Yes, this is why I brought up the whole business of being reconciled to God. It amazes me that there are multitudes of church people who say they have been reconciled to God, and yet they do not claim to be reconciled to God, in the sense that they do not "walk with God" or "talk with God" or enjoy "sweet fellowship with God" or "hear God's voice". The spiritual book, the Song of Songs, is a mystery to them. They know not what it means to be "led by the Spirit of God".
It is a tragic thing to be misled into thinking they are elect for the reasons John Calvin put forward (which were discussed in detail not so long ago), and it is doubly tragic that scripture doesn't seem to hold any clout with them, as they like to just ignore it.
But it is the most sensible thing in the world, to receive God's words, to hearken to them, to do what God says to do, to be totally submissive to God, and spend time thinking about the Doctrine of Total Abandonment, and then abandon themselves totally to the Lordship of Jesus Christ, lest he say to them, "Why call ye me Lord, Lord, and never do what I say for you to do."
Michael Hranek wrote: Absolutely my brother Straight is the gate and narrow (difficult) is the way that leads to life it so involves denying ourselves taking up our crosses DAILY loving Jesus Christ more than our closest and most precious and intimate friends, family, children or even our spouse Something we can only walk in by the mercy and grace of God His good, acceptable and perfect will for us in Christ AND a real filling of the Holy Ghost whereby the word of Christ richly dwells within us IT WILL COST YOU EVERYTHING! Dr. Steven J. Lawson Fools despise what it means and costs to truly belong entirely to Jesus Christ as His Disciple, hating the Truth that those who are NOT His Disciples , are NOT His sheep, who hear His voice and lovingly follow Him, do NOT Genuienly know Him in the new Birth are still unregenerate no matter how religous they are, no matter how great their excuses for their unrepent unbelief and continual defiling disobedience
Listened last night, bro. Very good portrayal of normal Christianity. Church seems to have forgotten these things.
John Yurich USA wrote: Well "We acknowledge one baptism for the forgiveness of sins." means that the RCC believes that Baptism imparts salvation. But of course I don't accept that Baptism imparts salvation.
Thank you John. So what does that mean for the vast majority of Catholics who believe that through their baptism they are now saved?
tell the truth wrote: Your deceit is prolific John. You have lied again by omission. Now tell the truth.
Mr Spurgeon said, "They (the arminian)seek to make the man stand up: we seek to bring him down, and make him feel that there he lies in the hand of God, and that his business is to submit himself to God, and cry aloud, 'Lord, save, or we perish.' "
So Mr Spurgeon seeks to.... 1. Bring him down 2. Make him FEEL that there he lies in the hand of God 3. That his business is to submit himself to God 4. That he should cry aloud, "Lord save, or we perish."
Well that is mighty fine. That is just how I was converted, and there is no gainsaying it, because that is precisely what happened.
This is why I'm a Baptist not a Goosebumper.
And you can call me all the names under the sun, it will never change the facts. What's up, do you want to be a disciple of Jesus too?
Beware false witnesses wrote: "What the Arminian wants to do is to arouse man's activity: what we want to do is to kill it once for all---to show him that he is lost and ruined, and that his activities are not now at all equal to the work of conversion; that he must look upward. They seek to make the man stand up: we seek to bring him down, and make him feel that there he lies in the hand of God, and that his business is to submit himself to God, and cry aloud, 'Lord, save, or we perish.' We hold that man is never so near grace as when he begins to feel he can do nothing at all. When he says, 'I can pray, I can believe, I can do this, and I can do the other,' marks of self-sufficiency and arrogance are on his brow." (Charles H. Spurgeon)
You should read Mr Spurgeon more closely, Moniker Man.
What does he say the sinner ought to do?
1. Submit himself to God 2. Cry aloud to God 3. Ask God to save
These three are mighty fine, and what Mr Spurgeon aimed at getting from all his preaching of the gospel, that men should lay down their weapons of rebellion against God, and to pray and seek God's forgiveness, saying, "God be merciful to me, a sinner."
