Jim Lincoln wrote: John Y., Mormonism provisionally accepts the Bible as the Word of God and in certain ways believes in the atonement of Christ.
No Mormonism doesn't believe in the atonement of Christ because they don't worship Jesus as God, they don't believe that Jesus is God. So stop making statements about Mormonism that they believe any historic Christian doctrine. There is not one historic Christian doctrine that Mormonism believes in.
Observer wrote: It's not even the Altar call that is the problem, it's the nature of the 'faith' that you possess silly. I don't agree with Altar calls and sinners prayers etc. but I don't deny that some people do get saved that way. So when did you find out that their Face Book accounts are locked, eh?
Today when I loged out and tried to access their Facebook pages. The nature of my faith is trusting in Jesus alone for salvation. I don't trust in the RCC or the Sacraments for salvation.
Observer wrote: Anyone here spotted me saying any such thing? Since you've so clearly lied I'm gonna have to refer them to this site to see for themselves what I have said.
You stated that if their faith is the same as mine that they don't possess saving faith. Well they were saved during an Altar Call. So I guess their faith is the same as mine. It is only fair to warn you that you won't be able to send a message to my Nephew and Niece In-Law since their Facebook pages are locked to anybody who is not a friend of theirs.
Observer wrote: Really?! I never imply anything. I speak my mind. What you mean is that you read that into something I said. All I have ever maintained is that your "faith" is not saving faith and that if their "faith" is the same as yours then it follows that they too do not possess saving faith either. As for them not knowing that you post on here, you've already mentioned my post on here so it's only fair I point out what you maintain on here.
I did not state the name of this website or you in particular. All I stated was that on a discussion forum there are Evangelical Protestants who believe that Pentecostals most likely don't possess saving faith. I did not even state that I post on here.
Observer wrote: Forgot to mention that I'll be pointing out to them that you've lied about what I was saying to you, and that they can check out my postings on here. Also the fact that you're not bothered by your lying. Now that you think you have your ticket to heaven even honesty ain't that important, eh John?
I did not lie about what you stated. You implied that my Nephew and Niece In-Law are not saved because they attend a Pentecostal Church. I don't wish my Nephew and Niece In-Law to know that I post on here.
Observer wrote: I don't need to. If their 'faith' has had the same effect on them as yours has had on you, then you're all deluded and will perish in your sins.
If they have the same 'faith' as you, they ain't Christians!
You told on me?! I'm quaking in ma boots. Arghhhh! When did I ever say that they're not saved because they are Pentecostals? JY you're now adding lying and misrepresentation to your delusion! Tell you what, you give me their Face Book IDs and I will tell them directly what I've been saying to you. I ain't scared if doing that.
My Nephew's name is Brad Bergman and my Niece In-Law's name is Glenda Bergman. But I don't wish to be brought up in your message to my Nephew and Niece In-Law.
Observer wrote: Yeah, I maintain that you're a complete stranger to the Christian life. You haven't a clue. You demonstrate no signs of the new life that the Holy Spirit imparts at conversion. You are merely a product of quick prayerism and easy believism. Re: your nephew and niece-in-law - Figures! You must make a cosy bunch of unbelievers.
Look up the website for First Church of God of Tulare, California and see their Statement of Faith. And then come back and state if you can that my Nephew and Niece In-Law are not saved. They are better Christians then you will ever hope to be. I told my Nephew and Niece In-Law on Facebook what you stated about them not being saved and they stated that you have a lot of nerve stating that because they are Pentecostals that they are not saved. Pentecostal Churches preach the biblical doctrine that salvation comes only through trusting in Jesus alone for salvation.
Observer wrote: Utter tripe JY! You haven't a clue what true saving faith is. Your faith is no different to that possessed by a nominal Christian, and you will share in the fate of such. I'm done with you, because you are a blind, ignorant and careless man intent on ending up in hell. So be it.
The Bible states that salvation is by Justification By Faith Alone which means trust in Jesus alone for salvation. And then you have the audacity to state that I don't know what is required for salvation? I have a Nephew and Niece In-Law from Tulare, California who are Pentecostals who attend First Church of God of Tulare, California and they were also saved during an Altar Call. And First Church of God of Tulare, California has Altar Calls to get individuals saved.
