Kev wrote: Any more interesting bible studies there brother?
Wonderful instruction by a Brother. Heed Brother Observers advice!
Back to the smooth stones. You made mention of a verse...
1 Peter 2:4 To whom coming, as unto a living stone, disallowed indeed of men, but chosen of God, and precious,
A living stone.
Why is the term "living stone" used here?
Isaiah 57:6 6 Among the smooth stones of the stream is thy portion; they, they are thy lot: even to them hast thou poured a drink offering, thou hast offered a meat offering. Should I receive comfort in these?
Stones were always used by people for judgment. "stoning"
stones of the stream.
Matthew 3:6 6 And were baptized of him in Jordan, confessing their sins.
Who? John Baptist.
He preached to all of them.(Matt.3:8) Some confessed, repented. Some didn't.
Matthew 3:15 15 And Jesus answering said unto him, Suffer it to be so now: for thus it becometh us to fulfil all righteousness. Then he suffered him.
Hebrews 2:17 17 Wherefore in all things it behoved him to be made like unto his brethren,
Galatians 4:4-5 4 But when the fulness of the time was come, God sent forth his Son, made of a woman, made under the law, 5 To redeem them..
"The law was written in tablets of stone whereas Grace through Faith was written in the stony hearts of man."
Deuteronomy 30:6 6 And the LORD thy God will circumcise thine heart, and the heart of thy seed, to love the LORD thy God with all thine heart, and with all thy soul, that thou mayest live.
Ezekiel 36:26 26 A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh.
Jeremiah 31:33 33 But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.
Law of Faith. Romans 3:27
2 Corinthians 3:6 for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life.
2 Corinthians 3:7 7 But if the ministration of death, written and engraven in stones....
Hebrews 7:19 19 For the law made nothing perfect...
Romans 8:2 2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.
The law of Faith (Romans 3:27) free from death written in stones.
Kev wrote: Hey James gonna study those verses before I answer you. Thanks for the bible study brother.
Your welcome. Take as much time as you need. No rush.
--------------------------- Isaiah 51:4 (KJV) 4 Hearken unto me, my people; and give ear unto me, O my nation: for a law shall proceed from me, and I will make my judgment to rest for a light of the people.
Law of Faith Romans 3:27
Isaiah 51:4 (KJV) 4 Hearken unto me, my people; and give ear unto me, O my nation: for a law shall proceed from me, and I will make my judgment to rest for a light of the people.
John for JESUS wrote: 1) The Philippians were given the opportunity to suffer for Christ. It doesn't show that Paul was forced to believe in God.
2) You bring up a good point. Why did Paul have such zeal for Judaism?
1. There is the part about belief in the verse as well....just like here.
Philippians 1:29 (KJV) 29 For unto you it is given in the behalf of Christ, not only to believe on him, but also to suffer for his sake;
Unto you is given....1. belief 2. suffering.
Jesus spoke of it here too.
John 6:29 (KJV) 29 Jesus answered and said unto them, This is the work of God, that ye believe on him whom he hath sent.
2. Galatians 1:13-14 (KJV) 13 For ye have heard of my conversation in time past in the Jews' religion, how that beyond measure I persecuted the church of God, and wasted it: 14 And profited in the Jews' religion above many my equals in mine own nation, being more exceedingly zealous of the traditions of my fathers.
Mark 7:13 (KJV) 13 Making the word of God of none effect through your tradition, which ye have delivered: and many such like things do ye.
Kev wrote: Sounds good James liked those verses for J4 as well.
Sorry, Thought I would have more time.
Isaiah 57:6 (KJV) 6 Among the smooth stones of the stream is thy portion; they, they are thy lot: even to them hast thou poured a drink offering, thou hast offered a meat offering. Should I receive comfort in these?
What Lurker had written in an earlier post.
A smooth stone from a stream is worn smooth from the flowing water so the flowing water of a river must also be a figure of a spiritual reality...... enter John Baptist. What was the spiritual reality of John's baptism in the River Jordan?
If you read the entire chapter of Isaiah 57 and then Matthew Ch 3 you will see some similar figures described in the same manner....like here.
Isaiah 57:2-3 (KJV) 2 He shall enter into peace: they shall rest in their beds, each one walking in his uprightness. 3 But draw near hither, ye sons of the sorceress, the seed of the adulterer and the whore.
Matthew 3:6 (KJV) 6 And were baptized of him in Jordan, confessing their sins. Matthew 3:7 (KJV) 7 But when he saw many of the Pharisees and Sadducees come to his baptism, he said unto them, O generation of vipers, who hath warned you to flee from the wrath to come?
