John MacArthur wrote: So I say again, you can become moral, you can change, you know, you can turn over your life and have some kind of as it used to be called "moral rearmament," come through a crisis and decide you're going to turn away from living an immoral life or you're going to start to live a better life, a cleaner life, clean up your act, and that has no bearing on your relationship to God whatsoever. Listen, the biblical message is not that humanity is divided between the moral and the immoral, or that humanity is divided between the good and the bad, or that humanity is divided between the virtuous and the wicked. The message of the Bible is that ALL have sinned and come short of the glory of God, that there is no division, they're all immoral, bad and wicked. It's only a question of degree, or kind, or manifestation.
So you might get the idea that trying to moralize the country is some noble effort and I will admit a more moral society would make life easier in some ways. But how to get that, how to...how to bring that about? Not through politics, we are not a kingdom of politicians, we are a kingdom of priests. And what is a priest? He's a reconciler. We bring people to God through Christ.
he didn't sign on to help Hillary and merkel make the first world into third world, into slaves under the guise of global warming, of given a few corporations or money launderers sovereignty over nations.
he was elected to represent the people who elected him, that is the country of the USA and he did so here.
it would be better for us to make trade agreements with individual rights with representation of the people returned.
"1. You believe that God waits to see if men will believe, and then if they do, he elects them unto salvation. The reverse is true.
2. You believe that all men sin, without inheriting Adam's sinful nature. And so they die. The reverse is true. All inherit Adam's nature, because he is the head of the human race - he represented all of us. And we sinned in him. Therefore the moment we are conceived, we are guilty of our own sin, because we sinned in Adam. Therefore we are born spiritually dead, and we will die physically."
1. Far from it, God knows who will believe! Yes, God then elects believers to salvation.
2. Just flat out wrong on your part and contrary to Scripture! Reformers make that up out of thin air. The opposite is true.
The soul who sins shall die. The son shall not bear the guilt of the father, nor the father bear the guilt of the son. The righteousness of the righteous shall be upon himself, and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon himself. Ezekiel 18:20
John UK wrote: Numbers are never a test of whether or not a church is being blessed by God.
I agree fully with your comment and let me just add; neither is prosperity. I have always thought that the best form of worship was a house church. As we know that was the norm in the New Testament. In countries with extreme persecution, those types of churches are still the norm.
When I see or hear of a mega church, it sort of sets off an alarm. The message of Christ is one of repentance and a willingness to walk the often painful narrow road instead of the broad road. I often think of Hebrews chapter 11. Did our heavenly Father love those who He asked to give so much; of course He did. Hebrews 11:38 (Of whom the world was not worthy)they wandered in deserts, and in mountains, and in dens and caves of the earth.
This is the narrow road we must be â€świllingâ€ť to walk.
Luke 14:26, If any man come to me, and hate not his father, and mother, and wife, and children, and brethren, and sisters, yea, and his own life also, he cannot be my disciple.
27 And whosoever doth not bear his cross, and come after me, cannot be my disciple.
But the above are heart issues and the Lord knows our hearts.
It's curious how the proponents of age of accountability make different rules for people at different times in their life. While on the one hand they claim you must accept Christ in order to be saved, on the other hand they do a 180 degree turn &!say, but some don't need to do so, depending on their age. But how accepting Christ can be both a requirement for salvation, & yet n't be required for salvation in children, it's a mystery that they can't , coherently explain away. This is the disjointed nature of their teaching. If judgment is required for sin (& it's) then nothing short of judgment will do. & if newborns can't accept Christ, & yet are saved from their sins, then either accepting Christ is, a doctrine of men & was never a requirement for salvation' in the first place, or it's truly required & newborn babies are never saved. There is no other option.
But we can praise God that it was never a requirement, that God has the Sovereign right to have Mercy & compassion on children & anyone else, regardless of if they can't talk, or can't walk, or can't understand. Accepting Christ has nothing to do with it. For God doesn't ask children, He chooses them. Yes, God's law requires judgment for sin, & so babies who are saved have had their sins forgiven just as we do. N't by bei
John From ATL, your myths don't stand or line up with Scriptures, may the Lord give to you, spiritual eyes to see & to understand through His holy word amen.
