/08 3:03 PM
John | San Jose, CA  Find all comments by John
fuzzy logic wrote:
so John, did you actually see the film? Was it worth the $8+ ?
Friends of mine who saw it assured me
that I'd like it, but I'm not much of
a movie person these days, so It'll be
some time before I overcome my "inertia"
and go see it (or get the DVD).

If it's at least as good as "Priveleged Planet"
was, I'll probably like it too.

3

News Item4/22/08 1:57 PM
fuzzy logic | lab  Find all comments by fuzzy logic
so John, did you actually see the film? Was it worth the $8+ ?
2

News Item4/22/08 12:29 PM
John | San Jose, CA  Find all comments by John
It would be nice if this film ended up convicting at least
a few of our modern secular scientists not to be so hastey to dismiss
that which seems profoundly counterintuitive to them
(e.g. Paul Erlich's dismissal of Julian Simon's population
studies as being of a "flat-earth" mentality--even though
Simon was the one who turned out to be right!).

One of their own, Richard Feynman, admonished his own students
to be wary of misleading themselves during scientific endeavors
by saying "YOU yourself (student) are the easiest one to fool".

Even more cool would be the conviction of Ben Stein himself
that in challenging the Darwinists, he's not just wrestling
with flesh and blood, but PRINCIPALITIES, etc.; which would
eventually lead him to God/Christ/salvation.

1
There are a total of 19 user comments displayed | add new comment |Subscribe to these comments
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