J4J said"There is no evidence that Paul did not believe God of his own ability." Philippians 1:29 (KJV) 29 For unto you it is given in the behalf of Christ, not only to believe on him, but also to suffer for his sake;
Acts 9:15-16 (KJV) 15 But the Lord said unto him, Go thy way: for he is a chosen vessel unto me, to bear my name before the Gentiles, and kings, and the children of Israel:
J4J said"i think Paul was already a believer in God who had not yet heard the truth of the gospel."
1 Timothy 1:13 (KJV) 13 Who was before a blasphemer, and a persecutor, and injurious: but I obtained mercy, because I did it ignorantly in unbelief.
Need to take care of some things then lets revisit those smooth stones.
Mike wrote: Not getting into the pointless argument, but about Ps 24:1 "The earth is the LORD'S, and the fulness thereof; the world, and they that dwell therein." This is poetry. It's an example of parallelism, of the type that repeats similar ideas or thoughts with different words. The point is it all belongs to the Lord, and is expressed poetically. The world and the earth here are the essential same thing in different words.
You have described one of the aspects of the Ancient Hebrew language in which God first gave His Word to us.
Ancient Hebrew is a picture language that also has letters which create the sound of a word as well. English is a picture language too just like Hebrew in its technical application....thanks to divine intervention through the hands of William Tyndale.
"Hebrew was 1000 times easier to translate into English than European languages because its words formed pictures" W. Tyndale
Looking into how Tyndale created so many idioms in English to describe the word picture in Hebrew gives not only a newfound respect for the translator but also a validation of not using a strict literal interpretation.
Isaiah 49:8 (KJV) 8 Thus saith the LORD, In an acceptable time have I heard thee, and in a day of salvation have I helped thee: and I will preserve thee, and give thee for a covenant of the people, to establish the earth, to cause to inherit the desolate heritages;
Now I believe the earth was "literally" Established before the ink dried on the first scroll of Isaiah....yet God says he will use Paul to establish the earth. Follow the citations in the NT and you see how it is Paul.
John for JESUS wrote: 1) Wrong. Babylon is already destroyed. 2)God will be poring out His Fury, not Babylon which is already destroyed. 3)I believe God.
1)God says He is going to send Neb against His land. That is His wrath being poured out...Hence the destruction.
Jeremiah 25:9 9 Behold, I will send and take all the families of the north, saith the LORD, and Neb the king of Babylon, my servant, and will bring them against this land,
Shall be a desolation....
2)Fury Jeremiah 25:11 (KJV) 11 And this whole land shall be a desolation, and an astonishment; and these nations shall serve the king of Babylon seventy years.
It shall come to pass means it is going to happen. And it did.
3)If you believe God then you see that God has defined earth not as the planet as Babylon was not alone on the planet.
Jeremiah 25:29 (KJV) 29 For, lo, I begin to bring evil on the city which is called by my name, and should ye be utterly unpunished? Ye shall not be unpunished: for I will call for a sword upon all the inhabitants of the earth, saith the LORD of hosts.
This event which has taken place in Babylon in 586BC. Either... 1. The entire planet had the sword upon them.(PS We would not be here now) or 2. The city which is called
John for JESUS wrote: 1) The word that came to Jeremiah... Jeremiah 25:1â€
3) I think the literal interpretation still works.
4) In part, but then...
Jeremiah 25:1 (KJV) 1 The word that came to Jeremiah concerning all the people of Judah
Jeremiah only received the Word and the Prophet God Spoke through to tell all of what He was going to do.
Jeremiah 25:9 9 Behold, I will send and take all the families of the north, saith the LORD, and Neb the king of Babylon, my servant, and will bring them against this land, and against the inhabitants thereof, and against all these nations round about, and will utterly destroy them, and make them an astonishment, and an hissing, and perpetual desolations.
Neb, my servant. will utterly destroy them.
Jeremiah 25:15 15 For thus saith the LORD God of Israel unto me; Take the wine cup of this fury at my hand, and cause all the nations, to whom I send thee, to drink it.
the wine cup of fury is given to Neb, His servant(Neb) to destroy what He has assigned.
2)Look for a map that describes the Babylonian Empire in your bible. You will see that it does not encompass the entire planet. The Medain kingdom and the Lydian Kingdom existed when the Babylon Empire existed. India,
John for JESUS wrote: 1) No, but the list ends with "all the kingdoms of the world that are on the face of the earth." So that would include all kingdoms not mentioned specifically. Right? 2) Why not? 3) What do you suppose God's definition of all the inhabitants of the earth is? 4) This hasn't happened yet.
