North Carolina Baptists concluded their annual meeting Wednesday after addressing division and expelling a church for welcoming and affirming homosexuals into church leadership.
Nearly 3,000 delegates, or "messengers," of the N.C. Baptist State Convention, voted overwhelmingly on Tuesday to expel Myers Park Baptist Church in Charlotte for violating the Baptist group's constitution.
The liberal church consisting of about 1,970 members was the first to be kicked out of the state convention under new rules passed at the 2006 meeting that considers any Baptist church that welcomed gays and lesbians without trying to change their orientation to be â€śnot in friendly cooperationâ€ť with the state convention. Six other churches left the state convention in protest of the new rules, saying the new rule violated local autonomy, according to The Associated Press....
"He said Myers Park slowly overcame its original resistance to inclusion of gay and lesbian persons ... Blume also noted that Myers Park had sent no messengers to the convention for at least eight years, contributed "extremely little" financially and is aligned with several organizations which affirm or bless homosexual behavior, according to ABP."
How sad! I wonder how long it took them to drive out the true believers. Guess their attendance this year was to gain validation for their apostasy.
2 Thessalonians 3 6. But we command you, brethren, in the Name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that you withdraw from every brother who walks disorderly and not according to the tradition which he received from us. 14. And if anyone does not obey our word in this epistle, note that person and do not keep company with him, that he may be ashamed. 15. Yet do not count him as an enemy, but admonish him as a brother.
Praise God for the NCBSC's stance on the Word and compromise! May He prosper all those who voted 'yea', chastise those who voted 'nay', and help those six with the "tickled" ears who walked out to repent.
I lift my hat for NC Baptists! Obey God and not men. James said that if a man wants to be a friend of the world, he becomes an enemy of God! I'd rather be a friend of God and the enemy of all opposers of his declared will ....
Dr. Yamil Luciano wrote: (16 hours later) chirp-chirp
Discerning Believer wrote: Terry, I am afraid I will have to agree with Yamil on this one. Ro 8:29 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate [to be] conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren. Thanks DB, just a interpetation to see what kind of responce from people I would get. I agree, but the verse shows nothing more than God knows everything, not that man should boast, agree. Doc love ya man, you make me laugh, thanks for the rebuke. JD, thanks,but whats this mean 1/18/07 9:19 AM JDHowever, Christ death and resurrection was the means of justification for all believers of all times.
Discerned Believer, There are never two means of salvation, DB. If there is anything in the Bible that should never be confused it is that salvation is by faith. The only question is, 'faith in what'. The answer to that is , 'faith in the word of God. It is clearly told us what Abraham believed by which righteousness was imputed to him. 3 For what saith the scripture? Abraham believed God, and it was counted unto him for righteousness. 4 Now to him that worketh is the reward not reckoned of grace, but of debt. Docs right its in the grammer, spirit.
"If you do not agree with the pastor, the solution is simple: Find a different church."
This is the modern day Pastor's version of discipline. Don't like what I preach, go down to the church next door!
Every Pastor has their own government, their own doctrines, their own worship and all are causing nothing but division, disunity and schism.
Although I knew that it would not be long before I was shown the door with the Pastor saying, "If you do not agree with the pastor, the solution is simple: Find a different church." I found it better to present the truth on form of worship and form of government, and when there was no response, just left.
There was no sense to try to create an appeal to his decisions as appeals do not exist in his form of government. In the independent congregation, all appeals are unlawful and "If you do not agree with the pastor, the solution is simple: Find a different church."
"The Scripture does hold forth that many particular Congregations may be under one Presbyterial Government. This Proposition is proved by instances. I. Instance, Of the Church of Jerusalem, which consisted of more Congregations then one, and all those Congregations were under one Presbyterial Government. This appears thus, I. The Church of Jerusalem consisted of more Congregations then one, as is manifest. 1. By the multitude of Believers, mentioned in divers texts collated: Both before the dispersion of the Believers there, by means of the persecution (mentioned in the Acts of the Apostles, chapter 8, in the beginning) Witness Acts chapter 1:11 and chapter 2:41,46,47 and chapter 4:4 and chapter 5:14 and chapter 6:1,7. And also after the dispersion, Acts chapter 9:31 and chapter 12:24 and 21:20. 2. By the many Apostles and other Preachers in the Church of Jerusalem. If there were but one Congregation there, then each Apostle preached but seldom, which will not consist with Acts 6:2. 3. The diversity of languages among the Believers, mentioned both in the second and sixth chapters of the Acts, do argue more Congregations then one in that Church...."
The problem with your views is as you lord over your flock, and forbid them the power to appeal your discipline, I can only fear for the dear sheep in your autonomous church. There was an Arminian Pastor, such as yourself who lorded over me at one time, and I challenged him to appeal his decision. Like all of your autonomous Pastors who control your flocks without appeal, he could only shake his head that in his independent government there is no appeal from his discipline. Like a little Pope, the buck stops there!
Sorry Dr. Spin, I have no interest in Popery whether it is practiced at your local independent, autonomous church where you lord over the flock, or at the Papacy where he claims final authority.
If by synod you mean church council, then I suppose you are right. But if you mean by the presbytery form of government where a centralized body governs all local churches within its jurisdiction then you are once again mistaken.
One of the pillars of the baptist is the autonomy of the local church. They would never submit themselves to such church polity as the one you prescribe. Otherwise they would not be Baptists.
A convention is nothing more than a club. There are benefits to being perks the church gets for being part of it. There is no hierachy like the presbyterian form of government.
The only thing that the churches who left will suffer is the perks that came along with being part of the convention.
But if you want to believe otherwise, then it makes no difference to me. Maybe you would stop complaining about Baptists not having no accountability now since most Baptists churches are part of one form of convention or other.
You can't complain about them not having a presbytery and then make a 360 and say that they do have one.
No, an "assembly of ministers" at the state level is called a Synod if you want me to get technical.
Their convention is our Synod where a General Assembly would be at the national level. A presbytery is made up only of two or more local or regional local congregations or Sessions.
Spin it however you want, and I am certain you would have been one of those to walk out in protest that the rules violated your cherished local autonomy, but for those who like to "play that the local church is the highest authority" just ceaded control to a State convention governed by rules making the decision binding...this is Presbyterianism!
Ok, spin it how you like but they are acting like Presbyterians, except of course those who walked out in protest that the new rules VIOLATED LOCAL AUTONOMY, and that was my point!
"Six other churches left the state convention in protest of the new rules, saying the new rule violated local autonomy, according to The Associated Press. ..."
Does this mean the other baptist and independent churches are adopting Presbyterian government?
If this is true...everyone stand up and say Amen brothers and sisters! I would encourage all baptist that believe in the sole authority at the local level to go ahead and leave the state convention, as it looks like Presbyterian government to me and I am just delighted. It is indeed not a perfect form of divine presbyterial government as found in Scripture, but they are getting closer.
It was just a matter of time. At least they see an assembly of ministers works as God intended it to be as revealed in presbyterian government.
'In Deo Speravi' according to a daily British Newspaper November 16th Bush in a news item used the latin quote above rather than 'In God I have trusted'. (or normally in God we trust?) 'In Deo Speravi' is found in the vulgate translation Psalm 55. Just wondered is it unusual for the president to use that latin translation or is such common place? Anyone else know?