John UK wrote: ...One thing I know, and if I have any goodness or some holy thought, I will not attribute it to myself, but to God's grace. I can only say, I am what I am by the grace of God.
"What do you have that you have not received?" Amen and amen. Let me testify brothers that having struggled fruitlessly in my own power against sin for too long, and having then seen in some measure the power of the Spirit to break the chains, that ALL OF THE GLORY FOR "OUR" GOODNESS BELONGS TO HIM! All praises to God, and none to us -- He must increase, and we must decrease.
Truly all that is vile in me is my own doing and fault, and all that is Christlike is of Christ. How else can all of the glory go to Him and none to me? And, thanks alone to His grace, this is indeed how I would have it. Praise God!
Let us continue to sincerely pray for transformed desires and motives that will bring honor to our King. It is a prayer that will be heard and answered.
America wrote: TB, Agreed with your posts. This has been our experience also in most congregations from pulpit to pew.Start talking about holiness and sanctification and you are usually told you are legalistic or trying to earn heaven. Was a blessing to read your posts.
Thank you America. It's an encouragement that there's a remnant which takes this seriously. It should be the cry of our hearts in prayer before God that we would hate our sin -- that's the kind of prayer He will answer. I can't imagine that the 80% who view porn weekly have been praying this way...
I love how God says "I have reserved 7,000 who have not bowed their knee to Baal." May we be reserved too, to not bow our knee to the Baals of our world!
John UK wrote: TB, there are some, including those of the RCC, who believe we are "being saved", by which they mean that salvation is not fixed at conversion, and that salvation is a process which requires certain things from us...
Those truly justified are born again once and forever into God's family -- "no one can snatch them out of My hand". That said, those truly justified are walking in some measure of sanctification -- "My sheep hear My voice". Those who are not led by the Spirit of God do not have the Spirit of God and are not His (Romans 8.)
With regard to imputed or declared righteousness (justification) and being translated out of the kingdom of darkness and into the kingdom of the Son we are saved once and for all time. In the sense of the sanctification that must necessarily follow true justification there is a cooperative process between the Spirit of God and ourselves. It is in this sense that I use the term "being saved" -- I'm not using it in the sense of adding to the cross of Christ to remain adopted into His family.
But these are basics.
Moving on from the milk... It would be nice if the declared righteous sheep of His could stand up for practiced righteousness without being castigated as works-salvationists.
John UK wrote: I don't hearken to pastors like that, and neither should you. Find a better church, or form your own. Preach repentance and holiness, faith and faithfulness, and get your people out on the streets obeying the great commission. Be not afraid of being cast into prison, or crucified for your stand. Be all out for Jesus, and do not listen to the gainsayers who do not have a heart for the gospel nor for people in great need. Do plenty of good in this world, give away any excess cash, and cast your bread upon the waters, as you will see it after many days. Be a winsome revivalist, and win battles against the devil, saving the church from shooting itself.
Amen to that.
And may all those being sanctified lift up the call to holiness unashamedly in Christ's church and without opposition from the saints. Just because there are those who corrupt the Gospel of grace into a "gospel" of works/self-righteousness does not mean those who are being saved should ever back down from the call to holiness, much less oppose it!
John UK wrote: Ha! There is a world of difference in believing in being spotless, and actually being spotless. Which one are you talking about?
Clearly I am talking about taking a serious stand against our own sin and striving by the Spirit for personal holiness in conduct.
John UK wrote: As for admonishing posters on here, and preaching at them, I suggest you go out and win some converts for yourself, and preach to them.
Thank you for the advice. It would be wonderful if that's all I needed to do, but alas, 80% of church-going men love their porn, and, coincidentally, approximately that percentage also rage against the admonishing of holiness among SermonAudio participants.
John UK wrote: Now in case you didn't ever hear the gospel...
Thank you for the reminder! I can't get enough of the Good News!
John UK wrote: You really believe that pastors are not teaching against sin among God's elect? Or are you relating to liberal and modernist "churches"?
Yes, I really believe that. Look at the stats man. How many porn perusing pastors do you imagine preach against porn?
John UK wrote: 2. Wow that's one big strawman! You think all of God's elect and blood-bought people - his church - "believes in being spotted with sin"?
No, God's elect don't believe in being spotted with sin. You misunderstand me. I'll remind you as you seem to have lost the context: You said mockingly that I believe in being spotless. Yes, I'll admit to that crime. Your belief in being spotted is the obvious implication of your own statement.
Speaking of strawmen:
John UK wrote: ...when you appear before God, I can assure you that you will never mention any of your supposed holiness - the blinding light of God's glory will silence any thought of claiming anything but the mercy of God.
How exactly is admonishing God's people to hate sin and love holiness and make no excuse for their sin to be equated with me mentioning my "supposed holiness" before God. You are attributing attitudes to me of your own imagination.
Rufus wrote: Further, I do not point you to my works to demonstrate that I am saved...
Then you are in further disagreement with the Holy Scriptures: "Show me your faith WITHOUT works, and I'LL SHOW YOU MY FAITH BY MY WORKS"!