Observer wrote: Just more blah blah blah.... I say Cloud is right, because I am old enough to know that what he says about how Baptist churches have changed is spot on. The fact that you'd rather believe erring baptists and attend an RCC church speaks volumes about your standing with God. You ain't no believer pal. You have a dry arid cranial faith, which is not saving faith. You have no genuine experience of conversion, or a work of the Holy Spirit. Kid yourself all you want. You're hell bound, unless you hid the warning, YE MUST BE BORN AGAIN! But you've been told this a thousand times by thousands of different people. You'd rather believe they're all wrong cos you're too cosy in your unbelief! As for my views about Presbys, this is just a rabbit hole diversion tactic, so I ain't gonna
My Non Denominational brother, his minister and everybody at that church was prompted by the Holy Spirit during Altar Calls to start trusting in Jesus alone for salvation, which is what the Bible states is the way that salvation comes about. My Non Denominational brother and his minister accept that I am saved because I trust in Jesus alone for salvation.
DJC49 wrote: In other words, you are fearful of being kicked out of the "Synogogue of Satan" ... so you shut your piehole. I wouldn't want you with me in a foxhole in times of heavy persecution, John.
In otherwords I am shy and I don't like to engage in verbal communication with individuals that often. And that is why I inform individuals via written communication that salvation comes only through trusting in Jesus alone for salvation. Who says that verbal communication is the only means of informing individuals that salvation comes only through trusting in Jesus alone for salvation? If I were with you in a foxhole in time of heavy persecution I would have a pamphlet stating that salvation comes only through trusting in Jesus alone for salvation and I would give you one of those pamphlets.
Observer, I read that article on quick prayerism. But who says that Cloud is correct on that particular subject? One would not pray to Jesus to start trusting in Him alone for salvation unless the Holy Spirit prompted them to do so. My brother's Non Denominational minister, my brother and everybody at that church got saved during an Altar Call and started trusting in Jesus alone for salvation. So you think Presbyterians are not saved either? What arrogance.
Manson's followers thought that he was the Messiah come again. Manson will never be paroled. Neither will Watson and Krensinkel be paroled. The only former follower of Manson who even has a ghost of a chance at winning parole is Van Houten. And even that is a very slim chance.
Observer wrote: That don't cut it. You ascribing something to the Holy Spirit don't make it so. What you describe is so superficial that it would be an insult to ascribe it to the Holy Spirit! Which is why YE MUST BE BORN AGAIN!
The Bible states that it is the Holy Spirit who prompts individuals to come to Jesus and start trusting in Him alone for salvation. That is basic Baptist teaching. That is how all Baptists are saved by the prompting of the Holy Spirit to start trusting in Jesus alone for salvation. My Born Again Non Denominational brother was saved in the same way that I was by the prompting of the Holy Spirit to start trusting in Jesus alone for salvation.
Observer wrote: Where's your conversion testimony JY?
In November 1997 during an Altar Call at my brother's Non Denominational Church I was prompted by the Holy Spirit to start trusting in Jesus alone for salvation. I was previously prompted by the Holy Spirit to start trusting in Jesus alone for salvation but I kept putting it off. I decided then during that Altar Call to heed the prompting of the Holy Spirit and start trusting in Jesus alone for salvation.
Unprofitable Servant wrote: John Y, I must not be the great communicator as you seem to not answer my questions. 1. if a person was in the RCC and trying to bring others to salvation, what would happen to that individual once the church found out his activities?? 2. Also, are you in your RCC church, not blogs, IN THE RCC you attend, telling the lost that they are being deceived by the RCC and need to be born again? Remember it was you not I that brought up evangelizing Catholics within the church, you said nothing about blogs.
If a Catholic would be crazy enough to verbally communicate instead of via written communication to other Catholics that salvation comes only through trusting in Jesus alone for salvation then they would depending upon who the priest was would probably be told by the priest to cease receiving Holy Communion. And no naturally I do not verbally communicate to Catholics in my parish that salvation comes only through trusting in Jesus alone for salvation as that really is insane. I prefer to inform other Catholics via written communication that salvation comes only through trusting in Jesus alone for salvation.