Frank wrote: I have a favorite expression that theology is so simple when we leave it on the pages of our bibles, but it becomes soooo much more complicated when we put it into practice. But assuming that TULIP is the same as perceptive, then perhaps he has answered me when he referred to my earlier post.
Changing moniker all the time never did do his proclamations any good. And I tend to think of anonymous posters as trolls anyway.
Mike wrote: What do you think, bro? Are there not many "if-then" scenarios in Scripture? How is it some think God cannot be sovereign if he allows that which he allows and has written in black and white?
Brother Mike, I have seen countless if-then scenarios in the Bible, as have you and most other Bible readers. How anybody can imagine that God was playing games with men is beyond me. But then, if they are the sort that play at church, maybe that's where they get it from. But God is not amused by their ignoring his exhortations.
Revelation 3:20 is another one, but they ignore it, saying it is for the church not sinners. Eh? I thought they WERE the church. See how confused they get?
Be watchful wrote: (1) God's forgiveness is possible IF ..... (2) God's forgiveness is possible if YOU... (3) God's forgiveness is possible if you WILL. . . .
Acts 2:37-38 KJV (37) Now when they heard this, they were pricked in their heart, and said unto Peter and to the rest of the apostles, Men and brethren, what shall we do? (38) Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
Luke 24:46-47 KJV (46) And said unto them, Thus it is written, and thus it behoved Christ to suffer, and to rise from the dead the third day: (47) And that repentance and remission of sins should be preached in his name among all nations, beginning at Jerusalem.
Ooooooh look, repentance seems to be connected to the forgiveness of sins.
Acts 7:51 KJV (51) Ye stiffnecked and uncircumcised in heart and ears, ye do always resist the Holy Ghost: as your fathers did, so do ye.
Revelation 22:17 KJV (17) And the Spirit and the bride say, Come. And let him that heareth say, Come. And let him that is athirst come. And whosoever will, let him take the water of life freely.
Dorcas wrote: John Y wrote... None of the Protestant Reformers believed that... Here's a few names for you to study about what they believed concerning satanic Rome. ------- John Wycliffe John Huss William Tyndale John Hooper Rowland Taylor Bishop Ridley Bishop Latimer All were martyred by your religion that you come on here to defend and lie about.
Amen Dorcas, we shall not forget them. Well, we won't so long as we keep them in mind and remind ourselves about what is was all about. It is none less than a spiritual war, and we shall never give in to the impostor of Rome.
Beware false witnesses wrote: We hold that man is never so near grace as when he begins to feel he can do nothing at all. When he says, 'I can pray, I can believe, I can do this, and I can do the other,' marks of self-sufficiency and arrogance are on his brow. (Charles H. Spurgeon)
Very true, as the good ol' Baptist says.
But not true for the saints, who say.....
Philippians 4:13 KJV (13) I can do all things through Christ which strengtheneth me.
Frank wrote: And of course there are nuances to open theism as there is with Arminianism or Calvinism. An extreme open theist would simply say that "nothing" has been determined by God in eternity because God gave mankind free will to thwart anything He does. He must always react to us in our dynamic time because He doesn't appeal to His foreknowledge or sovereignty, although some of them allow for Him to use His foreknowledge. By the way, it also confused me and I did a study of it. I don't mind theorizing about things as long as we realize it is theorizing and we don't try to force our blocks into holes they don't belong in.
In the passage I quoted, which I could have quoted any of the letters to the churches by God's dictation, the church at Ephesus was commended for certain things, and warned about other things. They obviously didn't heed the warnings, as I think I'm right in saying that Jesus removed the church from Ephesus, that is, he shut it down.
Frank wrote: If God doesnâ€™t know what we are going to do and is dependent on what we do before He can act, then that is open theism. In other words, He chooses to work only in dynamic time and has forfeited the right to act against what His creation does. He becomesâ€śdependentâ€ť on us for His ultimate decisions. The verses you quoted would not be the best, but they certainly would be used by them to support their thoughts.
Thanks Pilgrim, I had not come across the term before, and it seems to be gaining adherents in the last couple of decades. It's a bit beyond me, like a lot of these theological theorisings.