Let me start with 4) as you say this has not happened yet. Chapter 25 in Jeremiah is speaking of the Babylonian captivity. Read the book of Daniel as He says it happened.
1) Jeremiah 25:15 (KJV) 15 For thus saith the LORD God of Israel unto me; Take the wine cup of this fury at my hand, and cause all the nations, to whom I send thee, to drink it.
Who is the LORD God speaking to?
His servant Neb.
Jeremiah 25:9 (KJV) 9 Behold, I will send and take all the families of the north, saith the LORD, and Nebuchadrezzar the king of Babylon, my servant, and will bring them against this land, and against the inhabitants thereof, and against all these nations round about, and will utterly destroy them, and make them an astonishment, and an hissing, and perpetual desolations.
2)Did Neb conquer the entire planet?
3)Isaiah 66:1 1 Thus saith the LORD, The heaven is my throne, and the earth is my footstool
usage of the term "earth" here in Ch 25 is a very clear presentation that the term is referring to "not a physical earth".
In Verse 10...I will take from them......the voice of the bridegroom and the voice of the bride,.....the light of the candle = the gospel.
Verse 17 all the nations to whom the Lord sent me...verse18-26 is roll call of all of the physical inhabitants in which came into contact with the Jews.
Verse 26..... and all the kingdoms of the world that are on the face of the earth.
Are "all" literally known kingdoms on the planet per the writing of Jeremiah listed here? No.
Jer 25:29 For, lo, I begin to bring evil on the city which is called by my name, and should ye be utterly unpunished? Ye shall not be unpunished: for I will call for a sword upon all the inhabitants of the earth, saith the LORD of hosts.
Yet literally â€śallâ€ť should mean all on the planet? The literal interpretation doesnâ€™t work. God's definition does.
and then there is...
for I will call for a sword upon all the inhabitants of the earth, saith the LORD of hosts.
Jeremiah 31:1 1 At the same time, saith the LORD, will I be the God of all the families of Israel, and they shall be my people.
"All" the families of Israel.
Jeremiah 31:3 3 The LORD hath appeared of old unto me, saying, Yea, I have loved thee with an everlasting love: therefore with lovingkindness have I drawn thee.
Dont believe the Greek in the NT that the saints post here on SA? Here is the drawing by The LORD and the means by which He does it...with lovingkindness.
Jeremiah 31:7 7 For thus saith the LORD; Sing with gladness for Jacob, and shout among the chief of the nations: publish ye, praise ye, and say, O LORD, save thy people, the remnant of Israel.
Romans 9:6 6.... For they are not all Israel, which are of Israel:
Also see... Gladness for Jacob, The remanat of Israel......and a light for the Gentiles.
All 3 are below in this Prophecy.
Isaiah 49:6 6 And he said, It is a light thing that thou shouldest be my servant to raise up the tribes of Jacob, and to restore the preserved of Israel: I will also give thee for a light to the Gentiles....
Which is fulfilled here. Acts 13:46-47 46 Then Paul and Barnabas waxed bold, and said, It was necessary that the Word(Logos, John 1:1) of God should first have been spoken to you..OOS
Kev wrote: Yes James it is good he treads out the corn and he has led many to God I know. But some of the things he teaches about how one could take the mark of the beast and what not are not quite right and could be very damaging. Someone who has a specific way of interpreting the bible and is not lead by the Spirit you have to question their teaching abilities. I still like John MacArthur and would like to shake his hand but it still makes me wonder. I feel I have some understanding by the Grace of God but I am a new Christian and I know so little and I see this clear.
After re reading my post....I want to clarify that the example Paul used in 1 Cor.9:9 was a biblical example of the hermeneutic that demonstrates how God defines His own terms in His Word. Not a demonstration of what John Mac does with the literal hermeneutic. Poor wording on my part....sorry for any confusion.
Kev wrote: Thanks James like those verses. Kind of strange how JMac can't see this clear teaching so many verses on it so few letters
The literal hermeneutic. Tradition has taught such a thing as the thing to do. He is following His hermeneutic to the tee...which is the unfortunate presupposition that he was taught and is still taught....so he ends up in error. Give him credit on being consistent though.
Just see how Paul taught it here....
Deuteronomy 25:4 (KJV) 4 Thou shalt not muzzle the ox when he treadeth out the corn.
Now go to 1 Cor. 9:9 where Paul has a commentary on this verse.
A biblical example from Paul.
This occurs throughout Scripture and is the means by which God defines His own Words in HIs own Words.