Mr Camping has long since stopped preaching the gospel he once proclaimed. Now he is an apostle of doubt. People who regularly listen to his ramblings on the "Open Forum" often complain that after they listen to him they doubt their salvation. Camping never directs sinners to Christ (as the apostles did) but to look at themselves. The constant mantra seems to be just keep on "crying for mercy" and God may or may not save you. That is NOT the gospel of the Bible! The publican who cried "God be merciful to me a sinner" (be propitious, or look upon me as when thou lookest on the blood)went down to his house "justified" THAT VERY DAY!! He did not keep on crying and crying and not finding relief. God is not a tormentor of sinners - He Who creates concern in your heart comes to provide relief - there is mercy with God. As for the nonsense about the church being finished, Paul said the Lord's Supper is to be held "till He come". The only sure thing about Camping's method of Biblical interpretation is that he hasn't got one! Those with any connection to Family Radio need to "Depart out" and get into a Bible-preaching Church (if you can find one of course)!!
I thought I was the only one. I am a former family radio listener. I initially prayed for the Lord to save me back in 1988, and have been praying ever since. I have a fear that I am not one of God's elect. It is both distressing and depressing. Without God, there is no hope. LR
I consider Harold Camping to be a false prophet. About a decade ago, he was predicting the end of the world. When the date came and went (if my recollection serves me correctly, it was in 1994), he adjusted his computations and tried a second time. Wrong again. Why would any true believer want to listen to a false prophet? I can't believe he still has a following, though I guess nothing should surprise me.
I still listen to Camping from time to time but I don't believe everything he says.
He does act like a sort of modern-day Jeremiah with his often severe but just criticisms of the present-day churches.
Ironically, it was Camping who incessantly "nagged" me to join a church while listening to his Open Forum program nightly back in the late 90's following a lengthy period of apostacy in my own life.
Ironic because not long after I finally joined a faithful local congregation (at Camping's own proddings), he did a complete 180 and started telling me and the rest of his listeners to "get out of the church".
I don't like being jerked-around--not even by such a renowned Bible teacher as Camping is (was?).
Gee, maybe if I leave my church, Camping will do yet another 180 in his teachings and insist that I JOIN one again.
Seriously, I've no intention of leaving my church unless, God-forbid, They quit preaching the Gospel and Biblical worship of God.
Confused, I'm not very familiar with Camping's radio program, but I have a friend who likes to listen to him, a new Christian.
But I do know the Bible says to "work out your own salvation with fear and trembling," and the "fear of God is the beginning of wisdom," and to "examine yourselves to see if you be in the faith."
Reading the lessons Jesus taught in the gospels will shake anybody up, and when Jesus taught his disciples they probably felt godly fear from the seriousness and intensity of his warnings and teachings, his descriptions of Hell, his examples of pitfalls and the people who fell into them.
Hbr 12:28 Wherefore we receiving a kingdom which cannot be moved, let us have grace, whereby we may serve God acceptably with reverence and godly fear: Hbr 12:29 For our God [is] a consuming fire.
Faith is courage to face the truth and deal with it, not to deal with uncomfortable feelings by running away from the truth, embracing feel-good lies and myths and fables (ie OSAS, pretrib rapture).
And God doesn't give a spirit of fear, but of power, love and a sound mind when we embrace the truth. Our goal isn't to "feel good" but to know the truth and act on it.
Today there are many churches with many conflicting doctrines.
Please fervently pray to be filled with the Holy Ghost and study the NT with prayer believing that the author of the Word will reveal the truth to you through His Word by His Spirit.
1Jo 2:27 But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him.
Joh 16:13 Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will show you things to come.
All born again Christians sin, and struggle with sin. A true Christian falls into sin against his will, while a false professing Christian dives into sin, enjoying its pleasures. Being born of God's Spirit will not make you sinless. It will radically change you so that you cannot tolerate sin, and HATE it when you do sin.
If you sincerely repented and trusted in the finished work of Jesus Christ who took your punishment, God brought His Spirit to birth in your heart.
Although there are those on this forum who are going to disagree with me and cause you more confusion for what I am about to say, if God works a miracle in your heart upon your saving belief, bringing His Spirit to birth in you, God has done this work and NOTHING can change that. We do not die in the Spirit as some claim. The Holy Spirit is eternal, and when we are born of the Holy Spirit, we are eternally indwelled.
Confused, when you say you were "saved" I'm am assuming that you:
-saw that you were a vile sinner deserving of hell,
-repented (turned from sin) and trusted in Jesus Christ taking your punishment for your sin to pay your sin debt.
If so upon your saving faith,God worked a miracle in your heart giving you a new one full of His Holy Spirit. You are saved, forever.
Dear Confused: I would like the opportunity to speak with you about the state of your soul. This is not the proper forum, but let me know if you are interested and I will find an alternate method for proper communication.
"he convincingly implies that God's children do not sin and I struggle"
John's first epistle was written to sons of God (1 John 3:2) who had eternal life (1 John 5:13):
If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us. (1 Jn 1:8-10)
Do you keep God's commandments?