Revelation 2:1-7 KJV (1) Unto the angel of the church of Ephesus write; These things saith he that holdeth the seven stars in his right hand, who walketh in the midst of the seven golden candlesticks; (2) I know thy works, and thy labour, and thy patience, and how thou canst not bear them which are evil: and thou hast tried them which say they are apostles, and are not, and hast found them liars: (3) And hast borne, and hast patience, and for my name's sake hast laboured, and hast not fainted. (4) Nevertheless I have somewhat against thee, because thou hast left thy first love. (5) Remember therefore from whence thou art fallen, and repent, and do the first works; or else I will come unto thee quickly, and will remove thy candlestick out of his place, except thou repent. (6) But this thou hast, that thou hatest the deeds of the Nicolaitans, which I also hate. (7) He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; To him that overcometh will I give to eat of the tree of life, which is in the midst of the paradise of God.
Michael Hranek wrote: Absolutely my brother Straight is the gate and narrow (difficult) is the way that leads to life it so involves denying ourselves taking up our crosses DAILY loving Jesus Christ more than our closest and most precious and intimate friends, family, children or even our spouse Something we can only walk in by the mercy and grace of God His good, acceptable and perfect will for us in Christ AND a real filling of the Holy Ghost whereby the word of Christ richly dwells within us IT WILL COST YOU EVERYTHING! Dr. Steven J. Lawson Fools despise what it means and costs to truly belong entirely to Jesus Christ as His Disciple...
Thanks Bro, I have just downloaded the message, and will be listening to it very shortly. So looking forward to that!
Michael Hranek wrote: Paul wrote much to encourage us in the living of our faith, in loving others, even those who hate us, he knew first had the worst (chief) of sinners could be saved and at the same time the heartache some in their unbelief and rebellion against God never will be See 1 Timothy 4:13-16 " ......... for in doing this thou shalt both save thyself, and them that hear thee."
Amen Saint Michael, all good points in your post.
I was thinking also of....
2 Corinthians 5:11 KJV (11) Knowing therefore the terror of the Lord, we persuade men; but we are made manifest unto God; and I trust also are made manifest in your consciences.
The word translated "persuade" means "convince by argument", and it is noticeable that all good preachers seek to do this, following after the Apostle Paul's example.
I've actually heard one Goosebump sermon from the pew, and it was not very tasty. In fact it was downright nasty. No wonder there were no converts, and the church closed down shortly after.
Now wait and see who comes along to call me an arminist because I believe the Bible.
Ah well, the good preachers spend much time with the Lord, they prepare what they say, and they prepare themselves, it is very hard work.
"A California attorney has proposed a controversial ballot initiative that calls for the execution of homosexuals. Matt McLaughlin's Sodomite Suppression Act also bans advocating for LGBT rights to minors, punishable by a $1 million fine, up to 10 years in prison, and expulsion from the state.
The Orange County lawyer paid a $200 filing fee to sponsor the initiative, and California Attorney General Kamala Harris will likely grant it a title and summary, according to Vox. If McLaughlin can secure at least 365,000 signatures, the initiative could appear on the ballot in November 2016. ..."
Well, if I lived in California, I would sign it. When sodomy was illegal, these perverts kept a low profile. Maybe it can happen again.
It just goes to show that a good translation is important. The Good News Bible which I quoted from earlier had "will win", whereas the KJV has "may win".
1 Peter 3:1-2 KJV (1) Likewise, ye wives, be in subjection to your own husbands; that, if any obey not the word, they also may without the word be won by the conversation of the wives; (2) While they behold your chaste conversation coupled with fear.
But the point I was making, and which the Apostle was making, is that a godly lifestyle can WIN someone to Christ. It's plain as pie to me, as that is what the text is saying.
Of course, I realise that some will argue and say that it doesn't fit in with their personal idea of how God works in the human heart. Well, you know what to do with your personal idea, don't you? Eh, Moniker Man Hyperman?
I have known Christian ladies who obeyed their non-Christian husbands, only if their husband was in keeping with the law of God. Won't happen. And conflicts are not conducive to persuading people about The Faith.