Thank you Unprofitable Servant. I agree 100% with what you are saying...
...except this quote:
Unprofitable Servant wrote: ...To quote a famous preacher, it is not the perfection of our life but the direction that matters.
They both matter.
Certainly our perfection DOES matter to God, as His ultimate goal is that we become ultimately perfect in holiness. I hope you agree that this is not the same as saying that here and now you and I walk continuously in perfect holiness to somehow earn our justification. Nevertheless, precisely because it matters so much it should be our goal -- for blood-washed saints it is our destiny.
Look at the Holy Spirit's standard for our walk: "Let fornication be not even MENTIONED among you." Compare that to 80% porn use in the church and you'll understand what I'm trying to communicate!
All this allowance for sin is revolting. Greasy grace that says "oh look, you are preaching sinless perfection!" whenever someone dares to admonish the church against moral filth. I never once said that I don't struggle against sin with the Spirit's help -- I'm just saying that I GIVE NO EXCUSE FOR MY SIN and neither should you! Own your wickedness people and REPENT!
John UK wrote: 1. ...You speak about the big difference between a Christian and a pseudo-Christian. Yes, I agree with that wholeheartedly. 2. It is marvellous to meet someone who believes in remaining SPOTLESS until the coming of the Lord. Wonderful, no less... 3. ...I only have the perfect and imputed righteousness of Jesus Christ in order to be acceptable to God. Maybe I should look for some more thing?
You can mock me... be not deceived, God is not mocked. Your points:
1. That's what I'm talking about, indeed. 2. I do believe in remaining spotless -- it saddens me that the church today believes in being spotted with sin. 3. Look no further than the righteousness and grace of Christ for your perfect justification and necessary sanctification.
Rufus wrote: ...Every moment of every day we choose to walk right or wrong, because we sometimes choose wrong does not mean we are disowned by our father.
Rufus, I agree with this statement and tried to indicate so yesterday, but the system cut me off for talking too much...
Rufus wrote: ...Holiness matters, not for eternal salvation...
Your controversy is with the Bible: "Without holiness no one will see the Lord."
John UK wrote: Methinks you are ignoring the scriptures which Rufus has furnished you with, which show that the justified believer does not lead a sinless life.
No, I'm not ignoring those scriptures nor implying that the saved never sin. If you read closely what I said... "Biblically there is a marked difference between a righteous man committing a sin (1st John 1:9) and one who is of the devil and practices sin."
John UK wrote: Methinks also that the Spirit has not yet opened your eyes to the depths of sin in your own life...
With all due respect sir, I don't think you are in a position to judge the work of the Spirit in my life relative to personal sin.
It is not my objective to beat you in a contest of Bible knowledge. My intent is to magnify the necessity of Christ-like purity in a church that grows increasingly wicked. A church that the Son of God died for to present her to Himself SPOTLESS. There is already too much allowance for wickedness; can we not lift up the standard of "holiness, without which no one will see the Lord"?
In my view our issue is that you are equating practical sanctification with self-righteousness. Your conclusion seems to be that since self-righteousness cannot justify us (which I agree with wholeheartedly), therefore sanctification (i.e., the fruits of the Spirit) is optional (which I and the Bible disagree with vehemently.)
Again, the Bible is clear: "Faith without works is dead." A so-called faith that bears no fruit is worthless and cannot save.
Jesus is clear: Branches that bear no fruit are cut off and thrown into the fire.
If I may suggest: Study 1st John chapter 3 and pray over the words "he that practices sin is of the devil." Biblically there is a marked difference between a righteous man committing a sin (1st John 1:9) and one who is of the devil and practices sin. Make sure you know which one you are!
Rufus wrote: ...Sons of God can walk in the flesh or walk after the spirit...
Your controversy is with the Bible, not me.
Bible: If ye live after the flesh ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live. For as many are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.
Also, the rule of the false prophet applies equally to the false professor. I notice too that you ignore Jesus' condemnation of those who practice iniquity who most certainly are just false professors.
I wonder what it is that makes people want to justify sin? What would possibly make someone want to say things like "sons of God can walk in the flesh"? This is a very strange kind of Christ-like purity and deliverance from sin that you espouse.
The Word says "who can speak of His descendants?" There are a number of papyri dating to the first century that are clear that Jesus was not married.
The devil was a liar in the 4th century just like he's a liar today. All he can do is lie about Jesus cause he's already been beat real bad. A lie in the 4th century is no more authoritative than the Davinci Code lie of the 21st century...
Jesus is still the TRUTH. The devil's still a LIAR.
Totally disingenuous -- The main article compares fifteenth century Wycliffe translating Latin "Deus" to English "God" which is called TRANSLATION and was completely valid -- it tries to equate this with modern day revisionists REMOVING Jesus as the "Son of God" and BLASPHEMING the Father by calling Him "Allah" in order to appease Chrislam. Disgusting and completely untrue -- there is no equivalency.
Using Google is asking for gov't profiling. Try searching with www.duckduckgo.com -- they're all about privacy and anonymity and feature various tools (such as the ghostery browser) which help to shrink your Internet footprint.