And hereby we know that we are of the truth, and shall assure our hearts before him. For if our heart condemn us, God is greater than our heart, and knoweth all things. Beloved, if our heart condemn us not, then have we confidence toward God. And whatsoever we ask, we receive of him, because we keep his commandments, and do those things that are pleasing in his sight...
And this is his commandment, That we should believe on the name of his Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, as he gave us commandment.
... And he that keepeth his commandments dwelleth in him, and he in him. And hereby we know that he abideth in us, by the Spirit which he hath given us. (1 Jn 3:19-24)
If you keep God's commandments you do so by His Spirit. Praise Him for the free gift of Life.
Don't listen to the lies of Satan. He will cheat you out of salvation if he possibly can.
Jesus Christ said , "All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out." (John 6:37)
"If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness." (I John 1:9)
You have desire for God, which shows that you are being drawn by the Father. Every person that has been born of the Spirit struggles against sin. The flesh lusts against the spirit and the spirit lusts against the flesh. (Gal 5:17) Temptation is a struggle against sin and a trying of our faith.
There hath no temptation taken you but such as is common to man: but God is faithful, who will not suffer you to be tempted above that ye are able; but will with the temptation also make a way to escape, that ye may be able to bear it. (I Cor 10:13)
Be encouraged in the Lord and know that He hears the cry of every penitent soul.
My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous: (I John 2:1)
Believe it or not, it was through none other that Mr Camping's ministery that I was "saved" in 1984 and very dramatically so. Ironically, now I don't even know whether I am or not because he convincingly implies that God's children do not sin and I struggle... so am I saved or not? As a result of this confusion, I feel like all my hope is gone and perhaps I am not "Elect" afterall since I seem to slip up so easily. Now I am just depressed everyday... I mean what's left in life if Christ won't save me??? I am hurt and angry and devastated and afraid. HELP!
You forget that they called Christ a heretic, a blastphemer, being posessed of the devel... Ect. With Truth, comes controversy.
Camping doesn't want people to stop going to church... Camping is declaring what he believes the Bible is teaching in the end times regarding the church... "...Come out of her, my people, lest you share in her sins, and lest you receive of her plagues." Rev. 18: 4
Of course, there is much more than this... And it's not very pretty. So then, what shall we do??? Throw our hands up in the air and say "he's a heritic" and ignore what he is trying to bring to light? Or maybe try to investigate it for ourselves to see if there is any truth to the matter?
What's next? There is no 'next'... THE END is next... We are at the very end... That is the whole point of the end of the Church Age. We are to look to God and the Bible for our guidance (not outside of it). The 'rules' as you speak of - are already laid out for us in the Bible. But we look to PEOPLE for our guidance instead of the Bible - which is what has gotten us into trouble in the first place. The Bible IS the authority, not a person. And to your comment about a 'Clear, concise guidance & instruction to God's people'... SINCE WHEN HAS ANY MESSAGE IN THE BIBLE BEEN CLEAR AND CONCISE?????? Most of God's word is spoken of in Parables, mysteries and metaphors - so that hearing they may not hear, and seeing they may not see or understand.
Even if Camping is wrong about his conclusions - he makes some interesting points regarding the churches of today which can't be ignored. Those of you who choose to 'shoot the messenger' are missing the message. Christ demonstrated is anger in the Temple's when he turned over tables of the money changers... He warned the 7 churches in Rev. that they were going astray and they were less than 100 yrs. old. What makes you think that we have gotten it any better today? What makes you think that God won't judge the churches in the end times?
Okay, let's say hypothetically that the church era has ended. Okay where in scripture do I find clear, concise guidance and instruction to God's people as to what comes next or replaces it?
When the time came for the Levitical economy to end, after the crucifiction of Christ, God rent the temple to show that that era had ended in Christ. We then receive clear instruction by Holy men of God as to what comes next--the church, with Elders, Deacons, Pastors, etc. However, I find no such guidance or instruction that says what follows this "end of the church age". Since those offices are now gone, what has replaced them? If you can't find it in scripture (and you can't), it then means that you have to go outside of the Bible as your authority and make up your own rules (i.e. fellowships, no Lord's Table, etc.), which is what Camping has done. What are the rules and direction when these "saints" come together. Can women preach? Can they lead the prayer service? You have to have an authority for such things.
I trust the Bible as my authority and not the heresy of a prideful man. A man who is mixing grace with works, which is always a recipe for failure.
You are correct in saying the gates of hell shall not prevail against His church (the True believers). But the Bible CLEARLY teaches in the end times that "Satan will take his seat in the Temple" (the Temple made by hands). You cannot just take a few verses here and there and stick to your argument with addressing the other verses that clearly controdict your conclusions. I'm sure there were those who told John the Baptist to take a hike back in his day also... Or Noah for that matter. Would you be one of the people pounding on the door as the floods came? Can't you see that this is no different? Can't you see that the churches have all gone their own way?