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Mike wrote: Norman Geisler: "Faith is something we "do"
Mike your friend Norman is obviously misguided. Here is some truth teaching for him.
Art 1/9 "This election was not founded upon foreseen faith, and the obedience of faith, holiness, or any other good quality of disposition in man, as the pre-requisite, cause or condition on which it depended; but men are chosen to faith and to the obedience of faith, holiness, etc., therefore election is the fountain of every saving good; from which proceed faith, holiness, and the other gifts of salvation, and finally eternal life itself, as its fruits and effects, according to that of the apostle: "He hath chosen us (not because we were) but that we should be holy, and without blame, before him in love," Eph 1:4."
Art 3/14 "Faith is therefore to be considered as the gift of God, not on account of its being offered by God to man, to be accepted or rejected at his pleasure; but because it is in reality conferred, breathed, and infused into him; ...... because he who works in man both to will and to do, and indeed all things in all, produces both the will to believe, and the act of believing also." (Canons of Dordt)
Mike wrote: A tulip view, bro. But not Mr. Calvin's: Commentary on Eph. 2:9 9. Not of works. Instead of what he had said, that their salvation is of grace, he now affirms, that "it is the gift of God." Instead of what he had said, â€śNot of yourselves,â€ť he now says, â€śNot of works.â€ť Hence we see, that the apostle leaves ***nothing*** to men in procuring salvation. In these three phrases, â€” not of yourselves, â€” it is the gift of God, â€” not of works,..... I agree with Calvin. Amazing, eh?
Come on now Mike. Your arguement is to seek to establish that FAITH is NOT the GIFT /- 'A' GIFT!
Nobody considers salvation to be of human source.
But as you have quoted Calvin states, "Hence we see, that the apostle leaves nothing to men in procuring salvation"
*NOTHING* - Thus FAITH is a gift of God.
Since.. 1Pet 1:5 Who are kept by the power of God through faith unto salvation ready to be revealed in the last time. 9 Receiving the end of your faith, even the salvation of your souls
# AND Jesus said; And he said to the woman, Thy faith hath saved thee; go in peace. And Jesus said unto him, Receive thy sight: thy faith hath saved thee.
Mike wrote: It is not faith that is being contrasted with works in the verses, but salvation by grace.
Oh dear Mike. For almost six years now I've been trying to teach you the truth! What am I going to do with you.
Michael Hranek wrote: Did you receive (if you actualy have received) the Holy Spirit in His fulness through the doctrines of Calvinism or as a gift by faith in Jesus Christ
Michael Human "Receive" implies WORKS BASED religion like your friend Benny 16.
The "GIFT" which the elect are provided with is FAITH per Eph 2:8. That is the Holy Spirit working in your heart. Sinners make NO contribution to this since they are stone cold dead in sin. As Jesus teaches, Michael, its more Biblical to leave God in charge like this, "44 No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day." And "65 Therefore said I unto you, that no man can come unto me, except it were given unto him of my Father."
By faith, the Calvinist can perceive that Calvinism IS the Gospel.
Michael Hranek wrote: There is alot one might do to "Be Saved By God and For God!" in things such as: First - They can observe the witness God gives of His existence in the Universe He Himself by Himself alone has made. Second - They can heed the witness of their own conscience in what is right and wrong before our God He has given them in their own conscience. Third - They can go with the drawing of the Spirit Fourth - They can listen to what God Himself says to us in the Bible AND apply their mind and heart to what He says
Ah the Pope will be proud of you Michael.
The papist doctrine of salvation by works appears to have remained and stuck well with you in your move from the RCC.
Like your brother Jacob Arminius, it has clearly become an old popish conviction you just couldn't give up.
Election is a term used in the Arminian camp as being in the hands of God, BUT clearly God needs help from Michael and co - otherwise it doesn't work.
Well at least you gave up the worship of old bones and other relics. Thanks be for small mercies eh Michael.
Michael Hranek wrote: The New Testament Covenant is individual and experiential whereby believers come to know God personally in the New Birth in the Spirit
Regeneration is a work of the Holy Spirit occurring at salvation, Godâ€™s terms being repentance and faith in Jesus Christ. And you must be born again
The Church made up of all regenerated believers is not Israel and Israel is not The Church
The Arminian is always so near - yet so far!
As Paul stated not all Israel is Israel. 5 Even so then at this present time also there is a remnant according to the election of grace.
27 For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins. 28 As concerning the gospel, they are enemies for your sakes: but as touching the election, they are beloved for the fathers' sakes. 29 For the gifts and calling of God are without repentance.
18 Boast not against the branches. But if thou boast, thou bearest not the root, but the root thee. 19 Thou wilt say then, The branches were broken off, that I might be graffed in. 20 Well; because of unbelief they were broken off, and thou standest by faith. Be not highminded, but fear: 21 For if God spared not the natural branches, take heed lest he also spare not thee.