Reference to Numbers 15:28; There is no sin in ignorance that is unaccountable. It must be atoned for just as any other sin no matter if it's in ignorance or not. Just as our legal system would say today, "ignorance of the law is no excuse." Likewise ignorance of God's law is no excuse. If we are regenerate through Christ being our high Priest,!who atones for all our sins, whether sins in ignorance or known sins. Those who claim that sins of ignorance in a baby are unaccountable, don't really understand the nature of sin, or God's law. It's curious how the proponents of age of accountability make different rules for people at different times in their life. While on the one hand they claim you must accept Christ in order to be saved, on the other hand they do a 180 degree turn and say, but some don't need to do so, depending on their age. But how accepting Christ can be both a requirement for salvation,& yet n't be required for salvation in children, it's a mystery that they can't, coherently explain away. This is the disjointed nature of their teaching. If judgment is required for sin then nothing short of judgment will
Oh and John, if you wish to read three possible effects of the Fall, with well constructed questions that come naturally to men, the following short article by RC Sproul is most helpful, who promotes the Federal Headship of Adam far better than I will ever be able to do. But then, he is a theological.
Need Him, Yes, quite so. Thank you. And the same applies to the Great Flood, when God slaughtered the entire world except eight adults. Men, women, children, babies, pregnant women, everyone; they all drowned in horrifying circumstances. But God was being perfectly just, all were sinners. Jer 17:9
John UK Wales amen, & amen to others on here proclaiming Biblical truths, in not being ashamed of the Biblical gospel, that restoration & reconciliation is through the 2 Adam alone, because of the 1 Adam amen.
Reference to Job 25:4, Only in Christ alone & not by being young, but by being chosen from the foundation of the world, born of God & justified in Christ alone. Because man is born of a Woman, & he has the stain of man's original sin, & he can't be made righteous apart from Christ alone.It's obvious n't just from this verse, but all verses, that children are sinful in the economy of a Holy God. In other verses God calls them liars & snakes. The Problem with some Christians & the unregenerate of the cults, insist on trying to make a God in their own image. Instead of receiving the God of the Bible in His own image. They expect God's ways to be their ways when God's ways are so far above theirs that we can't get a handle on it. & so they start formulating doctrines of their own, & assigning them to God. But these postulations of an age of accountability willn't stand the test of scripture.
The age of accountability is a myth, & embraced by emotionalism, that isn't centered on scripture or looking Biblically at the fall of mankind.
When God said in Gen 18:10, if their were righteous people in Sodom, He wouldn't destroy them, some professing Christians obviously think God was lying. Because they insist the children there had to be righteous in God's eyes because of non accountability. Not so they were burned in the city right along with the older people, God saved only His servant Lot & his two daughters whom 'He had chosen' to save. Clearly none of the rest were accounted righteous in God's sight. Did God say get the children out before I rain fire & brimstone, or did God bring out Lot & his house only? The truth is, over ninety-nine percent of the scriptures have to be either ignored, wrested, or tossed aside, in order to hold to the doctrine that children are somehow automatically accounted righteous, their sins not to be accounted of.
John for Jesus wrote: John UK... Of course there are consequences to Adam's sin. Death came through Adam and spread because all men sinned.
John, you now have two things back to front.
1. You believe that God waits to see if men will believe, and then if they do, he elects them unto salvation. The reverse is true.
2. You believe that all men sin, without inheriting Adam's sinful nature. And so they die. The reverse is true. All inherit Adam's nature, because he is the head of the human race - he represented all of us. And we sinned in him. Therefore the moment we are conceived, we are guilty of our own sin, because we sinned in Adam. Therefore we are born spiritually dead, and we will die physically. This is why:
Ephesians 2:1 KJV (1)Â And you hath he quickened, who were dead in trespasses and sins...
This means that Jesus can quicken whomever he wills, (because there are none that seek after God) and save them without asking their permission. He changes their will so it desires him and believes on him.
This is God's opportunity to save even babies if he so chooses. And he does, if they are elect.
Mike wrote: If the Dept of Labor has accused Google of underpaying women, they either have the evidence, thus need nothing from Google, or they don't have the evidence, and they made up the accusation. It isn't up to Google to prove an accusation against them is true. Burden of proof is still on the accuser.
Good point- with proviso SHOULD BE burden on accuser- The written laws seem to stil read that way but precedent allows a query-what is the meaning of IS??
Many could go to jail for failure to comply with compulsory education( assume kids not learning properly-or being fascistly SOCIALismized - assume not being perv Ed exposed will stunt the little darlins)
or for removing $5,000 out of your bank account (if convicted of structuring)- Finally being exposed that IRS charges are almost always wrong in this area , as a recent SA item showed- where do Kent & co. go to get 10 years of their life back- let alone millions of bucks. Government is well beyond its bounds- rein in a rainin' reign ?? a royal pain.