John UK wrote: The Episcopal Church is a true church because it worships Jesus as God, and any church which worships Jesus as God is a true church. So who do you think you are saying you will have nothing to do with them. And what does abortion or women priests have to do with getting to heaven? Don't you know that all that God requires is to embrace Jesus as your Saviour, no matter what church you attend so long as that church worships Jesus as God? Besides, you could have said, "I don't want to have anything to do with the Roman Catholic Church, because it has daily magic-show priests who cannot in reality produce the body and blood of the Son of God, which is blasphemous transubstantiation; and I cannot stand it when they pray or sing to Mary, nor can I stand it when they fetch all those old bones out of the reliquary to show them off, besides which they anathematise me for believing justification by faith alone in Christ alone, even though I keep it secret, besides which the Jesuits are after me, blah blah blah......" Tripe, John!
I am a conservative Republican who is against abortion and homosexuality. So naturally I would not wish to worship at a church that supports abortion and homosexuality.
Observer wrote: You have a terrible case of rebellion and your pretext to keep up your profession of faith is chronic shyness. The only reason why you will not join a sound church is because you know only too well that you would have to come under its discipline!! Common to everyone converted by quick prayerism you want to maintain your profession of faith in Christ and your self determination. You cannot have it both ways. You cannot have Christ as Lord and still maintain self rule. That is why YE MUST BE BORN AGAIN!
Even if I were to attend an Evangelical Protestant Church I would not discuss my beliefs or anything else with the minister as it would not be any of his business what my beliefs are. According to Baptist doctrine I am saved because I trust in Jesus alone for salvation. Are you stating that if one attends an Evangelical Protestant Church and does not engage in verbal communication with the minister and others and don't get involved in church activities that they can't possibly be saved?
Mr. Marty McD wrote: Neil. Please read my posts. I know who started the war. Also, I know Lincoln won a fair election. My point, ad nauseum, the war was avoidable and unnecessary. I don't justify slave owners. But, this cataclysmic event didn't need to happen. As a modest offering, Lincoln could of maintained the Union by not seeking office, and there would of been no new orphans and widows. Also assuredly, slavery in the south would of ended before 1900, as with almost every other Occidental nation. Millions of dead and maimed Christians, thousands of orphans and widows, unrivaled property destruction, centralisation of power, statism, and a racial tear that has never been healed are all legacies of his activities. Ok, so Jefferson Davis was bad too, so what? You're not in public defending that villain, but you do defend Lincoln. Who's next Mandela, FDR or some other progressive hero?
If Lincoln had compromised then slavery would have continued.
John UK wrote: Don't you have an American equivalent of the Church of England? The services are liturgical, the creeds are recited along with the Lord's Prayer, there are no lengthy sermons, and people tend to isolate themselves. You would be able to take communion without shutting your ears to some of it. What is wrong with that?
I don't want to have anything to do with the Episcopal Church because the Episcopal Church ordains women to the preisthood and supports abortion and homosexuality.
Observer wrote: Commenting seriously on your fine thoughts - so you're saying that if the Father says to do something and we don't do it, then all our insistence that we love him means nothing? The true children of God live to please him and wish to be like him? In conclusion someone who professes to love God but thinks that disobedience is okay is deluded? JY thinks that he has a ticket to heaven and can disobey to his heart's content. Can we believe him when he says he trusts Christ?
And what would you suggest someone who is shy do? Attend an Evangelical Protestant Church in which they don't like the non liturgical worship services just because you guys have the mistaken notion that trusting in Jesus alone for salvation is not the only requirement for salvation and entering Heaven upon ones demise? The Bible states that Justification By Faith(Trusting in Jesus alone for salvation) is the only requirement for salvation and entering Heaven upon ones demise. Even if I were to attend an Evangelical Protestant Church I sure would not engage in verbal communication with anybody and I would not be involved in any church activities like men's group, etc. I sure would not discuss my beliefs with the minister as it is none of his business.