-- "politic worms are e'en at "PCUSA --- - Hamlet Not where he eats, but where he is eaten. A certain convocation of politic worms are e'en at him. Your worm is your only emperor for diet. We fat all creatures else to fat us, and we fat ourselves for maggots. Your fat king and your lean beggar is but variable serviceâ€”two dishes, but to one table. Thatâ€™s the end. CLAUDIUS Alas, alas! HAMLET A man may fish with the worm that hath eat of a king, and eat of the fish that hath fed of that worm. CLAUDIUS What dost you mean by this? HAMLET Nothing but to show you how a king may go a progress through the guts of a beggar. CLAUDIUS Where is Polonius? HAMLET In heaven. Send hither to see. If your messenger find him not there, seek him i' th' other place yourself. But if indeed you find him not within this month, you shall nose him as you go up the stairs into the lobby. -- Some PCUSA members left to go to heaven- the PCUSA leaders could send a messenger to count how many. If not found there , PCUSA leaders can seek the rest in the other place themselves.
"Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched" Mk 9:44,46,48 Scarey thot to them- scared of the diet of worms.
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Of course there are consequences to Adam's sin. Death came through Adam and spread because all men sinned. However, I don't consider a baby to be a man. We are able to die because of Adam's sin. That doesn't mean all babies or disabled are able to sin. Don't you think that takes a conscious decision? Or do you believe, contrary to Scripture, that we are guilty of Adam's sin. You said you didn't. So it is our sin that causes us to break down and die barring murder, penalties, disease, or accidents. We are judged for what we do and if someone is unable to know the good they ought to do, how can they be guilty of sin?
Connor7 wrote: I didn't know people could have a phobia towards Islam.
Ice slam aplomb In a sitcom Makes a pratfall time bomb A deceiver Balaam Drops a Lying depth bomb Not "fear of Islam" But very uncalm At those who'd embalm With a subtle Salam Peace of death their pogrom.
If the Dept of Labor has accused Google of underpaying women, they either have the evidence, thus need nothing from Google, or they don't have the evidence, and they made up the accusation. It isn't up to Google to prove an accusation against them is true. Burden of proof is still on the accuser.
Christopher000 wrote: We can't escape sin, so not a one of us can escape death. The view I offered is the reason I will never be convinced that newborns, toddlers, and among other scenarios, those under whatever God sees fit, on an individual basis, under the age of accountability will experience eternal suffering. I don't believe that anyone who just doesn't know any better can rightfully and justly be judged. I'm not claiming to know the mind of God, and this is just my own human reasoning.
Christopher, a faith in the biblical doctrine of election will help in these matters. Human reasoning often leads to humanism, which regards God as bad and mankind as good (in relation to the subject of predestination).
But God is always good, and mankind is always bad.
God will always be perfectly just, in all his dealings with men, women and children. Of this, we can be sure.
And we can also be sure that the "age of accountability" is a get-out false notion, with no biblical basis, to give our humanistic notions something to make God more palatable to our fallen nature. Submission to God produces peace in the heart about these things.
I won't waste anymore time on your twisted theology and your taking verses out of context to prove what you believe. You must be born again, without this new birth by God the Spirit you will do as you do....twist and not comprehend. Your surface knowledge is very dangerous.
I believe you are a minion of Satan sent here to draw the elect into endless hours of debate. Meanwhile, the world is perishing and time is wasted on someone who hasn't ears to hear. No more casting pearls before swine.
John for Jesus wrote: John UK... Yes, all souls who sin die. No, I believe a sinless person can die. Look at Jesus. People have mortal bodies, so an aborted child can suffer death by the hands of a murderer.
John, just as it is correct to say that all who sin die, so it is correct to say that all who die have sinned.
Adam and Eve would still be alive today if they had not sinned. In those days after the fall, humans lived to 500 years, 700 years, 900 years.
Death is the wage of sin, as scripture says. All disease and terminal illnesses are ultimately caused by sin. In other words, it is not natural to die. Death was unknown until sin came in.
In Adam all die.
If someone is born NOT in Adam, they will not die, no matter what you do to them. Unless of course they sin, and then they will die. This is all hypothetical, because all are born in Adam, having sinned in him.
The Saviour is the only exception, and he died because of sins also, not his own but mine. Penal substitution. My sins were imputed to him. His righteousness is imputed to me.
This is the Federal Headship of Adam and the Second Adam. Your head is one or the other.